Arizona votes to ban trail cameras

[DMack]

Nice.

Why?

 

[DMack]

I’m inclined to agree as far as public land goes.

Live cellular game cams have been illegal in AZ for several years.

Honestly this doesn't upset me. I always thought it was cheating when somebody gets a text from their camera real time of an animal.

 

[DMack]

I'm an avid AZ hunter and personally enjoy setting up and retrieving game cameras throughout the year, not just hunting season, and I do it in remote areas that 99% of hunters would never get to on foot. I enjoy retrieving the cameras and bringing home the videos to my kids and getting to see beautiful wildlife up close and in person in their natural habitat. That said, comments that equate a trail camera to the owner being lazy or somehow having an unfair advantage to me are short sighted at best and honestly plain ignorant. AZ does not allow for live cellular cameras, so how does it violate the principles of fair chase if you have to manually place a camera and then retrieve the video and any animal on the camera is long gone. Chances are there is already sign where the camera was placed so the hunter that is putting in the work to scout and place a camera is already doing more work than the guy that just shows up opening day and starts walking around. Most of the comments here against trail cams are based on opinion and speculation. If you don't want to put in the work to run trail cameras fine, but why whine about the guy that does? That's like getting mad at your neighbor for being in shape because you never want to work out. I guess all those lazy hunters running trail cams ruined your chances at shooting a trophy from the road in your side by side.

 

[DMack]

HA! No negative side unless you're invested.

I love that they banned them and hope they get banned from all public land: FS, BLM and State across the US. I don't care what people do on private land, non of my

I ve been advocating for a camera ban on public land since they started showing up in AZ with corn feeders attached 20 years ago. And I am in my mid 40s

Here is my simple minded approach, your scent,noise and visibility are not left with a surveillance device lagged to a tree.

Some hunters will and will not take a trophy they have a trail camera pic of. You throw money in the mix and a pile of glassers odds are increased with that photo. It's public land, you shouldn't beable to leave trash hanging on trees, fence post,ect..

They are not taking away your ability to hunt, might have to buy a little more gas and boots

I'm torn on this. I personally only have 4 cams and rarely have them all out. I've also never killed anything I got on camera. I do really enjoy putting them out and seeing what comes along. My is that although I can technically still run cams can I be penalized for running them in a unit I hunt even if I don't kill an animal I get a pic of.

Also every spring I see multiple outfitters posting on social media literal pallets of new cams they're putting out. It's not unreasonable to expect with enough cams in an area that you could triangulate a certain animal's core area. To me that crosses the line of fair chase.

I definitely think all the average Joe hunters got lumped in with some bad apples on the commercial side and now we all pay the price

 

[Fatcamp]

Why?

Because I absolutely hate those things. Sick and tired of having my picture taken not to mention my dogs and kids. My favorite place is littered with them and treestands, many of which are not removed properly. Just trash in the forest as far as I am concerned.

 

[coues32]

I'm an avid AZ hunter and personally enjoy setting up and retrieving game cameras throughout the year, not just hunting season, and I do it in remote areas that 99% of hunters would never get to on foot. I enjoy retrieving the cameras and bringing home the videos to my kids and getting to see beautiful wildlife up close and in person in their natural habitat. That said, comments that equate a trail camera to the owner being lazy or somehow having an unfair advantage to me are short sighted at best and honestly plain ignorant. AZ does not allow for live cellular cameras, so how does it violate the principles of fair chase if you have to manually place a camera and then retrieve the video and any animal on the camera is long gone. Chances are there is already sign where the camera was placed so the hunter that is putting in the work to scout and place a camera is already doing more work than the guy that just shows up opening day and starts walking around. Most of the comments here against trail cams are based on opinion and speculation. If you don't want to put in the work to run trail cameras fine, but why whine about the guy that does? That's like getting mad at your neighbor for being in shape because you never want to work out. I guess all those lazy hunters running trail cams ruined your chances at shooting a trophy from the road in your

I'm an avid AZ hunter and personally enjoy setting up and retrieving game cameras throughout the year, not just hunting season, and I do it in remote areas that 99% of hunters would never get to on foot. I enjoy retrieving the cameras and bringing home the videos to my kids and getting to see beautiful wildlife up close and in person in their natural habitat. That said, comments that equate a trail camera to the owner being lazy or somehow having an unfair advantage to me are short sighted at best and honestly plain ignorant. AZ does not allow for live cellular cameras, so how does it violate the principles of fair chase if you have to manually place a camera and then retrieve the video and any animal on the camera is long gone. Chances are there is already sign where the camera was placed so the hunter that is putting in the work to scout and place a camera is already doing more work than the guy that just shows up opening day and starts walking around. Most of the comments here against trail cams are based on opinion and speculation. If you don't want to put in the work to run trail cameras fine, but why whine about the guy that does? That's like getting mad at your neighbor for being in shape because you never want to work out. I guess all those lazy hunters running trail cams ruined your chances at shooting a trophy from the road in your side by side.

I'm all for running trail cameras on private land. Do you know how a deer gets big,besides looking at your surveillance pics?

And yes I'm hoping my road hunting can now turn up a trophy every year.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Because I absolutely hate those things. Sick and tired of having my picture taken not to mention my dogs and kids. My favorite place is littered with them and treestands, many of which are not removed properly. Just trash in the forest as far as I am concerned.

