Federal land and State animals

[Gobbler36]

Like it or not, if all NR opportunities disappeared tomorrow, every western state would still figure out their management. I would imagine most states would simply double or slightly more the cost of resident tags and move about their business. Yes, NR licenses foot a disproportionate amount of the bill compared to opportunity. Yet, demand continues to increase. The residents of western states continue to hold resources (game animals) that are in absurdly high demand for NR. I bet we could cut tags to NR by 50% and double NR tags and still sell them out, with less demand on the resource.....legislative session 2025.....

Preach!

 

[Scoot]

No state has a Game and Fish Commission in bed with the state’s guides and outfitters’ assosciation, any more than WY

I know you're right, Pirogue, but Montana is trying really hard to compete with them!

 

[Fordguy]

East to speak to hypotheticals, but until that day comes and there are 15 other new trucks in the area you hunt elk we’ll come back and let us know if you still feel that way because it’s a nice sentiment on the internet but until you’ve lived it its pie in the sky

I've never been able to hunt elk in either of the two states I've lived in for any significant length of time, even though both states have elk. If I had the opportunity to hunt them in my home state, I'd just be happy for the opportunity, competition or no.

 

[bluetick78]

Mostly agree besides one part
I would gladly pay Idaho 5x my current sportmans package if it meant me and my sons had more opportunities and less people that come to town for a week to pillage our resource. but yes this all is a sad reality

I agree on the 5x price hike, we are not in disagreement there. In fact, out of 20 of my coworkers who hunt regularly, all but one of them agreed that we'd be willing to pay $1500 annually for our sportsmans package if it meant seeing only resident plates at trailheads every fall.

 

[Rich M]

I agree on the 5x price hike, we are not in disagreement there. In fact, out of 20 of my coworkers who hunt regularly, all but one of them agreed that we'd be willing to pay $1500 annually for our sportsmans package if it meant seeing only resident plates at trailheads every fall.

And it continues.

You blame the NR for the laws and regulations your state has - and maybe has had for a long time...

And maybe you never hunted other states and have no plans to do so - ever.

NR gonna have to start being careful at the trailheads...

 

[wytx]

I don't. Michigan's elk haven't needed boosting. The herd is small, and they keep it that way deliberately. The elk in Michigan today are descended from some transplanted animals in the early 1900s. If I remember correctly there were fewer than 10 original animals. The elk herd is small today maintained on state lands, and occasionally on private. They issue a very limited number of tags each year. I know people who have applied every year since they were eligible, and others who started much later. I still don't know anyone who's drawn a Michigan elk tag.

Boosted was probably the wrong choice in words but those elk came from a Western state to get the herd started, humm....

 

[stanginthe11s]

what happens if an elk walks across the state boarder on federal lands? is it still a colorado elk or does it become a federal elk? what if the elk came from mexico or canada and has no papers?

 

[stanginthe11s]

wait, what thread am I in again?

 

[Mykolaivka887]

what happens if an elk walks across the state boarder on federal lands? is it still a colorado elk or does it become a federal elk? what if the elk came from mexico or canada and has no papers?

It's still a Colorado elk. I don't think the current Administration has made allowances for elk immigration from neighboring countries (lol).

 

[Fordguy]

Boosted was probably the wrong choice in words but those elk came from a Western state to get the herd started, humm....

Are you suggesting that the transplant of 7 western elk a century ago, (that all involved state and federal agencies approved) has something to do with the rights of nonresident hunters to hunt the descendents of those animals on land that they don't share ownership in?

 

[Gutshot007]

In wyoming 77% of fish and game dollars are provided by Non-residents 43.5 million of the 56.3 million . Probably more through other federal dollars . Fish and game are addicted to NR cash . If western states ever decide to severely limit Nr's numbers i think residents will be alittle surprised at the price of their tags . I would guess more than $1500 as discussed above for a "sportsmans" tag . Not sure about how much NR's foot the bill for colorado, montana, idaho etc ?

 

[wapitibob]

In wyoming 77% of fish and game dollars are provided by Non-residents 43.5 million of the 56.3 million . Probably more through other federal dollars . Fish and game are addicted to NR cash . If western states ever decide to severely limit Nr's numbers i think residents will be alittle surprised at the price of their tags . I would guess more than $1500 as discussed above for a "sportsmans" tag . Not sure about how much NR's foot the bill for colorado, montana, idaho etc ?

77% of LICENSE REVENUE comes from nr, total revenue is a bit over 50%.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

If western states ever decide to severely limit Nr's numbers i think residents will be alittle surprised at the price of their tags .

That's one of the arguments that the Deputy Director of Wildlife Conservation (Alaska) makes whenever the Board of Game is considering the elimination of nonresident hunting -- the loss of revenue and consequently, a legislative fix by implementing resident tag fees and/or license increase for residents. Residents of Alaska like their freebies and so, they tolerate nonresidents to some degree.

