Any one have wind drift data on fixed vs mechanical

[PurpleDriver]

Another thread got me wondering…

Does anyone have data on how much a fixed blade BH drifts at extended range vs a fixed blade head?

From a properly tuned bow. Not really looking for assumptions as it seems many rock sliders shoot fixed but carry a mechanical for long shots. Just curious why, IF data can be provided to back it up.

 

[CMF]

Following...
I'd also like to see data on stabilizer vs no stabilizer at 60+. I know it would vary by individual. I plan to do this one day....

 

[PurpleDriver]

There are so many of us that have tinkered with this, I’m hoping someone has written it all down.

I keep copious reloading notes, But when it comes to archery I haven’t written a thing down and I’ve been through 7 bows and at least 2 DZ different arrows over the last 30yrs of shooting stick and string.

 

[5MilesBack]

The only data I have is my own. I was a diehard fixed BH guy prior to 2011. In 2011 I was shooting at a buddy's house in MT. A pretty good crosswind was blowing from my right. We were shooting from his garage, so we were blocked from the effects of the wind as far as form and hold goes etc. The target was 80 yards. I shot my 500gr arrow at 285fps tipped with 125gr Shuttle T heads several times, and it was hitting consistently 18" left of the bullseye.

My buddy says "here, try this", and hands me a Grim Reaper mechanical to try. I put it on and shot it a few times......consistently only 2" left of the bullseye. I was sold. I still carry both fixed and mechanical heads in my quiver. The GR's and Spitfires I carry are all 3-blade 1.5" cut. Fixed are 125gr Exodus.

 

[Trumpkin The Dwarf]

The only data I have is my own. I was a diehard fixed BH guy prior to 2011. In 2011 I was shooting at a buddy's house in MT. A pretty good crosswind was blowing from my right. We were shooting from his garage, so we were blocked from the effects of the wind as far as form and hold goes etc. The target was 80 yards. I shot my 500gr arrow at 285fps tipped with 125gr Shuttle T heads several times, and it was hitting consistently 18" left of the bullseye.

My buddy says "here, try this", and hands me a Grim Reaper mechanical to try. I put it on and shot it a few times......consistently only 2" left of the bullseye. I was sold. I still carry both fixed and mechanical heads in my quiver. The GR's and Spitfires I carry are all 3-blade 1.5" cut. Fixed are 125gr Exodus.

That's great info! Might just have to pick up a Sevr or two.

 

[Dos Perros]

I would wager the drift imparted on to the shaft is at least half of whatever you put on the end, meaning the difference between fixed and mechanical shouldn't crazy different.

 

[PurpleDriver]

The only data I have is my own. I was a diehard fixed BH guy prior to 2011. In 2011 I was shooting at a buddy's house in MT. A pretty good crosswind was blowing from my right. We were shooting from his garage, so we were blocked from the effects of the wind as far as form and hold goes etc. The target was 80 yards. I shot my 500gr arrow at 285fps tipped with 125gr Shuttle T heads several times, and it was hitting consistently 18" left of the bullseye.

My buddy says "here, try this", and hands me a Grim Reaper mechanical to try. I put it on and shot it a few times......consistently only 2" left of the bullseye. I was sold. I still carry both fixed and mechanical heads in my quiver. The GR's and Spitfires I carry are all 3-blade 1.5" cut. Fixed are 125gr Exodus.

That’s what I was looking for! 18” vs 2”, is significant. With drift being a function of time, that would be significant even at 40yds. A shuttle T doesn’t really have a lot of blade surface either. I may have to order a couple SEVR as well and do some testing.

I wonder if a vented blade has less drift…

 

[WBrim]

Keeping an eye on this thread- I go back and forth between grim reapers and annihilators (which is a relatively small head).

 

[CMF]

We were shooting from his garage, so we were blocked from the effects of the wind as far as form and hold goes etc.

I'll have to remember this if I ever do some testing. Shooting the CBC this week, the wind has certainly affected my form/hold.

I would wager the drift imparted on to the shaft is at least half of whatever you put on the end, meaning the difference between fixed and mechanical shouldn't crazy different.

I believe you could be right.
But I also feel like maybe once the wind catches a fixed head it could be more of a steering effect vs a constant sideways push effect. like turning the rudder on a boat and starting a new course vs blowing the boat sideways while still pointed straight. So the amount of off-target may not be directly proportional to the side profile area. If that makes sense
I also wonder if helical might help with this and another reason I'm going to try and fletch some helical here soon.

I wonder if a vented blade has less drift…

I'm not going to find out, I don't like the sound of a vented head.

 

[PurpleDriver]

Agree with you on the vented blade noise.

just wish I had the time to test all this out. I love the ability to tinker with this stuff looking for perfection. I’ve got a technical background so I’m always wanting data over opinion, but in archery, especially BHs, it seems we are short on data. That’s why I really like the Lusk testing.

just wish there was a ballistic app and database, but I know I’m way deep in the weeds on my data search.

