Arizona Game and Fish - Pays Influencers - Newberg cancels contract after backlash

[tdhanses]

Like I said in my post before, this is a small part of the problem. As for them advertising to NR, as of right now the way AZ structures their OTC, there is no need to advertise as the 20% of total harvest is being hit by bowhunters in lots of units, hence closing them off. What needs to happen and what will probably end up happening is OTC will be a thing of the past. I think it might be a little before that hits, but it will hit at the rate we are going. Closing 15 hunts in Dec, just puts more pressure on the hunt units that did not close.

I doubt since some units are closed, that less guys will be in the field. What will happen is, those guys will just move to the next unit that remains open. Then in a year or 2, that unit will hit the 20% harvest threshold and it too will close. Limiting NR OTC is the most logical next step. AZGD limits draw hunts to 10%, I see no reason not to limit OTC as well. I hunt in plenty of other states and feel the residents of those states should get priority.

I’m not really arguing just saying welcome to the world of tech, it opens up so much to everyone.

To me it’s not necessarily a R vs NR thing but that hunting is just popular, I’m sure there are many more R hunters today then there were 20 years ago as well. Hunting is popular and people are willing to travel, personally I give little credit to influencers and more to tech as to why hunting has become popular.

As was said above, every step to get in the game is easier today.

 

[wapitibob]

Looks like the residents are the ones who started buying all the otc tags.

 

[willfrye027]

Classic scapegoating. pathetic and whiny. Like buzz has said, cats out of the bag with western hunting and it wasnt the “influencers”..

 

[coues craze]

Not going to happen, technology of all sorts isn't going back in the bottle.

This board and others like it are just, if not more, responsible for the huge demand for tags in the West as well as OTC opportunities.

To blame where people get their information on ONE guy or ONE department is all BS. Lots of other things make hunting easier.

Wasn't that long ago, I was applying for NV, MT, WY, CO, NM, AZ with a paper application, because that's all there was. You had to put a lot of effort into staying on mailing lists, fronting the entire tag fees, researching through phone calls to departments and other people you knew.

Now, its fire up the computer, no fronting money, every application is an online form, research can be had with a google search, you don't have know a single person to find all the information you want.

That's the ease of just drawing a tag.

Once that's done you have archery gear that allows you to shoot 80-90-100 yards, rifles that make a 4-5-6 hundred yard shot pretty darn easy. You have GPS, google earth, ATV's, UTV's spotting scopes that allow you to see the size of an animal at 2-3-4 miles. Light weight hunting clothing, packs, tents, sleeping bags, stoves. The ability to hunt further into the backcountry, nowhere is "too far" anymore. Plus, there's just a lot of people that take hunting a lot more seriously due to the scarcity of tags and the amount of money they've invested to pursue it.

What's driving demand is not one influencer, its an entire industry that provides an "easy" button from stem to stern on every hunt.

If we were REALLY serious about preserving the experience, we would not allow sights on bows, trigger releases, maybe not allow compounds at all. Might not allow more than a 4 power rifle scope, or optics of ANY kind over 10 power. Might make more and bigger areas foot/horse access only.

Its ridiculous to say a paper application or not paying for advertisement is going to do ANY good to slow the number of people hunting the West...laughable really.

I’d like to see if going back to paper apps and fronting tag fees improved draw odds. I 100% agree it won’t change the number of hunters afield.

 

[Fatcamp]

I’d like to see if going back to paper apps and fronting tag fees improved draw odds. I 100% agree it won’t change the number of hunters afield.

Would love for it to go back, not gonna happen.

 

[SDHNTR]

Not going to happen, technology of all sorts isn't going back in the bottle.

This board and others like it are just, if not more, responsible for the huge demand for tags in the West as well as OTC opportunities.

To blame where people get their information on ONE guy or ONE department is all BS. Lots of other things make hunting easier.

Wasn't that long ago, I was applying for NV, MT, WY, CO, NM, AZ with a paper application, because that's all there was. You had to put a lot of effort into staying on mailing lists, fronting the entire tag fees, researching through phone calls to departments and other people you knew.

Now, its fire up the computer, no fronting money, every application is an online form, research can be had with a google search, you don't have know a single person to find all the information you want.

That's the ease of just drawing a tag.

Once that's done you have archery gear that allows you to shoot 80-90-100 yards, rifles that make a 4-5-6 hundred yard shot pretty darn easy. You have GPS, google earth, ATV's, UTV's spotting scopes that allow you to see the size of an animal at 2-3-4 miles. Light weight hunting clothing, packs, tents, sleeping bags, stoves. The ability to hunt further into the backcountry, nowhere is "too far" anymore. Plus, there's just a lot of people that take hunting a lot more seriously due to the scarcity of tags and the amount of money they've invested to pursue it.

What's driving demand is not one influencer, its an entire industry that provides an "easy" button from stem to stern on every hunt.