 

[Gutshot007]

License sales make up the largest percentage of the total at 64%. Federal aid 22%, grants 7%, other 7% in wy

 

[stanginthe11s]

It's still a Colorado elk. I don't think the current Administration has made allowances for elk immigration from neighboring countries (lol).

hmmm. OK so then I think if you're a CO res. you should be allowed to hunt a Colorado elk in all surrounding states but only on federal land and after you identified said elk as being a boarder crosser.
elk that cannot show documentation are open to NR on federal land who can show current year tax statements.
however, elk that were "boosted" lose the title of Colorado elk after the required residency period for the state.

of course, this does not address the elk with dual residency, elk seeking asylum or the ones that identify as a goat, but we'll get there.​

oh, forgot the NR funds debate lol. many years ago, Arizona had an influx of NR elk hunters, there was much fighting because of it and tags were limited. the catastrophic result of that is what is now called the Grand Canyon. there once was a bustling economy there with elk as far as one can see, but R's got there way and NR's caused a void that will never be filled. this for sure will happen in CO.

did I miss anything?

 

[bluetick78]

And it continues.

You blame the NR for the laws and regulations your state has - and maybe has had for a long time...

And maybe you never hunted other states and have no plans to do so - ever.

NR gonna have to start being careful at the trailheads...

I don't blame non-resident hunters for any of those things. The only thing I blame them for is being a factor in the ever-increasing over crowding issues.
I have hunted other states. Many times. Some 8 or 10 times...but you won't ever hear me whimper about that states attitude or laws regarding non-resident hunting. I figure when I hunt out of state, I'm a guest in someone else's home. I treat it as such, and if I'm not welcome to come back then so be it. I realize that the demand for western big game is increasing exponentially, and the supply of those animals certainly isn't increasing. If that means I can't hunt another state, I'm ok with that. The only reason NR's can still hunt Western states is because they will drop good money to do so. That will change in the near future.

 

[Gutshot007]

I get a kick out of we dont have enough elk to go around and the state of wyoming wants to shot them from helicopters and let them rot on the ground for coyote bait . "SUPERHERDS!" lol

 

[Swamp Fox]

East to speak to hypotheticals, but until that day comes and there are 15 other new trucks in the area you hunt elk we’ll come back and let us know if you still feel that way because it’s a nice sentiment on the internet but until you’ve lived it its pie in the sky

Play Federal games, win Federal prizes.

 

[Rich M]

That's one of the arguments that the Deputy Director of Wildlife Conservation (Alaska) makes whenever the Board of Game is considering the elimination of nonresident hunting -- the loss of revenue and consequently, a legislative fix by implementing resident tag fees and/or license increase for residents. Residents of Alaska like their freebies and so, they tolerate nonresidents to some degree.

This makes it sound like AK wants to eliminate NR - is that true? just asking.


This is where the bs starts:

WY has 130K hunters - they proposed 90/10 last year and just ended up increasing the special license fees to reduce NR hunters. I don't think it's over by a long shot. Res just need to get organized and decide who they want to target worse, the NR or the outfitters. It should be NR cause the outfitters are deeply imbedded.

CO has 300K hunters - they propose 75/25 and no more OTC. Not nearly as bad as the WY 90/10 proposal. But no more fallback elk hunting - either you plan it or you don't go. (maybe) (IMO, this isn't worth getting excited over but folks are)

Yet some folks are crying to ban ALL NR hunters. Why? Well, cuz the NR is the cause of all things bad. At least until they are gone, then it'll be someone else's fault. But for now the NR legally "steals" opportunity and game from the res hunter. Might just be me but the volume of folks saying this seems to have increased since last year.

I don't blame non-resident hunters for any of those things. The only thing I blame them for is being a factor in the ever-increasing over crowding issues.
I have hunted other states. Many times. Some 8 or 10 times...but you won't ever hear me whimper about that states attitude or laws regarding non-resident hunting. I figure when I hunt out of state, I'm a guest in someone else's home. I treat it as such, and if I'm not welcome to come back then so be it. I realize that the demand for western big game is increasing exponentially, and the supply of those animals certainly isn't increasing. If that means I can't hunt another state, I'm ok with that. The only reason NR's can still hunt Western states is because they will drop good money to do so. That will change in the near future.

i just dont think its right to exclude NR hunters.

 

[Mykolaivka887]

This makes it sound like AK wants to eliminate NR - is that true? just asking.

Yes if the United States government continues to have it their way in Alaska. Unless a future American president appoints a cabinet member who's friendly to conservation management and, that president is also conservation minded, the Dept of Interior is bent on eliminating or at best, severely restricting recreational hunting.