.223 for bear, mountain goat, deer, elk, and moose.

[cod0396]

Yet RiffRaff (and others) provided clear evidence that they work and work well?? Have you ever used them??

His results showed that the mono made 1.5-2" diameter wounds while the TMK made wounds twice that diameter. That is a gigantic difference in tissue disruption, not to mention that the difference would be even more drastic at further ranges or in shorter barrels. Of course a 1.5" hole in an animal's vitals will take it down, but not as quickly or as effectively as a 3-4" hole will.

The distance an animal runs is only half the story - down doesn't mean dead. Assuming shot placement is identical, the time it takes for the animal to actually succumb to its wounds and bleed out directly correlates with wound channel size.


*The rest of this comment isn't necessarily directed towards you, but to anyone wondering WHY high weight retention monos or bonded bullets are inferior to bullets like TMK.

When it comes to ethical kills with a .223 (or any rifle caliber really), fragmentation is your friend. I'm not sure if this has been touched on in the thread, but there is a very simple reason why fragmentation as seen in bullets like TMK and AMAX/ELD-M does far more damage than mere expansion. It's not just because fragments make a bunch of tiny wound channels, as some like to believe.

We all know that rifle bullets make a significant temporary cavity above a certain velocity. What fragmentation does is weaken the structural integrity of the tissue and make it MUCH easier to tear. Think about tearing an intact piece of paper or a rubber band vs one with a bunch of little holes in it. That's why bullets like the TMK are as effective as they are. Fragmentation helps ensure that the temporary cavity becomes essentially permanent. Not the case with weight retaining monolithics.

Like Formidilosus said, this thread would have a VERY different tone if the main bullet in question was the barnes TSX and not the 77gr TMK.

 

[RiffRaff]

Hey Dudes, didn't mean to restart old arguments with my post. I want to clarify my conclusions as the context might not be clear. For me, a meat hunter with shots at or under 100 yards, friendly relationships with all bordering neighbors in case a deer runs, and controlled, known-distance shots, the TSX works better for me as a meat harvesting round, precisely because it does less damage. No different than bowhunting.

With all that said however, the 77gr TMK is without a doubt the deadlier bullet. If I was hunting at farther distances up to 400, sure I would probably take it instead. But with my sub-100 yard set up, it just did more damage than I would like. I lost an entire front quarter due to the shrapnel blasting out the other side.

If you are trophy hunting backcountry, or with unknown ranges, then the 77gr TMK would be the far safer choice. Like I said in my original post - for defensive carbine / predator control / hog control, the 77gr TMK is my new go-to because I don't care about meat loss in those situations, just maximum killing ability.

I think you just gotta analyze your personal situation with this stuff.

With that said, does anyone have specific information on the 77gr TMKs performance through bone? I would like to experiment with some high shoulder anchoring shots this season as that is the shot I aim for when I do make it out to the backcountry mountains.

 

[Formidilosus]

With that said, does anyone have specific information on the 77gr TMKs performance through bone?

There is a ton of information about bone performance in this thread. I would highly suggest that you read every post from start to finish.

 

[Veloci_Wrench]

Hey Dudes, didn't mean to restart old arguments with my post. I want to clarify my conclusions as the context might not be clear. For me, a meat hunter with shots at or under 100 yards, friendly relationships with all bordering neighbors in case a deer runs, and controlled, known-distance shots, the TSX works better for me as a meat harvesting round, precisely because it does less damage. No different than bowhunting.

With all that said however, the 77gr TMK is without a doubt the deadlier bullet. If I was hunting at farther distances up to 400, sure I would probably take it instead. But with my sub-100 yard set up, it just did more damage than I would like. I lost an entire front quarter due to the shrapnel blasting out the other side.

If you are trophy hunting backcountry, or with unknown ranges, then the 77gr TMK would be the far safer choice. Like I said in my original post - for defensive carbine / predator control / hog control, the 77gr TMK is my new go-to because I don't care about meat loss in those situations, just maximum killing ability.

I think you just gotta analyze your personal situation with this stuff.

With that said, does anyone have specific information on the 77gr TMKs performance through bone? I would like to experiment with some high shoulder anchoring shots this season as that is the shot I aim for when I do make it out to the backcountry mountains.

Here’s a TLDR for you: TMK gives reliable performance even through bone. It has been recommended to aim for shoulders to drop game quickly, even in larger game like elk.

 

[sram9102]

Can the guy who's wife shot the moose just post it every few day to clear all of this up...

 

[kkp005]

Shot a boar hog at a feeder yesterday with a 18” 22-250 launching 77gr TMKs. Impact velocity was around 2750fps at a touch over 100 yards..

Bullet entered right in the middle of the shoulder (zipped right through the supposed bullet proof “shield”) and exited in front of the shoulder on the opposite side with all kinds of of bones & tissue sticking out the exit..

I couldn’t find the entry with the hide still attached but once I got it peeled back it was easy to tell that little bullet immediately started f’ing up everything in its path.

 

[LCV]

FYI Palmetto State/aac is now selling their tmk loads. $.85/round. Figured I’d share since this thread brought me here

 

[Formidilosus]

77gr TMK, 2,534 impact, exited, and ran 20-30 feet.




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Exit-

 

[Castle Rock]

But,But,But you need a 300 WM for that

 

[RiffRaff]

Hey Form, awesome bear kill! What was the angle and shot location?

 

[jofes]

FYI Palmetto State/aac is now selling their tmk loads. $.85/round. Figured I’d share since this thread brought me here

Anyone had good luck with these grouping?

 

[wind gypsy]

Anyone had good luck with these grouping?

I've only shot the AAC 77 SMK 5.56 ammo and it was not at all accurate in my t3 lite. Would be fine for shooting deer inside 150 yards, just not pretty on paper.

 

[ARK_Ginger]

Anyone had good luck with these grouping?

Their current offerings have mixed reports from great to not good. I'll be posting some results with the TMKs when they come in.

 

[bojangles808]

556 in a 223 rifle is fine?

 

[wind gypsy]

556 in a 223 rifle is fine?

Lots of people feel it is fine. I feel a lot more safe about it with people who understand the differences in the 2 chamber specs, what factors contribute to higher pressure, and being able to read pressure signs.

I did get an occasional hint of sticky bolt lift with some of the AAC ammo in the tikka and have only shot it in cooler temps so pressure is up there and it might be questionable in some applications.

223 -vs- 5.56: FACTS and MYTHS – Ultimate Reloader

ultimatereloader.com

 

[BLJ]

77gr TMK, 2,534 impact, exited, and ran 20-30 feet.

View attachment 561568


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View attachment 561558

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View attachment 561559

What scope?

 

[jjohnsonElknewbie]

FYI Palmetto State/aac is now selling their tmk loads. $.85/round. Figured I’d share since this thread brought me here

https://palmettostatearmory.com/aac...mpaign=20230605&utm_term=morning&utm_content=

 

[Formidilosus]

Hey Form, awesome bear kill! What was the angle and shot location?

100’ish yards, back edge of scapulas.

 

[Formidilosus]

What scope?

Had just put the Athlon 2-12x back on it.

 

[BLJ]

Had just put the Athlon 2-12x back on it.

I thought that’s what it was. Thanks.