Do you express the same outrage when you are being videoed and having photos taken of you in other public places?

How much trash, literal and perceived, have you cleaned up while out in your favorite place? Kudos if you actually do clean up after others to the best of your abilities.

 

[Sled]

Do you express the same outrage when you are being videoed and having photos taken of you in other public places?

it depends:

 

[Muleyczy]

I’m all for banning cameras. It’s gotten ridiculous

 

[ColoradoV]

Good to Az for the change..

Hope surrounding states follow suit…

 

[HuntHarder]

Like I have mentioned before. The best way to eliminate all this banter about how this law will be enforced is to get the land agencies on board. The other way is to drop the hammer on the guides or hunters that continue to use trail cameras for hunting purposes. I can not wait for the first few cases to make the headlines. Hopefully it's one of the abusers that have 1000's of cameras in our northern units.

Realistically, 80% of the state is being punished for a problem that is fairly concentrated. I am ok with that because it is just a matter of time before the problem gets worse in other areas.
All the vocal guys against the ban, talk about them taking our rights away and they are not ok with that.

The problem is, these same guys were silent when AZGFD banned baiting, thermal imaging, cellular trail cameras, regulating drones like aircraft. They only care about "our" rights when it will negatively affect them.

The most vocal guide against the ban, is probably the best thing for the guys that are for the ban. His arguments are pathetic at best, filled with way to much emotion and no facts. Thank god he is the loudest one, it ensures the ban will remain in place thru his pathetic and embarrassing lawsuit challenge.

 

[SummitsCalling]

Unfortunately the normal joe who has a few cameras up gets caught up in this. The bigger outfitters run 500-1k+ cameras, then shop around the deer in the pictures. It's a well known problem. Cameras are significantly more effective than placing someone on a mountain, or having 2-3 dozen helpers targeting a deer.

Ban is a good thing, it's gone too far.

 

[slamdmini]

im on the fence on this one. i do run cameras and i really enjoy going through the pics and finding big animals, many of which ive never seen in person. but i am against cell cams.

 

[BBob]

500 cameras sound like a lot but depending on the unit it is not that much. Unit 10 is 1.5 million acres; half of which is the Big Bo (private). That equates to 1 camera every 2 square miles which is nothing. That's a couple of square blocks worth of cameras in town in comparison.

I do not blame any outfitter, guide or hunter in AZ if they wanted to seek some type of injunctive relief (at least for the short term). The 2021-2022 hunting regulations have already been published. No trail camera ban is in them (excluding cellular/live action and on wildlife refuges). Kind of late to change the rules since the current game is still being played. Game and Fish should have made it go into effect AFTER the current regulations expire.

Cameras haven’t been allowed on the Big B for awhile so camera density in the rest of the unit might be higher.

 

[BBob]

Crazy where u see salt and cameras in the wilderness but they are not effective....

Salt and cameras are not effective? Am I reading this right? Is there some reason it works elsewhere but it doesn’t in the wilderness? I’ve never used salt ever with or without cameras but those I know that do it are quite effective with the combination. Some that do it draw a line at actually hunting the salt but have no qualms with using the salt with a camera and they do capture big bucks at the salt.

 

[AZ_Hunter_2000]

Cameras haven’t been allowed on the Big B for awhile so camera density in the rest of the unit might be higher.

I expressly addressed that by excluding the Big Bo in the calculation.

 

[BBob]

I expressly addressed that by excluding the Big Bo in the calculation.

Gotcha, thought you might have but wasn’t sure on how it was worded.

 

[Fordguy]

It's public property- if everyone who hunted it put out as many cameras as some of the guides or insta-hunters do- well, just imagine how ridiculous that would be. Just because you can doesn't mean you should. Overuse of anything is abuse. Some folks abuse the privilege fpr the sake of their own personal gain and ruin it for everyone who uses cameras in moderation. At this point I'm more of a leave no trace when possible kind of guy. To me, that means packing everything in with me, and packing it out when I leave- stands, blinds, etc. Why should anyone get to leave anything on public property while they are not physically present? This is just the view that I've adopted. Im sure it's not popular, but then, I've never aspired to win any popularity contests. In order to support increasing hunting pressure, game animals are going to need more advantages- if this means that it becomes more labor intensive for us as hunters to learn the habits and preferences of our quarry, frankly I'm all for it.

 

[coues32]

Salt and cameras are not effective? Am I reading this right? Is there some reason it works elsewhere but it doesn’t in the wilderness? I’ve never used salt ever with or without cameras but those I know that do it are quite effective with the combination. Some that do it draw a line at actually hunting the salt but have no qualms with using the salt with a camera and they do capture big bucks at the salt.

I was being sarcastic, to see someone pack salt and cameras 5 miles in the wilderness. And then hear cameras don't effect how And where people hunt is funny

 

[robby denning]

There are always two sides, but the tanks are getting loaded with Camera's. Once people start putting out large numbers of them, it takes away from the challenge. I also think less odds of success means more tags issued....

my opinion and opinion only is that we won't see a decrease in success rates. Might see less old bucks and bulls die, but I'd personally be surprised if success dropped significantly. In my circles down there, cams helped target certain animals, not just find animals. We'll see.