 

[Dos Perros]

I shot at a deer in a pretty stiff crosswind this year. I saw the tail of the arrow whip like crazy as it flew down range. The wind pushed on the tail end harder than the front, so it was steering into the wind.

 

[sndmn11]

I shot at a deer in a pretty stiff crosswind this year. I saw the tail of the arrow whip like crazy as it flew down range. The wind pushed on the tail end harder than the front, so it was steering into the wind.

That's what I perceive my eyes have seen when I fling in a crosswind. I haven't seen much difference in the perspective whether fp or bh.

 

[rclouse79]

With how many archery nuts are out there, you would think someone would have videoed an experiment with a hooter shooter and a steady crosswind measured with a wind meter. If I had that video and there was a crazy difference, I would try to sell it to a mechanical company.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

stiff crosswind and decent FOC you can definitely see the tail get pushed by the wind.

 

[PurpleDriver]

With how many archery nuts are out there, you would think someone would have videoed an experiment with a hooter shooter and a steady crosswind measured with a wind meter. If I had that video and there was a crazy difference, I would try to sell it to a mechanical company.

That’s exactly what I hoped was out there.

 

[realunlucky]

I shot at a deer in a pretty stiff crosswind this year. I saw the tail of the arrow whip like crazy as it flew down range. The wind pushed on the tail end harder than the front, so it was steering into the wind.

You need less drag to steer mechanical broadheads so using a smaller vane makes it less susceptible during cross wind flight

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[5MilesBack]

That’s what I was looking for! 18” vs 2”, is significant.

Ya, it surprised me. Even before that I had shot FP's here in CO at 80 yards in a pretty good crosswind while I was shielded from it. I aimed at the right edge of the bales expecting them to hit much further left of that. But surprisingly, those arrows were within 2" of the edge. So fixed blade BH's are definitely more affected by the wind.

I used to shoot the original Wac'em heads quite a bit years ago. I do know that they seemed to be less affected than even those Shuttle T's. But I can't remember ever shooting them specifically at 80 yards in a strong crosswind. They were definitely more forgiving in general though and extremely accurate. If I had to pick a fixed blade head for long range shooting it would be those.

 

[Blockcaver]

My best arrows for minimizing wind drift are 4mm Easton Carbon Injections with 3-blade Spitfire broadheads and 3 Blazer vanes. Outdoor top target archers shoot small diameter shafts and small vanes for a reason….wind drift minimization.

Worst were my Easton 23-15 shafts, 5” feathers with a Zwickey 4-blade Delta fixed head.,,,but I killed tons of game with them shooting fingers. I’d see the tail of the arrow drifting downwind when I shot in crosswinds.

Concerning wind drift, as an engineer, archer and bowhunter I can confidently say arrow diameter matters, as does fletching area and quantity {3 vs 4 vanes). Broadhead “area” matters too. And vented fixed blade heads drift less in the wind but often are noisy in flight.

To accurately measure the absolute effects would require a “side wind tunnel”. Wind is never constant, my wind meter (anemometer) on the weather station shows that. And hilly terrain only exasperates the issue. Shooting rifle with wind flags in use also shows the variations along the target path on a 100 yd range.

Take any “tests” of wind drift with a grain of salt until some lab does them accurately as per absolute drift numbers. Until then, just look at the comparative projected areas of the shaft, broadhead and vanes and make your component selection. By projected area, think of it as the area of the shadow cast by the arrow, realizing it is spinning. The vanes and broadhead projected area needs to be averaged.

 

[Wrench]

Much like bullets, arrows yaw into the wind.....and when speaking about ballistic coefficients, all variables matter.

Arrow lenght and diameter, fletch size, number and material, broadhead size, shape and weight, arrow balance....there's no way to apply a rule of "plus a pin width" or twice the hold to every setup.

A more important consideration is the amount of yaw induced during arrow flight. An arrow with significant yaw will hit the target closer to sideways where an arrow without will just drift.

 

[Marble]

I'm trying to guess how to properly measure resistance with a broadhead. Would it be the surface area? Surface of only 2 blades in a 3 since it's spinning? Or maybe the profile surface of the overall head. Meaning when the head spins, it creates an area that has more volume and overall area compared to a head not spinning. Maybe your engineer mind can explain better.

But to echo what @5MilesBack said, I too always carry multiple broadheads in my quiver. Usually 3 ironwill S125, 1 kudupoint and 2 sevr 1.5. I feel like this gives me the option of several choices for whatever need I have. I still have never needed all 3, but i did use two different heads on a bear last year. I like the mechanicals but man, the penetration and toughness of some 2 blades is crazy.

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