Your states tax rate

[accountantsanonymous]

How is this deceiving, it list top tax rates for each state. It clearly illustrates that the attack on “The Rich” is in full swing in this administration”

The Top 10% already pays 71% of the total income tax collected….with the top 1% paying about 40% of the total tax.

YOU TALK ABOUT MISLEADING AND DEVISIVE- Ha. BIDEN is the chief of misleading people when he constantly claims “ The rich dont pay their fair share” so when you talk about misleading you need to him keep this in context the current administration is the most misleading in history.

Do you deny that the current admin is not raising taxes on just about everything?
In many cases is slight but the Biden admin is ABSOLUTELY raising taxes to everyone either individually or through higher corp taxing, which is a pass through tax to everyone.

From the tax foundation;
“The plan would also redefine the tax base to which the 3.8 percent net investment income tax (NIIT) applies to include the “active” part of pass-through income—all taxable income above $400,000 (single filer) or $500,000 (joint filer) would be subject to tax of 3.8 percent due to the combination of NIIT and Medicare taxes.”

Why didn’t you copy the whole paragraph? It affects a lot more folks than you imply.

Speaking of this current Democrat admin being horribly misleading, we have all heard their Corporations are bad mantra and they want to raise taxes to Corporations.

Below is the facts, Corporations in the US paid a record amount of tax…but this admin wants to raise them.

The current Democrats have a clear objective, tax everyone and everything…and spend like a drunken sailor.

Tax foundation
From the Tax foundation;
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) now estimates that the federal government received $370 billion in corporate tax revenue over the past year (fiscal year 2021), matching the record high level from 2007. This is a 75 percent increase over the previous year’s total, reflecting a rebound in corporate profits and the broader economy.

This year’s robust corporate tax collections calls into question efforts by the administration and congressional Democrats to increase the corporate tax rate and raise other corporate taxes based on claims of relatively low tax collections following the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA) in 2017. In fact, corporate tax collections this year are about 25 percent higher than the $297 billion collected in 2017, prior to passage of TCJA. Likewise, as a share of GDP, corporate tax collections are higher this year (1.63 percent) than in 2017 (1.52 percent).

In addition, the rebounding economy has boosted individual income tax collections to an all-time high of $2.052 trillion for the fiscal year. Payroll tax revenue came in at $1.308 trillion, close to last year’s total, and other receipts came in at $317 billion. In total, federal tax collections reached $4.047 trillion in fiscal year 2021, an all-time high in nominal terms.

I appreciate all the detail here. Thank you for posting sources and being thorough.

I did see that part of the paragraph, I was just focusing on the larger percentage, not being Medicare related.

 

[bsnedeker]

How's that working with Amazon??? Bezos becomes the richest man in the world ( alternating with musk) builds rockets for fun space flights. . . And dodges taxes completely some years! Meanwhile his workers have limited health care and shit work conditions. . .

Walmart??? Was the countries largest employer for a Looong time! What did they do? Seek tax breaks from towns to come bring jobs, then kill as many jobs as they bring while strategically paying most workers just enough to live while qualifying for social benefits (food stamps, rent assistance, etc) and supplying shit benefits to most workers!

Corps aren't altruistic for the most part, they want to make money for their shareholders and that is their #1 objective. They will dodge taxes and cut corners where they can to achieve their ends.

But the tax rate isn't so much the problem, it's the fact that their are so many loop holes that it's fricken swiss cheese!!! Having the top 40 richest families average 8% in taxes over the last 10 years is a joke of epic proportions while the average working family is paying in 14-27%.

A flat tax with 0 and I mean 0 deductions would be the most balanced approach. Set a minimum income qualifications at 1.5x the poverty line, and then tax all income above that at x% with no deductions. Then everyone would pay their fair share.

How much money you contribute is irrelevant, it's what % of your income you contribute that is relevant!

Ps. Taxation isn't theft, it's how structured societies work. Fraud is the bullshit way your taxes get spent!

WOW! So you are telling me that Jeff Bezos and the Walton family are FORCING people to take jobs with "shit work conditions" and "limited health care"?

THIS IS AN OUTRAGE! No one should be forced to work in these conditions! Whatever law Amazon and Walmart are using to enslave these people MUST change. Can you please tell me where this law is so I can start to fight against it?

