Binos vs Scope at low light?

[KenLee]

Then I'd say your watch is running a tad bit fast. I'm very well versed in high end riflescopes as well as NV and thermal as well as using them in no light and low light and what you're claiming is not possible. It's even pretty far fetched with a full moon but if you have excellent glass, excellent vision, and a dark blob is good enough for you to pull the trigger, then sure I could see it on a full moon night, but not last night.

I've sat and watched deer through binoculars 2 hours after sunset with a half moon. Our eyes and/or glass must be very different.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

I've never used a thermal or night vision.
Don't have a clue what a PVS-14 is.
Actually sitting out in low light conditions vs having background light makes a big difference in what you see.
Gaining 30 or more minutes through a good optic vs the naked eye is no big feat.

And this tidbit of info was not included when you spoke highly of the scope. Would that same scope still allow a person to clearly identify the target in the middle of nowhere 50 minutes after legal sunset?

Context matters.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

I've sat and watched deer through binoculars 2 hours after sunset with a half moon. Our eyes and/or glass must be very different.

Or different terrain.

 

[KenLee]

And this tidbit of info was not included when you spoke highly of the scope. Would that same scope still allow a person to clearly identify the target in the middle of nowhere 50 minutes after legal sunset?

Context matters.

Which tidbit?
I was out on a powerline hunting with no background light. I figured he was close to background light while "stargazing".
As I said in one of my posts, I watched the buck a couple minutes in binoculars before deciding to shoot him. No you aren't going to clearly count points that late with very little to no moon in just the scope. The binoculars show better. Of course, results vary depending on amount of moonlight.

 

[alabamahunt]

It was evident it was a deer and even evident it was a buck with at least 4pts just with my eyes. Pulled up my binos and could make out 6pts. It’s not like I was doing anything unsafe. I just wanted to know if it was normal to be able to see through binoculars better at last light vs a scope and where I should spend my money. It’s 30min after sunset here. I obviously wouldn’t ever pull the trigger on something that I wasnt 100% sure was an animal. Im thinking some good used 10 or 8 x 42 binoculars may be a better suit for my needs. Instead of throwing thousands at optics I just figured some here may be more experienced is why I asked.

 

[Blowdowner]

I love advising on this kind of “problem situation”. First of all, if she’s saying 2-3K your good to go up to 4.5K. You just might need to “earn” it somehow. When you get your new optics tell wifey you need her help - you’re going up the hill behind the bedroom window to conduct a low light function check and the “rack” you’ll be looking for should be a 2 pointer. The test is to see how late you can determine whether you’re looking at a mature spike with thick main beams or a cute little button buck. I can join you if necessary.

 

[Mojave]

I have a pair of 10x56 Zeiss binoculars that are exceptional at night. Same for a pair of Minox 8x56. All of my scopes are 56mm objective with 34mm main tubes. I get another 8-15 minutes beyond what you probably get.

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I would order a pair of DD Pirchler 8x56 if I was going to do something for less than $750
Or if the handbrake was in I'd get a pair of Swarovski, Blaser, Leica or Zeiss 8x56.

Leica also makes a laser rangefinding binoculars with 8x56 in the Geovid line.

Kowa and Maven also make a 8x56 if that is more budget friendly. Just not as much light transmission.

One side note is that if you are near sighted you will love the 8x56, as most of them have a ton of eye relief for glasses.

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If you don't need dials, there are a lot of lower priced 3-12x56 or 2.5-10x56 type scopes for less than $1500.

If you want the ultimate in long range and night vision you need something like with a bottom end magnification of 1.7, 2, 3 or tops 4 and an absolute top magnification high end of 20, but 12-18 is more normal. The most important part is the 56mm or larger objective lens.

 

[fwafwow]

There is nothing wrong whatsoever with pointing a rifle at something you know to be a deer to use the scope to discern details about it.

I used the word "avoiding" to try to not sound too judgy.

 

[redneckbmxer24]

It was evident it was a deer and even evident it was a buck with at least 4pts just with my eyes. Pulled up my binos and could make out 6pts. It’s not like I was doing anything unsafe. I just wanted to know if it was normal to be able to see through binoculars better at last light vs a scope and where I should spend my money. It’s 30min after sunset here. I obviously wouldn’t ever pull the trigger on something that I wasnt 100% sure was an animal. Im thinking some good used 10 or 8 x 42 binoculars may be a better suit for my needs. Instead of throwing thousands at optics I just figured some here may be more experienced is why I asked.

Sold - Leupold BX-4 8x42

Like new only used once in blind. Decided to keep 10x’s that I already have. $415 TYD

rokslide.com

$390 for a practically new pair of excellent Japanese made binos. I have two of those exact same models as well as EL's and the BX4's are 95% of the Swaros for 20% of the price. They blow diamondbacks out of the water. I have 10X42 Diamondback HD's as well (they're for sale on here).

 

[Fartrell Cluggins]

"Never point your gun at anything you don't intend to shoot" is literally the first rule of gun safety and covered in every hunter safety and basic firearm course. If you're looking at an animal through a scope to determine if you want to shoot it or not then you have broken this rule. There's a lot of irresponsible people in the woods though, look how many hunters have been shot by other hunters who thought they were a deer... They didn't think there was an issue pointing their gun at something they clearly thought was a game animal either.

