.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[KHntr]

I've read a lot. But I certainly have not read every page.

I have seen countless pages of dead animals after broadside hits. All those animals are real dead. There seems to be little doubt that the 223 will work in that situation.

I haven't seen pictures of dead animals at this shot angle. (The pictures could be there but I haven't seen them).

My preference is for a quartering shot, be it coming in or going away. I don’t hesitate on either of those with a 223/88 combo. I’d add the 77 TMK to that as well, but I don’t have enough stuff killed with the 77 to really comment on it. I’ve only killed one big buck (and some coyotes) with a 77 TMK so far, but it was quartering and his shoulder was crushed.

The only thing I wouldn’t expect to do is drive through a full paunch and reach vitals, but to be fair I had a 168 gr TSX from a 300 RUM not make it to vitals shooting down on a straightaway elk at 60 yards. And I fully expected for that one to come out the brisket.
If I was of a need to take that hard of an angle of a shot (with ANY bullet/cartridge combo) I would adjust my aim and shoot with the intent to break hips and pelvis or spine and then follow up with another shot after that to whatever was going to finish the job.

 

[Taudisio]

Didn’t @Thegman post a griz he shot at a similar angle/poi with the same combo?

 

[mt terry d]

Sorry.. let's add more definition...

I agree with the assumptions above: 77 grain TMK (or similar bullet). Range 400 yards and under.

By the looks of the picture they aren't alerted and the bull is intent on tending his cows though he is moving.
Whether I have my 223 or 300 win mag I'll wait to see if he gives me a standing broadside or quartering away shot, which is highly likely, so I don't needlessly ruin a bunch of meat. If for some reason I think that's not likely I'll take that shot every day of the week and twice on sundays with the 223 & 77 TMKs.
I might even call the wife and have her bring the truck before I pull the trigger

 

[sierracharlie338]

This one counts though. 15 yr old son of one of my best buds. Bud never got to see his son kill his first elk, but I had the privilege of being there with him.

He was a touch nervous and pulled the shot a bit forward on this quartering in elk at 202 yards, but the 88 still had her on the ground in less than 40 yards and 5 seconds.

That 88 exited at the front edge of the offside shoulder.

I remember this original post. Kudos again sir. Much respect

 

[KHntr]

By the looks of the picture they aren't alerted and the bull is intent on tending his cows though he is moving.
Whether I have my 223 or 300 win mag I'll wait to see if he gives me a standing broadside or quartering away shot, which is highly likely, so I don't needlessly ruin a bunch of meat. If for some reason I think that's not likely I'll take that shot every day of the week and twice on sundays with the 223 & 77 TMKs.
I might even call the wife and have her bring the truck before I pull the trigger

I like eating bulls too much to get cute waiting for the perfect presentation. I’d rather trim bloodshot from a quarter, over having no quarters.
Not to mention the fact that I count on killing one for the table every fall so I can’t relax until there is one on the ground. As soon as there is a clear shot I put one in him.
Unless of course he’s coming on a string, in which case I’ll let him come until he gets to the last clear spot for a shot or he stops to look for the elk he thought he heard.

 

[graywolf260]

There are 20+ elk, plus 4-5 moose with that exact shot in here. It’s total none issue- except for the meat damage that results from a TMK hitting bone.

Isn’t this where a solid copper would come in handy, maybe a 65 gr MTH?

 

[mt terry d]

I like eating bulls too much to get cute waiting for the perfect presentation.

If an animal is not alerted or the wind isn't wrong I'll take the time to get set up better,
maybe take a couple dry fires, and allow it time to present a perfect shot or
wander closer or maybe it presents a good opportunity to get closer. And maybe in the meantime a bigger bull comes into the picture. Plus, I enjoy the process of watching and the anticipation;
not to the extent that I risk not getting a good shot if one's there.
I don't just take the first shot opportunity available.

I don't know what's "cute" about that.

Congrats on the kills. Are you going to try the new 88 TMK's?

 

[KHntr]

Different conditions. Typically my elk are killed in early/mid September during the rut. A bull slipping in through the timber closing to single digit yardage and then blowing out because you didn’t take the shot offered before he winds you is a different opportunity than one pushing cows across a meadow.