If we were REALLY serious about preserving the experience, we would not allow sights on bows, trigger releases, maybe not allow compounds at all. Might not allow more than a 4 power rifle scope, or optics of ANY kind over 10 power. Might make more and bigger areas foot/horse access only.

Its ridiculous to say a paper application or not paying for advertisement is going to do ANY good to slow the number of people hunting the West...laughable really.

Even though I have all the toys and take advantage of available tech, in a heartbeat I’d support an abolishment of tag application services, internet applications and credit cards. I’d also support a limit of 3 pins on a bow site and a 4x (or something, even 3x9) scope max max with capped turrets. Lose OnX, lose sites like these, take it all back to our roots. The pendulum has swung too far.

Somebody make me a camo hat that says “Make Hunting Hard Again”!

 

[FatCampzWife]

If not for everyone & their dog sitting at home for 6-12 months, we wouldn't be having this conversation. People were bored out of their minds, got hooked watching all the well-shot, glammed-up hunting shows, & thought, "Well, damn! That looks fun as hell! And it really doesn't look so hard, I think I'll buy some equipment & give 'er a go!"
But, hunting IS hard. Sometimes it sucks more than it's fun. The vast majority of new folks trying it out don't LIKE hard. Or pooping in the woods, or not showering for three days, or driving around for hours not seeing an animal & missing the ones they do see.
This crush on "our" hunting spots won't last forever. Neither will the lack of reservable camping spots. Peoole will get sick of the heat, the rain, the mud, & the bugs, & then we can all be getting some insane deals on barely used equipment

 

[CJ19]

I dont know what im less surprised about. A popular public land influencer shooting deer on public land to fulfill a contractual obligation instead of all the other important reasons people hunt or the fanbois, buddies, and supposed public land advocates defending it.

Not a good look.

 

[Pro953]

Everyone should look at the mission statement of the fish and game department where they live and or hunt.

AZ-
To conserve Arizona's diverse wildlife resources and manage for safe, compatible outdoor recreation opportunities for current and future generations.

If you do not like what is happening, the question/statement is. We should not use game and fish dollars to market hunting/fishing in our state. It does not fit with the mission of the organization.

These departments issued a RFP and different groups then fulfilled them. Don’t be pissed at the person that fulfilled the contract, be pissed at the person that issued the contract.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[MattB]

There is a world record bull in AZ as we speak. Not telling you which unit. Chastise me later for letting the cat out of the bag and ruining your future opportunity.

In all seriousness, this is a stupid thread.

 

[Traveler]

I’m not really arguing just saying welcome to the world of tech, it opens up so much to everyone.

To me it’s not necessarily a R vs NR thing but that hunting is just popular, I’m sure there are many more R hunters today then there were 20 years ago as well. Hunting is popular and people are willing to travel, personally I give little credit to influencers and more to tech as to why hunting has become popular.

As was said above, every step to get in the game is easier today.

I really think there are a few years left in the western hunting trend and then hunter numbers will decline.

 

[bojangles808]

View attachment 347960

Looks like the residents are the ones who started buying all the otc tags.

yup non res only make up 10% of the otc tag sales, similar to what they get in the draw. some very confused people out there.


Instead of moaning about non residents ruining your otc hunts, you guys should email game and fish at [email protected] by dec 1st and tell them you support the threshold model for otc deer management and mandatory reporting for all big game species. No it won't result in less tags (lookup other states) it will only help keep the opportunity to hunt over the counter going in the future, continue to bring in revenue from these hunts and allow AZGFD to manage big game species with the best data possible. definitely a no brainer.

for more context Brian Rimsza, chairman of the Bowhunting in AZ Record Book Comittee explains the benefits starting at 17:47

802: OTC AZ Deer Hunts-Mandatory Reporting-Hunt Guidelines/Recommendations with Brian Rimsza | Jay Scott Outdoors Western Big Game Hunting and Fishing Podcast

Join Jay Scott and Brian Rimsza as they discuss OTC Archery Deer hunts-Mandatory Reporting-Hunt Guidelines-Hunt Recommendations You can show support by simply sending an email to [email protected]. The two things you need to mention in your email is what model you support and...

jayscottoutdoors.podbean.com

 

[RyanT26]

I really think there are a few years left in the western hunting trend and then hunter numbers will decline.

We can only hope!

 

[HuntHarder]

Dealer Resident sales
2018: 25,639
2019: 25,010
2020: 26,496

Non- Resident sales
2018: 2,102
2019: 2,583
2020: 3,093

#'s obtained thru a public records request. Looks like a 4% increase in Res. tag sales vs. a 47% increase in Non- Res tag sales.