I get the spirit of that "rule," but examining something you know to be a deer through the scope to determine if it is legal, is not what that rule is about. It is not a hard and fast rule. It is literally impossible to hunt without your muzzle pointing somewhere. Many states have rack point laws. In the southern woods, hunters will often only have a few seconds to evaluate. Almost none that I know take binos. They will see a deer. Use the scope to determine legality then flick the safety off and shoot if it is legal.

Those people that thought they saw a deer and shot did not know the object to be a deer before they pointed at it. They did not positively identify their target before pulling the trigger.

 

[dham6574]

Why can I see better at low light through my 10x42 diamond back binos but not through my 3.5-10x44 Meopta MeoPro? Is this normal to be able to see better with binoculars vs a scope at last 10min of light? Should I spend the money on the high end binos or scope for counting points?

I’ve had 3 encounters with a group of bucks right at last light that I could not make out how many points they had. (Must be 8pt or better) I’m debating or getting a new scope or binos. My wife said “it makes no sense for us to sit out here all day if we cant shoot something when it comes out just because you have some cheap POS scope and binoculars.” She hasn’t shot a buck yet and after the same situation 3 different sits she’s not happy about it and proceeded to tell me to go spend $2,000-$3,000 on a new scope and she didn’t care how far I had to go to get it lol. I don’t want to do so honestly… would it be worth it?

The binos have two lenses and will bring in more light than one scope, it also is easier since you're using both eyes together and so both sides of your brain

 

[TheGDog]

DO NOT be ID'ing your dang animal with your Rifle scope!!! You'll understand why not the moment somebody points there rifle AT YOU one day! Something you will NEVER EVER forget!!!

Pucker-factor = 1 x 10^99!!!

 

[LoveOverAll]

My Meopta 7X42 allows me to see a lot better late than a top quality 3.5 -10X50 riflescope at any power. In my experience, even cheaper binocs are better in low light than a scope. Isn't there more at work than just exit pupil?

 

[KenLee]

DO NOT be ID'ing your dang animal with your Rifle scope!!! You'll understand why not the moment somebody points there rifle AT YOU one day! Something you will NEVER EVER forget!!!

Pucker-factor = 1 x 10^99!!!

I grew up man driving deer and had plenty of experience with ex wives. Having a gun pointed at me isn't very traumatic anymore. Having said that, I pretty much live with binos if I'm hunting or scouting the last 10 yrs.

 

[Kurts86]

In the southern woods, hunters will often only have a few seconds to evaluate. Almost none that I know take binos. They will see a deer. Use the scope to determine legality then flick the safety off and shoot if it is legal.

People that don’t use binoculars in Eastern hunting scenarios are doing that because they haven’t been exposed to the advantages of using optics to cut through brush and likely haven’t seen quality glass used in the field rather than they missed a buck because they were using binoculars so they quit and went to a scope only. They are just hunting the way they were taught to and likely think its nuts people spend thousands of dollars on binoculars and scopes.

 

[Mojave]

People that don’t use binoculars in Eastern hunting scenarios are doing that because they haven’t been exposed to the advantages of using optics to cut through brush and likely haven’t seen quality glass used in the field rather than they missed a buck because they were using binoculars so they quit and went to a scope only. They are just hunting the way they were taught to and likely think its nuts people spend thousands of dollars on binoculars and scopes.

Yes, this!

I grew up hunting in Wyoming, never not had binoculars. They are how I hunt.

Spent 8 years in Europe hunting the European way. Tower blinds, driven hunts and stalking. That only reinforced using binoculars to hunt. Tower blinds, sitting in a driven hunt blind, or stalking.

I don't understand not using binoculars. It makes zero sense to me.

One of the most important hunting tools I ever learned is called the Jagdmeister zwei Schritte (Master hunter two step).

1. Take two steps

2. Glass

3. Take two steps

3. Glass

4. Take two steps

5. Glass

6. Wash, rinse repeat!

Works on whitetails, elk, mule deer, predators pretty much everything in heavy cover.

The second most important thing I ever learned was while sitting in a stand.

1. Sit down, bring a comfortable thing to sit on, water and turn your mobile phone on vibrate.
2. Glass

Then repeat!

Your ability to find a flicker of an ear, or movement will increase your ability to kill bucks.

Binoculars may not be the thing that kills game, but the allow for the killing of tons of game.

 

[fwafwow]

People that don’t use binoculars in Eastern hunting scenarios are doing that because they haven’t been exposed to the advantages of using optics to cut through brush and likely haven’t seen quality glass used in the field rather than they missed a buck because they were using binoculars so they quit and went to a scope only. They are just hunting the way they were taught to and likely think its nuts people spend thousands of dollars on binoculars and scopes.

Same answer for archery?

 

[KoolBreeze]

I’ve also got a Meopro 3.5-10x44. My Maven C1 8x42s are brighter than the Meopro. I missed an opportunity at a decent buck last year that I could see in the C1s but couldn’t find it in the Meopro.

I just recently replaced the Meopro with a VX5-HD 3-15x44 and it’s brighter than both the Meopro and the C1s.

What ranges are hunting at? I’m usually in the timber so I don’t need much magnification and the 44m objective works fine for me. You might want to go bigger if you hunting out in the open though so you can dial up the magnification at longer ranges to make out the details on racks.

If money is no object, my research leads me to believe something like the S&B Polar T96 is going to be up near the top for a low light scope.

 

[Kurts86]

Same answer for archery?

The answer doesn’t change for me with archery or turkeys. The value of being able to focus on different distances in thick cover doesn’t change. I feel naked in the woods without binoculars.

 

[ROCOTILLO]

following the good info