I do have a few 88 TMK’s waiting at the post office to be picked up, so I’ll run some into some bears this spring from my 22 Creed to get a feel of what the terminal effects look like.

 

[walkingduckwaterfowl]

Anyone have any terminal performance experience with federal 69GR tactical tru TMK?

 

[sierracharlie338]

Anyone have any terminal performance experience with federal 69GR tactical tru TMK?

Several kills here with 69 TMK. Not as much performance as the 77s but still gets the job done.

 

[sierracharlie338]

Different conditions. Typically my elk are killed in early/mid September during the rut. A bull slipping in through the timber closing to single digit yardage and then blowing out because you didn’t take the shot offered before he winds you is a different opportunity than one pushing cows across a meadow.

I do have a few 88 TMK’s waiting at the post office to be picked up, so I’ll run some into some bears this spring from my 22 Creed to get a feel of what the terminal effects look like.

were most of those kills with a 223AI and not the CM?

 

[KHntr]

were most of those kills with a 223AI and not the CM?

The ones in this thread are all 223AI. Or at least, the one in the last day or two are at any rate. Three bull moose and a bull elk (personally killed) in 2022/2023/2024. Cow elk by my buddies son in 2025.

My bulls in 2025 were with the Creed.

 

[Ckat]

I have questions...

Let's say I have a bull at this angle.

First, I think I should aim at the red dot. Do folks agree?

Second, would you take that shot with a 223? (Lets say 77 grain TMK at under 400 yards)

I personally would not hesitate to take that shot with my 7mm Rem mag. I don't know if I would take it with a 223.

View attachment 1049306

I tell my daughter (who also shoots a .223 Rem.) and anyone else I take out to go right between the front two legs, 1/3-1/2 way up the body from the brisket… no matter what the angle. That is an easy gauge where you don’t have to account for misreading an angle. It results in a quickly dead animal every time. Apply that principle to this picture, and the placement is 1-2 inches right of your dot. Either shot placement is lethal.

FWIW, the quartering-to shot is my preference as it anchors them more times than not.

 

[mad_angler]

I tell my daughter (who also shoots a .223 Rem.) and anyone else I take out to go right between the front two legs, 1/3-1/2 way up the body from the brisket… no matter what the angle. That is an easy gauge where you don’t have to account for misreading an angle. It results in a quickly dead animal every time. Apply that principle to this picture, and the placement is 1-2 inches right of your dot. Either shot placement is lethal.

FWIW, the quartering-to shot is my preference as it anchors them more times than not.

Wow. I've been hunting a long time. I've never heard that guidance. I wasn't even really sure what you meant. But I've went back and looked at about 20-30 pictures. That technique is foolproof and easy to implement. So i agree...

go right between the front two legs, 1/3-1/2 way up the body from the brisket… no matter what the angle

 

[DeepMauka]

I went right between the front two legs on my first 77tmk kill this past weekend:


And this was inside after meat pulled off:

 

[DeepMauka]

Finally after much struggle to get the 77tmk to shoot accurately out of my rifle, I got to test it on some animals this weekend. I was able to harvest 2 axis does. First one was a frontal shot at 250yds. Perfect placement with no exit. Inside rib cage was absolute soup, heart and lungs liquified. Deer bucked and ran around a tree, so couldn’t tell exactly how far, but I’m guessing 10 feet or so. Second was a broadside shot at 275. Wind was an estimated 12-18mph. Kestrel went down so wasn’t exactly sure, so bracketed a .5-1mil lead on it in the scope (all within good area for a kill). Deer dropped without moving. When I walked up, shot was high shoulder/neck area. Ended up being a 1 mil drift. Scapula completely destroyed. No exit.



77tmk in a 223 is my officially my favorite hunting bullet.

 

[Pharmseller]

All this blood is making me queasy.

 

[SBR Sarge]

All this blood is making me queasy

Yeah, I know what you mean, they do make a mess.

Who’d have thought that the 77TMK would be too destructive?

 

[Pharmseller]

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tenor.com

 

[KHntr]

I went right between the front two legs on my first 77tmk kill this past weekend:

View attachment 1051858
And this was inside after meat pulled off:
View attachment 1051859

But can you eat right up to the hole?!?!?!?