7mm vs 300

[BuckSnort]

So I got my rifle back and I am loving it. I did some load development and got up to 71 gr of retumbo using 180 bergers with neck turned norma brass. I didnt hit overpressure signs yet but have to be getting close. I got 2912 fps with an es of 14. I called the gun smith and he said the chrono might not be accurate and the only way to really tell your velocity is to shoot it and figure it out. He has ohler 35 that is always 3% off so I might be right in there just have to shoot it and verify the data, the chrono is most usefull to determine ES I believe.

Looks like you've got a good load there...With that accuracy and that low ES you have a great long distance shooter... Good looking setup and nice pic of the young one also... Curious on you're seating depth, was the rifle finicky on seating depth?

 

[HellsCanyon]

I also disagree with Wapitibob! I have seen what Berger's can do up close and way out there. Most of the bad publicity is from people who have never even shot the bullet, let alone into the shoulder up close. Here is a link to a Berger thread from a couple of months ago.

http://www.rokslide.com/forums/show...front-shoulder-and-still-get-good-performance

X100... shoot a Berger into an animal then tell me you don't want to use them. They will break and penetrate past shoulder bone and more. Wouldn't hesitate to use them on deer elk or black bear (have killed bear and deer with them)! Moose or grizzly might be where I draw the line. However a 210 Berger at 3200+ would probably have me confident on moose.

Mike

 

[wapitibob]

Wapitibob,

I am curious to how you have come to your opinions about these bullets? Are they from necropsy examinations or actual field performance that you have seen? I ask because I have made some assumptions about bullet performance myself, including thinking that Bergers are too frangible. However, I have since actually used Bergers on game (elk, deer, and antelope), and not really heavy for caliber (185 in .308) with good success. I have also killed many (maybe 15ish?) animals with various Barnes bullets (Mostly the original TSX, bust also orginal X and TTSX), and have had nothing but consistent performance, and not always on bone. In fact, in my experience, I am now completely confident in Barnes performance on a hard or soft hit. Many hunters also report good consistent terminal performance with Berger Hunting VLD's including John Barsness in his rather in-depth examination of Berger terminal performance found here:

http://www.bergerbullets.com/Information/Barsness%20Article.pdf

My point is that I am glad I have given those bullets some field time, and other Rokslide members may also want to try them.

I am NOT knocking the Accubond, as it is also one of my favorites, and I currently load the 160 7mm in my 7 mag. If the Bergers shoot well in your rifle, you may want to give them a try. You might be surprised just how effective they are.

LongrangeHunting.com has been a good source for bullet performance, as well as where certain bullets perform best. There is a large enough user base of berger and barnes to get a good idea how they hold up under certain conditions. In the 6 months I have been looking, Rare is the case when a Berger goes thru an animal. Most reports are 3" of penetration then they grenade. Barnes on the other hand, seldom grenade and sometimes never expand. The common denominator is bone. I gave my opinion based on the research. It doesn't matter to me what bullets a guy uses.

I have both Barnes and Bergers. The Barnes shoot like crap so the Bergers will be used. I won't be aiming at the front shoulder joint though.

 

[BuckSnort]

WHat ball socket?

 

[pyroducksx3]

Looks like you've got a good load there...With that accuracy and that low ES you have a great long distance shooter... Good looking setup and nice pic of the young one also... Curious on you're seating depth, was the rifle finicky on seating depth?

the smith had a load already figured out. He used win brass though and I tried to use it but it was horrible so I never even loaded rounds with it. I switched to norma and started my powder low. His load was win brass, 180 berger, 71gr retumbo powder, fed 215M primer and seating depth right on the lands. I didnt experiment with seating depth just put it on the lands, in may case 2.671" measured from the ogive, and started at 67 gr of retumbo and started going up

 

[Titaniumman]

My highschool graduation present was a Sako Finnbear in 7mm Rem. Mag. I hunted for years with that rifle until my oldest son graduated and I passed it on to him. I mostly shot 150 gr. bullets through it. From there I went to a 30.06 Model 70 Winchester. I'd still have it if it were not for an insistent daughter who received it for Christmas a few years back I now shoot a Browning BAR in 300 Win. Mag. I have only shot deer with the 7mm and 300. Both are probably more gun than necessary but the thing I have noticed most is that my 7mm was more prone to blood shot meat than the 300. Between the two rifles somewhere in the neighborhood of 30 deer have fallen to them. That 30.06 is still my favorite. Dang that girl!

 

[wapitibob]

WHat ball socket?

LOL, no argument there.

All we can do is read and form an opinion. Barnes or Berger, Chevy or Ford, it really doesn't make much difference in the overall scheme of things.

BitterRoot, thank you for the Berger article. I will read it this weekend.

 

[Matt Cashell]

LOL, no argument there.

All we can do is read and form an opinion. Barnes or Berger, Chevy or Ford, it really doesn't make much difference in the overall scheme of things.

BitterRoot, thank you for the Berger article. I will read it this weekend.

You're welcoome, waptibob,

The article is typical easy-reading Barsness, and I think you will enjoy it. I also think he writes some stuff for longrangehunting.com.

Keep us updated on how the Bergers do for you!

 

[pyroducksx3]

I have researched barnes, berger, accubond, and ssts and have come to this conclusion. All of these bullets will perform well when put in the proper spot (kill zone). So I shoot these in my rifles and let the gun decide which it likes best. I think most bad reviews of these bullet come from people that didn't recover their animal but swear they made a perfect shot. Where in reality they didn't impact as well as they thought. So I firmly believe if you make an appropriate shot in the kill zone with any of these bullets you will be happy with the results.

 

[My Harem]

I shot 168 bergers last year and I am switching to accubonds. The bergers were tack drivers out of my 300wsm. 3 shot .45" groups at 100. Took a dall sheep square broadside in the shoulder a 371yds and the far shoulder did not have as much as a blood stain. There was nothing left of the insides of the animal including the stomach and intestines. It is not a bullet you want to eat behind. Sure question the ability to take big game moose,bears..
Pretty much the same results on 2 big bodied alberta deer. There was no exit hole on all three