How far is too far?

[Travis1984]

Yes.

 

[tipsntails7]

I was unaware that elk meat weighed differently then bear or deer.

Nope, but there's a hell of a lot more of it. Comments without experience are extremely helpful.

 

[Travis1984]

I've been part of many elk pack outs. Just not a solo one that distance.

I also train with over a 100 lbs over distance and elevation. I don't see the difference?

Enjoy your day, we've sidetracked this thread enough.

 

[Ross]

A lot of good discussion. In the end we owe it to the quarry to be 100% sure there will be no spoilage. For this scenario and from my 30+ yrs experience packing elk in similar country during the season we are discussing, the odds are very high that spoilage would occur if undertaken by one individual. I have no doubt some could kill themselves and get the meat out along with camp but I would not want to eat it. The right thing to do and common sense as noted is to have packers ready so you have no worries. Happy hunting.

 

[Mike7]

Travis,

To each his own, but my point was to be prepared for the worst with the 275 lbs.

Maybe that is from being in the medical field and in the military where having 2 things like sources of light is realy one, and having 1 is like none. I have only packed 2 elk out of the backcountry (with a buddy each time and both under 3 miles as the crow flies), but one weighed close to 275 and the other about 225 not including antlers, etc. Packing out an entire boned out deer with antlers, which is 1/3 of an elk's meat weight, in one trip with all of your gear, is a much easier endeavor.

 

[njdoxie]

Call game and fish, find out the outfitters working that area, call them and see if they're a possibility. ......you need at least 2 and preferably more packers on speed dial. And take into account how far you have to haul the meat yourself to where the horses can get to. Loving this thread.

 

[weaver]

IMO that's to far for archery elk.
Cold weather and a decent trail most of the way I'd consider it.

 

[squeekieslayer]

You don't have to make the round trip all at once. It's a lot easier to hopscotch the meat out over smaller distances. When you get to 5 miles or less, then start making round trips from your truck camp. That's what has worked for me on these longer packouts, but again the weather has to be cool enough for a multi-day packout in the first place.

ummm.... you do realize it is the exact same mileage right? Hopscotching 3 loads still has to move 3 loads 12 miles. Not to mention you add at least 20 minutes of unpacking and repacking you bag many extra times.

Best case scenario, 3 trips, nearly 100 pounds for 36 miles and empty pack for 24 miles. Comparing a bear with 2 people is ridiculous, half a deer 9 miles without camp... not even close.

You have never hunted 12 miles in for elk, "keeping people out of the basins I want to hunt" is silly. If that was true, and these 12 mile basins were so amazing, you would not be talking about the fact you have never packed an elk before.

I cannot even believe this is a debate.


Joe

 

[ndbwhunter]

We're talking about 12 miles of steep up and down in warm weather Travis. Quit has nothing to do with it. It's being realistic.

When I was younger I was in as good a shape as you can get. I'm not sure i'd have tried it back then.

The area that I'm going in to really isn't 12 miles of steep up and down. The country does get pretty rough toward the end, but a majority of the hike in is easy going with very little elevation gain. Most of the elevation gain comes in the last couple miles. And by that time I'll be in elk country already. The trail going in is well established and is a tourist/backpacking hotspot. Most of the people on the trail won't be there to hunt, and definitely won't be going back into the deep stuff during their day hikes.

 

[Jason Snyder]

Have you ever backpacked a bull out of the backcountry, especially at any real distance to be talking like you are? Get real please! Even at the minimal weight you are mentioning, if you divide that up into 3 loads of meat you're talking 75# a trip plus the weight of the pack. One round trip per day may be possible if the person is in way above average shape and the meat was able to be kept cold. That is very hard to do in normal September weather even at elevation in the back country if it's going to take 3 days to get it all out and on ice or refrigerated.

3 days in a row with 75 pounds, 15-20 miles round trip is entirely doable, at least from my perspective. If it's not for someone else that's fine. As Bar said, hunting should be fun.

Also, meat that is at 60 degrees internal temperature will keep for 3 days. Obviously one would need to be very cognisant of the weather forecast, but if I feel I can get the internal temp to 45-50 then I wouldn't worry about 3 days at all. Get it packed with ice immediately at town and you're golden.

All that said, there is a lot of good elk hunting that is only 3-5 miles from the truck.

 

[Jason Snyder]

ummm.... you do realize it is the exact same mileage right? Hopscotching 3 loads still has to move 3 loads 12 miles. Not to mention you add at least 20 minutes of unpacking and repacking you bag many extra times.


Joe

Yes, it's the same amount of distance. However, the end result is not the same. Think of an interval workout. Your max intensity work is the equivalent of packing meat, and the recovery is hiking w/o meat. Is it easier to do 5 mins of max intensity followed by 1 minute of rest, or 30 minutes of max intensity followed by 6 minutes of rest?

 

[Shrek]

Take a long weekend and drive over this spring and try it. Take five 10L dromedarys and hike into the heart of the area. Next morning get up before dawn and hike around for half the day and then fill the bladders and hike out. Dump the bladders and sleep at the truck for a couple hours and then hike back in and fill the bladders and hike back out and dump and immediately turn around and repeat. If you can get it done in a day and a half then go for it this fall.

 

[Bar]

The area that I'm going in to really isn't 12 miles of steep up and down. The country does get pretty rough toward the end, but a majority of the hike in is easy going with very little elevation gain. Most of the elevation gain comes in the last couple miles. And by that time I'll be in elk country already. The trail going in is well established and is a tourist/backpacking hotspot. Most of the people on the trail won't be there to hunt, and definitely won't be going back into the deep stuff during their day hikes.

