Arrow weight

[Pheasanthnter1]

I agree with others that having a high FOC is not the most important part of building a hunting arrow. I don't think you need a single bevel fixed blade broadhead to kill an elk either.

That being said, both certainly help with arrow flight and penetration.


I personally like to have a arrow in the 10-15% FOC and I carry fixed and mechanical broadheads in my quiver.

I've been bowhunting for a long time, and nothing is more important than going out and shooting your bow and becoming proficient with it.


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[CentennialState]

Short answer: the importance of FOC has been greatly exaggerated by many archery "influencers"...build for your desired total arrow weight and let FOC fall where it may.

Longer answer: you're shooting a long, dense (10.7 gpi) shaft, which limits your ability to achieve high FOC while keeping TAW reasonable. If you really want to boost FOC, shorten your arrow (if you can), switch to an unlighted nock, and/or switch to a lower gpi shaft. Or, as I alluded to above, ignore FOC altogether and just go shoot what you have.

Really appreciate your insight and time; I’ve started to realize with those specific arrows there’s no way I’m going to get ~15% FOC without building an extremely heavy arrow, and while I like tinkering with the easily changeable parts of the arrow I just haven’t seen any discernible difference with the arrows at 530g v 500g or the ones with 13% FOC V 10% FOC to justify going and buying a couple hundred dollars of different shafts…unless FOC actually is extremely important and I’m just not nuanced enough to see the difference. All that to say, appreciate it!

 

[CentennialState]

Foc really is overrated

Thanks for the reply; glad to hear multiple voices with the same thoughts/experience

 

[CentennialState]

I agree with others that having a high FOC is not the most important part of building a hunting arrow. I don't think you need a single bevel fixed blade broadhead to kill an elk either.

That being said, both certainly help with arrow flight and penetration.


I personally like to have a arrow in the 10-15% FOC and I carry fixed and mechanical broadheads in my quiver.

I've been bowhunting for a long time, and nothing is more important than going out and shooting your bow and becoming proficient with it.


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Within the range you mentioned (10-15% FOC) have you experienced any noticeable difference with arrow flight? And in regards to penetration, are you saying the single bevel is of more importance or the arrows FOC %?

 

[RuggedYogi]

While 480 grains is definitely plenty for elk, tinkering to find the best setup for your bow is rewarding.

Do you have any 125 grain field points or broadheads you can experiment with? I would personally shoot both at 50 or 60 yards and go with whichever setup grouped better.

 

[Pheasanthnter1]

Within the range you mentioned (10-15% FOC) have you experienced any noticeable difference with arrow flight? And in regards to penetration, are you saying the single bevel is of more importance or the arrows FOC %?

Within the range, I have not. It is only a preference of mine to be closer to the 15% than the 10% if I could reasonably accomplish it. I personally will not hunt with an arrow with less than 10%.My interpretation of FOC is that it is more closely related to penetration than arrow flight. There are some interesting dr.ashby(spelling?) Videos that you could check out.


The broadhead inclusion was simply to suggest that they are both equal parts of what makes a hunting arrow effective. A perfectly built arrow with a broadhead that will fall apart on impact makes the arrows' ability to drive worthless.

Hope this helps...

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[CentennialState]

While 480 grains is definitely plenty for elk, tinkering to find the best setup for your bow is rewarding.

Do you have any 125 grain field points or broadheads you can experiment with? I would personally shoot both at 50 or 60 yards and go with whichever setup grouped better.

That’s been part of my confusion is I’ll switch out 100 and 125g heads and shoot multiple groups with each, and don’t see any significant difference, even though I’ve changed the arrow weight and the FOC. I was hoping (?) there would be a noticeable difference in the flight and grouping to make it a no brainer but I have yet to see it and figured I was doing something wrong

 

[CentennialState]

Within the range, I have not. It is only a preference of mine to be closer to the 15% than the 10% if I could reasonably accomplish it. I personally will not hunt with an arrow with less than 10%.My interpretation of FOC is that it is more closely related to penetration than arrow flight. There are some interesting dr.ashby(spelling?) Videos that you could check out.


The broadhead inclusion was simply to suggest that they are both equal parts of what makes a hunting arrow effective. A perfectly built arrow with a broadhead that will fall apart on impact makes the arrows' ability to drive worthless.

Hope this helps...