 

[Moserkr]

@String&stick You’re right, major corps avoid paying taxes and Im well aware how its done. They still pay them, but they also employee tons of people. Changing the personal tax rate is much different than the corporate tax rate. Im fine with a 20% corporate tax rate, and allow lots of deductions - as its been the last few years. @bsnedeker is also right - double edged sword - we support these companies for convenience, and people choose to work there. If the employees dont get treated right, unions will come in…

Personal tax rates should be much lower, and a flat even rate sounds right. But… The rich can shift their tax burden depending on corporate structure, and corps will always have deductions. Targeting the rich is never the answer. A simpler tax code would eliminate a lot of government employees too…. Im aways a fan of that.

When you target the rich, the family owned, moderately well off families get it the worst. The ultrarich have so much it will never matter to them. When the small family business owner gets caught up in the net, they lose the farm so to speak to the major corps. Thats why Im against taxing rich PEOPLE. Big corps, im more in favor of eliminating off shore moves that shift taxes to other countries…

 

[cuerro viejo]

How is this deceiving, it list top tax rates for each state. It clearly illustrates that the attack on “The Rich” is in full swing in this administration”

The Top 10% already pays 71% of the total income tax collected….with the top 1% paying about 40% of the total tax.

YOU TALK ABOUT MISLEADING AND DEVISIVE- Ha. BIDEN is the chief of misleading people when he constantly claims “ The rich dont pay their fair share” so when you talk about misleading, the current administration is the most misleading in history.

Do you deny that the current admin is not raising taxes on just about everything?
In many cases is slight but the Biden admin is ABSOLUTELY raising taxes to everyone either individually or through higher corp taxing, which is a pass through tax to everyone.

From the tax foundation;
“The plan would also redefine the tax base to which the 3.8 percent net investment income tax (NIIT) applies to include the “active” part of pass-through income—all taxable income above $400,000 (single filer) or $500,000 (joint filer) would be subject to tax of 3.8 percent due to the combination of NIIT and Medicare taxes.”

Why didn’t you copy the whole paragraph? It affects a lot more folks than you imply.

Speaking of this current Democrat admin being horribly misleading, we have all heard their Corporations are bad mantra and they want to raise taxes to Corporations.

Below is the facts, Corporations in the US paid a record amount of tax…but this admin wants to raise them. An accountant of all people knows, taxes (expenses) are passed through to the public- its a stealth tax disproportionally affecting the poor and middle class just like the horrible inflation we have now.

The current Democrats have a clear objective, tax everyone and everything…and spend like a drunken sailor.

Tax foundation
From the Tax foundation;
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) now estimates that the federal government received $370 billion in corporate tax revenue over the past year (fiscal year 2021), matching the record high level from 2007. This is a 75 percent increase over the previous year’s total, reflecting a rebound in corporate profits and the broader economy.

This year’s robust corporate tax collections calls into question efforts by the administration and congressional Democrats to increase the corporate tax rate and raise other corporate taxes based on claims of relatively low tax collections following the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA) in 2017. In fact, corporate tax collections this year are about 25 percent higher than the $297 billion collected in 2017, prior to passage of TCJA. Likewise, as a share of GDP, corporate tax collections are higher this year (1.63 percent) than in 2017 (1.52 percent).

In addition, the rebounding economy has boosted individual income tax collections to an all-time high of $2.052 trillion for the fiscal year. Payroll tax revenue came in at $1.308 trillion, close to last year’s total, and other receipts came in at $317 billion. In total, federal tax collections reached $4.047 trillion in fiscal year 2021, an all-time high in nominal terms.

Also remember last time the democrats had Presidential Veto power the income taxation bill started at 250k. It Was the Republicans that beat it up to 400k.

Just think where would-be at now if they got 250k. Scary

But I'm sure at least a large faction look at an income numbers and quickly projects at it,

 

[String&stick]

@String&stick You’re right, major corps avoid paying taxes and Im well aware how its done. They still pay them, but they also employee tons of people. Changing the personal tax rate is much different than the corporate tax rate. Im fine with a 20% corporate tax rate, and allow lots of deductions - as its been the last few years. @bsnedeker is also right - double edged sword - we support these companies for convenience, and people choose to work there. If the employees dont get treated right, unions will come in…

Personal tax rates should be much lower, and a flat even rate sounds right. But… The rich can shift their tax burden depending on corporate structure, and corps will always have deductions. Targeting the rich is never the answer. A simpler tax code would eliminate a lot of government employees too…. Im aways a fan of that.