I was going by those who hunt that area and posted about it. They said it was steep, and rough. I didn't know you've been there?

 

[Topgun 30-06]

I was going by those who hunt that area and posted about it. They said it was steep, and rough. I didn't know you've been there?

He stated right in the second sentence of his opening post that he's never set foot in the area and is only going by maps! For Jason, who quoted me about the 3 -4 trips over 3 days, I stated it was doable IF the weather was cold and that's what several others have mentioned. The temperature and keeping the meat edible is the big problem. As an Inspector for the Army Veterinary Corp for three years in the Viet Nam era and then 30+ years with the state of MI, I take great exception with your very uneducated comment that elk meat with an internal temperature of 60 degrees will keep for 3 days. That is far from the case and if it was then why did you follow it right up with a comment about 45-50 degrees?! You are so far off and then say put it on ice and it would be golden that the comments are absolutely laughable and should be edited out of your post because the meat would certainly at least be sour in that scenario if not completely spoiled by the time he got it on ice! Did that information come because you stayed at a Holiday Inn Express one night?

 

[Justin Crossley]

Let's keep this on topic guys.

Some good info here about what it takes to get meat out of the backcountry without spoiling. To the OP, take note when guys like Justin Davis and Ross talk about packing elk out. Both have packed a lot of elk out solo and know what it takes.

 

[Jason Snyder]

Topgun,

No, but I did got to the University of Wyoming and personally know Dr. Ray Field, who co authored the following article. You may be particularly interested the part about animals killed in warm weather.

http://www.theoutdoorlodge.com/features/articles/wild_game/aging_big_game.html

 

[Jason Snyder]

Also, keeping the internal temp at 60 or less does NOT mean it can't get warmer than that during the day. Just as it takes meat a while to cool, it also takes a while to warm up. If you use shade, wind, and evaporative cooling to your advantage you can deal with some pretty warm temperatures and come out just fine. Be conservative rather than foolish, as ultimately as the hunter you are responsible for salvaging the meat.

Daytime highs of 75 and nighttime lows of 35 do not concern me.

 

[Logan T]

The area that I'm going in to really isn't 12 miles of steep up and down. The country does get pretty rough toward the end, but a majority of the hike in is easy going with very little elevation gain. Most of the elevation gain comes in the last couple miles. And by that time I'll be in elk country already. The trail going in is well established and is a tourist/backpacking hotspot. Most of the people on the trail won't be there to hunt, and definitely won't be going back into the deep stuff during their day hikes.

Hey man, do your thing, whatever it may be. The only person that knows your ability is you. Talking about the hike in, the hunt, and the potential pack out is great and gets a guy pumped and ready for the season, but once you are in there -- "there" being anywhere, whether it be at this unit, or somewhere in colorado, 2 miles or 12 miles from the truck--- plans/ideas can and do change in a hurry. If you choose to do this, they will I promise! The only way to truly know how the whole scenario is going to play out is to go experience it.

That said, from experience in there, like I said earlier, it would be-- and still is for me-- a very difficult hunt whether you are solo or not. I personally know the outfitter, and his success rates are not high in that particular spot, for the sole reason that he can not find many people who want to work as hard as is usually required to find - let alone kill - something in there.

The hike in is not as easy as it sounds, or looks, even though it doesn't appear to be rough. The trail is definitely (mostly) visible, but once you get past where everyone and their brother and dog go to fish/camp/day hike, it changes fast. Still visible but maintenance falls off drastically. I can't say when it got opened up by the trail crews last year, but two years ago they did not get to it until middle august. I passed them on my way out. The year before that, they didn't get to it, and prior to that it was off and on. There will also be hikers a lot farther up there than you would think. Basically all I'm trying to say is it is not as easy as you may think it may be - speaking from experience. Then again for you it could be a cake walk. I know the last 3 outfitters who owned the camp in that area, and there is a reason they all took horses and mules in and never hiked. Old timers might be old now and we can out hike them and have all kinds of fancy awesome (and sometimes over rated) gear, but they are/were a lot smarter than we (I) are.

With all that said, I still hunt it - usually with a partner, but solo sometimes too. Not as often as I would like, because it kicks my butt every time and makes me wonder why I am there, every time. However, I know everybody who lives in that area, and if nobody is available to help me if I knock something down, I know I can always go home, grab horses and go get it myself, and have done that.

A smart man would no way in hell go in that far, in that unit hunting elk solo, on foot.... especially with all the other areas in the state (and nearby units) that have more elk and are easier to get around in.... that said, I've never claimed to be that smart man I'm talking about! But my circumstances are drastically different than yours and most, being from the area and the life I live.

Whatever you decide, good luck!

 

[Logan T]

One other thing to keep in mind.... Everyone here is concerned about the meat spoiling because the distance and heat, and rightly so.... however, I will say that if you are in there and the temps are low enough in september to not be as big of a concern as it is rightly assumed it may be here on the forum, it WILL be because it rained or snowed... and that my friend will almost certainly guarantee the elk will spoil if you are in that far, because the ground will turn and you will have a hard enough time walking out or in with an empty pack, because of the burn, and you will not be able to make any time at all with a heavy pack if that happens.

But you decide for yourself, that the fun of the whole hunt!

 

[Bar]

The OP should start to think about a different area that isn't so demanding.