 

[SWOHTR]

if only people would find something more productive to do with their time…

 

[Beendare]

Thats it, I’m boycotting Arizona…….grin

 

[tdhanses]

Dealer Resident sales
2018: 25,639
2019: 25,010
2020: 26,496

Non- Resident sales
2018: 2,102
2019: 2,583
2020: 3,093

#'s obtained thru a public records request. Looks like a 4% increase in Res. tag sales vs. a 47% increase in Non- Res tag sales.

Using percentages is kind of not giving a real picture though as most won’t look at the base the percent change came from.

Better to say an increase in 1500 resident tags (the 4%) vs 500 nonresident tags (the 47%).

 

[HuntHarder]

Using percentages is kind of not giving a real picture though as most won’t look at the base the percent change came from.

Better to say an increase in 1500 resident tags (the 4%) vs 500 nonresident tags (the 47%).

I am referring to the 2018 season to the 2020 season.
so it would be an increase of
Resident: (857 tags) or 4 %
Non Resident ( 991 tags ) or 47%.

I think this is a pretty complex issue that has already affected the "popular" states for OTC
Wyoming Antelope
Colorado Elk
Arizona Deer

The influencers are a very, very small reason for this. I think most guys who care about future hunting opportunities in their respective states, are trying to catch up or get ahead of the loss of opportunity. It is gonna take lots of changes.

 

[tdhanses]

I am referring to the 2018 season to the 2020 season.
so it would be an increase of
Resident: (857 tags) or 4 %
Non Resident ( 991 tags ) or 47%.

I think this is a pretty complex issue that has already affected the "popular" states for OTC
Wyoming Antelope
Colorado Elk
Arizona Deer

The influencers are a very, very small reason for this. I think most guys who care about future hunting opportunities in their respective states, are trying to catch up or get ahead of the loss of opportunity. It is gonna take lots of changes.

Overall though what it shows is NR are a fraction of the ones hunting otc.

 

[Randy Newberg]

Earlier in the year folks discovered what many of us already suspected: that state game and fish agencies were paying influencers to advertise hunting in their state. Which doesn't sound too bad until you start losing hunting opportunities because of it. In Arizona's case, they cut out over the counter archery deer tags in a few units. AZ hunters were not happy, and started voicing their concerns. A petition was started below:

2,525 people signed and won this petition

AZGFD: Stop Paying Influencers

chng.it

The petition was just updated stating that Newberg reached out to the petition organizer and stated that he was cancelling his contract with AZGF. See below:


View attachment 347877





Newberg isn't/wasn't the only influencer being paid by state game and fish agencies/license sales dollars. This new era of "public land influencers" can have very real negative effects on public land hunting opportunity while they hide behind the guise "But we need more hunters! More license sales = more money for agencies!"

Another popular white-tail/turkey hunting group, that has a bigger following than Newberg, has also been paid by multiple state agencies (AZ being one of them) through license sales dollars. And people flock to the areas they hunt, like the sheep we are. Some of these states are now also reducing public land turkey hunting opportunity on a massive scale.

This is just a heads up on some of the things that go on behind closed doors. It ain't all rainbows and unicorns with your favorite influencer. And something to think about before you "Hit that like button and subscribe!"

Funny stuff right there. As if the petition had anything to do with it. The petition had nothing to do with it. I had notified AZ G&F of my intent to withdraw from the last year of the contract months before the petition came out.

When the 2021 regulations came out with the changes to OTC mule deer, a hunt I have never done or ever promoted, I called AZ G&F and told them that if the 20% archery harvest was being triggered by mule deer harvests, I did not think it was good for us to be promoting deer hunting during this drought. We talked it over. I told them I was withdrawing from the last year of that contract. They asked if I would wait to make a final decision. We talked again in late July. Again, I told them of my intentions at that time.

That was before any petition was put together using me as the poster child. It has nothing to do with "backlash."

But, if the petition organizers think the BS storyline that they pressured me to withdraw is going to lower the archery harvest below the 20% threshold for more restrictive seasons, or you think that is going to change the huge increase in archery success rates that helped trigger the 20%, or you think that is going to result in more fawns in drought years, then carry on with that story line.

I've always been a "residents-first" supporter. I think AZ G&F should do what residents want and us non-residents should be hunting at the pleasure of whatever hunting opportunity is offered.

I will continue to hunt AZ as I have since 1984. I will continue to tell my audience that I think AZ is in the top 2 states of value provided to non-resident hunters. A fact is that AZ is my top value when spending my non-resident dollars. It has been for many years. Given my enjoyment of hunting late season elk, small game, quail, archery Coues, and archery javelina, I suspect it will be at the top of my list for a long time. Those hunts will continue to show up on my platforms. The deadlines and how the draws work will be part of my annual podcast series. I will continue to do videos explaining the AZ draw system.

The petition and its claim of "Victory" is laughable. I'm a pretty easy guy to reach. If they had contacted me before their petition, they would have known of my decision to withdraw. And they could have maybe focused their efforts on things that help improve deer numbers, management policies, and resident opportunity.

Happy Hunting.