When you target the rich, the family owned, moderately well off families get it the worst. The ultrarich have so much it will never matter to them. When the small family business owner gets caught up in the net, they lose the farm so to speak to the major corps. Thats why Im against taxing rich PEOPLE. Big corps, im more in favor of eliminating off shore moves that shift taxes to other countries…

Agreed, flat tax on personal side moderate taxes on corps, and make the code simple. .

Then start completely over in Congress with people that actually know how to balance a checkbook (from the whole spectrum of ideologies).

At that point we may get somewhere. . . But I won't rush to put my parka on waiting for hell to freeze over!

 

[String&stick]

WOW! So you are telling me that Jeff Bezos and the Walton family are FORCING people to take jobs with "shit work conditions" and "limited health care"?

THIS IS AN OUTRAGE! No one should be forced to work in these conditions! Whatever law Amazon and Walmart are using to enslave these people MUST change. Can you please tell me where this law is so I can start to fight against it?

For starters I hope you have a wonderful day!

So if a corporation isn't forcing people to work for them, they should be allowed to do whatever they want??? You have no problem with the real cost of Walmart being passed on to you as a tax payer?

I mean to each his own, but let's not pretend like mega corps are all about treating people right. Which is whatever but where it is relevant to this Convo is it costs the taxpayer!

 

[bsnedeker]

For starters I hope you have a wonderful day!

So if a corporation isn't forcing people to work for them, they should be allowed to do whatever they want??? You have no problem with the real cost of Walmart being passed on to you as a tax payer?

I mean to each his own, but let's not pretend like mega corps are all about treating people right. Which is whatever but where it is relevant to this Convo is it costs the taxpayer!

1. So if a corporation isn't forcing people to work for them, they should be allowed to do whatever they want??? Answer: Yes. That is how a free-market economy is designed to work.

2. You have no problem with the real cost of Walmart being passed on to you as a tax payer? Answer: No, we should not be subsidizing those wages through welfare programs. If those welfare programs did not exist people would not take those jobs because they wouldn't be able to support their family on them. Then Walmart has no workers, so then walmart says "I guess I need to pay more to attract employees". Again, this is how a free-market economy is designed to work. The reason it DOESN'T work sometimes is always due to government intervention.

It's not terribly complicated.

 

[cuerro viejo]

@String&stick You’re right, major corps avoid paying taxes and Im well aware how its done. They still pay them, but they also employee tons of people. Changing the personal tax rate is much different than the corporate tax rate. Im fine with a 20% corporate tax rate, and allow lots of deductions - as its been the last few years. @bsnedeker is also right - double edged sword - we support these companies for convenience, and people choose to work there. If the employees dont get treated right, unions will come in…

Personal tax rates should be much lower, and a flat even rate sounds right. But… The rich can shift their tax burden depending on corporate structure, and corps will always have deductions. Targeting the rich is never the answer. A simpler tax code would eliminate a lot of government employees too…. Im aways a fan of that.

When you target the rich, the family owned, moderately well off families get it the worst. The ultrarich have so much it will never matter to them. When the small family business owner gets caught up in the net, they lose the farm so to speak to the major corps. Thats why Im against taxing rich PEOPLE. Big corps, im more in favor of eliminating off shore moves that shift taxes to other countries…

Yelp, many companies use the Trump tax plan to increase hiring/invest in growth.

We also have to look at the offshoring of personal and profits and fix the why Instead of just preventing it. There is equilibrium there.

Tax discussion are always a projection at an income number, yet we fully forget the number is truly arbitrary, and bar will clearly be lowered every chance to raise spending coffers

Obama ran on a campaign of the illusion of fixing the wage disparity of CEO VS blue collar. Yet his plan started at 250k no where near the 7 figure plus comp packages

 

[Wapiti1]

This is depressing. Wish we had leaders that were for the people.

They are for the people. Just not us people.

Jeremy

 

[tradman]

F Joe Biden

And Cumalla Harris!

 

[fwafwow]

Shucks - I went through this whole thread and didn't see any of those accountants disclose the secrets to how rich folks manage to avoid taxes. Hmmm

 

[CJohnson]

Shucks - I went through this whole thread and didn't see any of those accountants disclose the secrets to how rich folks manage to avoid taxes. Hmmm

Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant.

I’m pretty sure most “rich” people don’t get a W2. I think that may have something to do with it.

I recently started a side gig to make a little extra money. It’s nice to use vehicles, tools, “home office”, etc as an offset.

W2 employees and their employers get taken to the cleaners.

 

[bsnedeker]

Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant.

I’m pretty sure most “rich” people don’t get a W2. I think that may have something to do with it.