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Incredibly helpful, thanks for steering me in the right direction

 

[RuggedYogi]

That’s been part of my confusion is I’ll switch out 100 and 125g heads and shoot multiple groups with each, and don’t see any significant difference, even though I’ve changed the arrow weight and the FOC. I was hoping (?) there would be a noticeable difference in the flight and grouping to make it a no brainer but I have yet to see it and figured I was doing something wrong

Do you have a bare shaft you can shoot? If you shoot a group of two fletched arrows from around 30 yards and then shoot a bare shaft from the same distance that would give you an idea of which was a better setup for your bow (which group the bare shaft is closer to the fletched arrows).

Make sure the target is big enough, though.

 

[Pheasanthnter1]

Do you have a bare shaft you can shoot? If you shoot a group of two fletched arrows from around 30 yards and then shoot a bare shaft from the same distance that would give you an idea of which was a better setup for your bow (which group the bare shaft is closer to the fletched arrows).

Make sure the target is big enough, though.

I like and have used bareshaft tuning. I have found, though, that I can change the outcome of the arrow flight by changing my grip. I now use it to check myself. If I'm being lazy with my form, I get erratic arrow flight. It's amazing what the feltchings can hide.


Also, if you try this, I would start at 10' then move back once you see the outcome.

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[Mighty Mouse]

That’s been part of my confusion is I’ll switch out 100 and 125g heads and shoot multiple groups with each, and don’t see any significant difference, even though I’ve changed the arrow weight and the FOC. I was hoping (?) there would be a noticeable difference in the flight and grouping to make it a no brainer but I have yet to see it and figured I was doing something wrong

With a 500+ gr arrow, 25 gr is a pretty minor change to TAW and FOC. If you shoot far enough, you'll eventually see a vertical difference in point of impact between a 100 and 125 gr head, but I wouldn't expect one to group markedly better than the other. By all means, tinker and experiment to your heart's content, but don't expect to find some TAW/FOC "sweet spot" where you suddenly start Robin Hood-ing every shot.

Since his name has been brought up, I would caution you to take the recommendations of the Ashby crowd (ABF, Ranch Fairy, et al) with a grain of salt. There is some good information in Ed Ashby's reports, but too many bowhunters read his stuff and come away convinced that they need a 650 gr arrow with 19% FOC to hunt elk (which is a bad idea IMO for most compound hunters).

 

[Beendare]

That’s been part of my confusion is I’ll switch out 100 and 125g heads and shoot multiple groups with each, and don’t see any significant difference, even though I’ve changed the arrow weight and the FOC. I was hoping (?) there would be a noticeable difference in the flight and grouping to make it a no brainer but I have yet to see it and figured I was doing something wrong

The other experienced guys like Mighty Mouse are giving you good advice. You build for good arrow flight- period..... and don't worry about FOC. As two famous Olympians say, FOC stands for Effing Over Complicated.

There isn't a single top archer in any Archery discipline that uses very high FOC.....that should tell you something. The silly internet hacks preaching this stuff say, "But those are target guys"

Ugh, yeah...guys that know their stuff.........and if anything, perfect arrow flight is even more critical with BH's so its one of the stupidest rebuttals on the planet.

You can get good arrow flight with std components.

One of the worst things you can do is be under spined....over spined still tunes but under spined with Broadheads is a common reason guys can't get their hunting arrows to tune.

 

[CentennialState]

Do you have a bare shaft you can shoot? If you shoot a group of two fletched arrows from around 30 yards and then shoot a bare shaft from the same distance that would give you an idea of which was a better setup for your bow (which group the bare shaft is closer to the fletched arrows).

Make sure the target is big enough, though.

Do you have a bare shaft you can shoot? If you shoot a group of two fletched arrows from around 30 yards and then shoot a bare shaft from the same distance that would give you an idea of which was a better setup for your bow (which group the bare shaft is closer to the fletched arrows).

Make sure the target is big enough, though.

I’ll do that! Thanks for the tip (and for explaining how to do it/what to look for). Really appreciate it

 

[CentennialState]

I like and have used bareshaft tuning. I have found, though, that I can change the outcome of the arrow flight by changing my grip. I now use it to check myself. If I'm being lazy with my form, I get erratic arrow flight. It's amazing what the feltchings can hide.


Also, if you try this, I would start at 10' then move back once you see the outcome.

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I like the starting at 10’, not interested in pulling arrows out of nearby trees

 

[CentennialState]

With a 500+ gr arrow, 25 gr is a pretty minor change to TAW and FOC. If you shoot far enough, you'll eventually see a vertical difference in point of impact between a 100 and 125 gr head, but I wouldn't expect one to group markedly better than the other. By all means, tinker and experiment to your heart's content, but don't expect to find some TAW/FOC "sweet spot" where you suddenly start Robin Hood-ing every shot.

Since his name has been brought up, I would caution you to take the recommendations of the Ashby crowd (ABF, Ranch Fairy, et al) with a grain of salt. There is some good information in Ed Ashby's reports, but too many bowhunters read his stuff and come away convinced that they need a 650 gr arrow with 19% FOC to hunt elk (which is a bad idea IMO for most compound hunters).

Really appreciate your expertise and taking the time to reply. Truly, very appreciative. Also helpful to know what to expect from guys much farther down the road than me

 

[CentennialState]

The other experienced guys like Mighty Mouse are giving you good advice. You build for good arrow flight- period..... and don't worry about FOC. As two famous Olympians say, FOC stands for Effing Over Complicated.

There isn't a single top archer in any Archery discipline that uses very high FOC.....that should tell you something. The silly internet hacks preaching this stuff say, "But those are target guys"

Ugh, yeah...guys that know their stuff.........and if anything, perfect arrow flight is even more critical with BH's so its one of the stupidest rebuttals on the planet.

You can get good arrow flight with std components.

One of the worst things you can do is be under spined....over spined still tunes but under spined with Broadheads is a common reason guys can't get their hunting arrows to tune

The other experienced guys like Mighty Mouse are giving you good advice. You build for good arrow flight- period..... and don't worry about FOC. As two famous Olympians say, FOC stands for Effing Over Complicated.

There isn't a single top archer in any Archery discipline that uses very high FOC.....that should tell you something. The silly internet hacks preaching this stuff say, "But those are target guys"

Ugh, yeah...guys that know their stuff.........and if anything, perfect arrow flight is even more critical with BH's so its one of the stupidest rebuttals on the planet.

You can get good arrow flight with std components.

One of the worst things you can do is be under spined....over spined still tunes but under spined with Broadheads is a common reason guys can't get their hunting arrows to tune.

Appreciate the reply and insight! And very helpful reminder on spine. It’s odd, for my DL and Weight (Mathews vxr 31.5 at 30” and 70#), Easton says 250-300. I currently have 300s. Any reason to go stiffer?

 

[Beendare]

Appreciate the reply and insight! And very helpful reminder on spine. It’s odd, for my DL and Weight (Mathews vxr 31.5 at 30” and 70#), Easton says 250-300. I currently have 300s. Any reason to go stiffer?

I will let the guys with software chime in to see if you are getting close to underspined.

FWIW, in my compound I shot overspined for decades and shafts of 10gpi or more....tunes well and makes for a tougher hunt arrow.

 

[CentennialState]

I will let the guys with software chime in to see if you are getting close to underspined.

FWIW, in my compound I shot overspined for decades and shafts of 10gpi or more....tunes well and makes for a tougher hunt arrow.

super helpful to know, appreciate it

 

[holmesac89]

What is everyone's favorite "light" arrow? I'm jealous of so many guys shooting arrows in the 400s. I'm at 549 grains and would love to get down closer to 480-500. I'd like a hair faster arrow for when I'm hunting whitetails rather than elk or mule deer. It's tough with a 30" draw and shooting 70 lbs. Have been shooting the Easton Axis for several years now and they've been so durable and reliable I've been hesitant to switch things up. I do run IW collars and their 50 grain insert but my FOC is still only around 11%.

 

[Mighty Mouse]

What is everyone's favorite "light" arrow? I'm jealous of so many guys shooting arrows in the 400s. I'm at 549 grains and would love to get down closer to 480-500. I'd like a hair faster arrow for when I'm hunting whitetails rather than elk or mule deer. It's tough with a 30" draw and shooting 70 lbs. Have been shooting the Easton Axis for several years now and they've been so durable and reliable I've been hesitant to switch things up. I do run IW collars and their 50 grain insert but my FOC is still only around 11%.

A 9-10 gpi shaft cut at 30" with 150 gr on the front and 30 gr on the back would put you at 450-480 gr TAW. You could probably cut down to ≈28" if you wanted to further reduce weight. There are plenty of good 300 spine shaft options around 9-10 gpi. I'm generally a proponent of standard diameter (.245"/6.5mm) shafts because of their affordability and simplicity of components.