I recently started a side gig to make a little extra money. It’s nice to use vehicles, tools, “home office”, etc as an offset.

W2 employees and their employers get taken to the cleaners.

I'll let you in on a little secret: When rich people make money in a year they pay taxes on that money! When they don't make money in a given year, or lose money in a given year, they don't pay taxes!

The problem comes when people conflate the amount a person has gained in "net worth" with "how much money they made". When Amazon stock goes up, JB's net worth goes up, but that doesn't mean he made any money unless he actually sells the stock.

The only "trick" the rich are playing is being wise about when they cash out investments. If an investment they made completely tanks they might cash out of that investment so they can write off their losses, which gives them a tax credit the same way it would for you or I if we were to incur losses in one of our investments.

 

[fwafwow]

Disclaimer: I’m not an accountant.

I’m pretty sure most “rich” people don’t get a W2. I think that may have something to do with it.

I recently started a side gig to make a little extra money. It’s nice to use vehicles, tools, “home office”, etc as an offset.

W2 employees and their employers get taken to the cleaners.

My tongue in check post is really better said directly - the often made claim that super rich people have teams of experts to help avoid taxes is IMHO overstated. There are ways to defer taxes (which isn't always a great result), but in general, if you get cash - from compensation or a sale of an asset - you are going to pay taxes.

Elon Musk is about to get hit with a (reported) $15B tax bill because a tranche of his Tesla stock was granted as part of a compensation package - which is taxed just like W2 income. That's not to say that he doesn't have other things going on that will at some point result in income that is taxed at capital gains rates.

I'm not a Brandon supporter, and I'm not arguing tax policy (what rates should be set at what income levels, or whether all types of income should be taxed the same way). I'm just saying that like many topics, taxes can be more complicated.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

My guess is the amount of members here that will pay anywhere near close to that amount is 0.

 

[BuzzH]

1. So if a corporation isn't forcing people to work for them, they should be allowed to do whatever they want??? Answer: Yes. That is how a free-market economy is designed to work.

2. You have no problem with the real cost of Walmart being passed on to you as a tax payer? Answer: No, we should not be subsidizing those wages through welfare programs. If those welfare programs did not exist people would not take those jobs because they wouldn't be able to support their family on them. Then Walmart has no workers, so then walmart says "I guess I need to pay more to attract employees". Again, this is how a free-market economy is designed to work. The reason it DOESN'T work sometimes is always due to government intervention.

It's not terribly complicated.

Free market...that's a real hoot.

Let me know where in Fantasyland that ever happens or ever has happened.

Laffin'...

 

[bsnedeker]

Free market...that's a real hoot.

Let me know where in Fantasyland that ever happens or ever has happened.

Laffin'...

How about this example: America prior to the 1930's. History books are pretty easy to come by, just a heads up.

 

[BuzzH]

How about this example: America prior to the 1930's. History books are pretty easy to come by, just a heads up.

That's funny...and a complete JOKE.

There hasn't ever been a truly free market here, even prior to 1930...if only obviously.

 

[Moserkr]

Shucks - I went through this whole thread and didn't see any of those accountants disclose the secrets to how rich folks manage to avoid taxes. Hmmm

Pm me. Its a small world of people who qualify. If you’re one of them, Id gladly share what I know. Or maybe you can tell me something I dont know. And its not “avoid”, its defer or something along those lines…. That said, im not an accountant either

 

[Beendare]

The Bezos thing elicits a lot if emotion from the entitled crowd. He and the 100 or 200 other folks in the US making obscene $$. Two sides to every coin, How many jobs have these folks provided?

Next time you hear the politicians say they are trying to help the poor:
Inflation and corp tax is a stealth tax on the middle class and poor

Did you know the Democrats could have solved the Bezos thing easily but didn’t? Thats right. Did you know the Biden admin is actually funding some of Bezos schemes?

And the Dems could have cut off the Soros’s at the knees (hedge fund types) by making them pay income tax instead of claiming it as capital gains. Why should they be able to skate?

There are a few folks like Bezos and Musk that fund their lifestyle by borrowing against their stock Essentially postponing tax. Easy, pass legislation you can do this fir a short time, 2 yrs, 5 yrs- whatever then tax is due. Problem solved.

My issue with the Dems is they make success a bad word…. they use the same strategy the Germans used against the Jews in the 1930s. They create a bad guy, the rich and then use that to get reelected. Nevermind it divides the country…and vilifies successful folks perpetuating the American dream.

Last time I checked, all of the large socialist countries have collapsed from their own weight.

.