Wyoming Hunter Fined $10,000 for Mistaking a Grizzly for a Black Bear

[Red Letters]

I do think this is a problem with fish and game. I’m not saying there shouldn’t be a punishment. But, there is a difference between purposefully/knowingly and negligence. Fish and game punishes good behavior. A good hearted guy trying to do the right thing gets crushed for it. This Never sends the right message to the people. I’ve seen fish and game do this to others several times before.

Heart of the law versus spirit of the law is something game wardens often don’t seem to understand. Just my personal opinion.

It sends the exact message he made with the satire in his video. It would make people think real hard about just apologizing internally and covering their tracks. If these guys wouldn’t have gone through the effort to tell their side of the story, they would have got a fine and a perceived “bad reputation” as a poacher by anyone just casually reading about the ordeal. Hell it happened in this thread after they cleared the air. Where’s the upside, the animal is already dead, the federal government won’t even notice the fine money either way.

 

[mulecreek]

Most everyone has. I haven't had a single person that has said they got it right. Yes, I believe so to your other question. In a DNA test on a bear harvested a several years ago by a hunter in the same situation as I and my son. The DNA came back with Black bear and Grizzly combined. The guy got off due to these results.

I watched your video earlier this week when the article came out in Cowboy State Daily. I got each griz or black question correct. To be honest the one in question I felt was easy to see it was a griz. True, that it did have a couple traits that were not slam-dunks but it leaned way more towards griz than black. Erring on the side of caution is needed when bear hunting. Particularly where you were hunting where it is probably more likely that you will see a griz than a black. This same caution needs to be shown towards determining sex of the bear. Given the female mortality quotas in Wyoming time needs to be taken to determine sex. If time does not present itself, such as the case of the bear your son shot then a pass needs to be taken.

I don't think for a second that either you or your son thought this was a griz. I give you both credit for owning up to the mistake. Its nice to know there are still folks that can live with the consequences of their actions regardless of how fair they think it is. But for me this one would have been an easy decision to pass.

 

[Elmer J. Fudd]

Not to joke over 10,000 bucks but were Muley Freak’s lawyers unavailable? Those guys could have probably got you a misdemeanor and a sponsorship

 

[Htm84]

Out of curiosity. What do you think your punishment should have been?

 

[molliesmaster]

Out of curiosity. What do you think your punishment should have been?

A free shovel and a gift card to Olive Garden.

Man did Wyoming a favor. Everyone knows it. Politicians gotta appease the whiny few though.

 

[KenLee]

Not to joke over 10,000 bucks but were Muley Freak’s lawyers unavailable? Those guys could have probably got you a misdemeanor and a sponsorship

Not really my business, but wondering if your lawyer recommended you take the plea? Prosecuters always overcharge, and that they didn't have the nads to charge your son leads me to believe they knew they couldn't win at trial.

 

[Revoa4]

Thats heavy. Ouch.

 

[OlRoyWhitetails]

Agreed. It can be really tough, as this is setting a precedence. Obviously hunters need to be confident before pulling a trigger, but it can be hard as you get into color phased bears out west.

 

[dieselchessy]

That video was cringey. I can’t imagine it set a good example for the kid.

The bear looks really small, like a just kicked out by mom size bear. In the video it’s hard to tell size reference, but the ears look goofy big on its head like a cub. In person I would expect it to be easier to judge size and age class.

I think that bear looked dark and more like a black because it was a young grizzly.

 

[Wrench]

Too bad property crimes against taxpayers are not prosecuted and crimes against game are over prosecuted. My coworker just came back from a jury trial over a heinous case of property and physical crimes against people with similar consequences.

Wake up and choose a life of crime or make a wrong decision in a snap situation getting equal punishment......something is very wrong with our system.

 

[Wrench]

Fwiw, I have had plenty of black and griz experience, served on a f&w board and had to test my knowledge on bears multiple times for the state.....and I too would have guessed #4 as a black based on what I saw.

 

[JjamesIII]

Not sure if there's already a thread on this, but what is everyone's opinion? I think the fine is pretty steep for a first time offender who was honest about his mistake.

https://www.outdoorlife.com/conservation/hunter-fined-bear-mistake/

Seriously, anything you say can and will be used against you in the court of law. When these agencies do this type of crap to honest people who make a mistake and “do the right thing” (not the smart thing) by self reporting…..that doesn’t give many people motivation to turn themselves in.

 

[dtrkyman]

I bet it wouldn't be 10g if you shot a blackie on a grizz tag, if that were possible somewhere!

For 10g I am taking my chances, SSS.

FYI, I have no plans on bear hunting Wyoming.

Hope he covers his fines with the youtube video.

 

[KenLee]

Too bad property crimes against taxpayers are not prosecuted and crimes against game are over prosecuted. My coworker just came back from a jury trial over a heinous case of property and physical crimes against people with similar consequences.

Wake up and choose a life of crime or make a wrong decision in a snap situation getting equal punishment......something is very wrong with our system.

Chopping hands ?

 

[dla]

What is a grizzly valued at?

Edit just looked it up Wyoming proposed tag fee is 7500

It is wrong to value a game animal as "a lost tag opportunity" - doesn't make sense at all. The state doesn't have an investment in the animal, the state isn't guaranteed a sale on the animal. Honestly, some of you need to think this through a bit better - that bear isn't an Angus steer.

The fine was outrageous. The only lesson taught is that there is no such thing as "an honest mistake". Classic administrative state stupidity.

Now you know why jury nullification exists. The guy should've faced a jury of his peers.

 

[z987k]

It is wrong to value a game animal as "a lost tag opportunity" - doesn't make sense at all. The state doesn't have an investment in the animal, the state isn't guaranteed a sale on the animal. Honestly, some of you need to think this through a bit better - that bear isn't an Angus steer.

The fine was outrageous. The only lesson taught is that there is no such thing as "an honest mistake". Classic administrative state stupidity.

Now you know why jury nullification exists. The guy should've faced a jury of his peers.

Ya, while I agree a fine is appropriate, the 10k is ridiculous. If I was on a jury for this and the prosecutor was asking 10k or worse, I'd be a not guilty as an F you to the prosecutor despite the fact that I would agree with a reasonable fine.
And since it doesn't really work that way, if after a guilty verdict, and assuming the jury sets the fine, $1 bob.
And make sure it's known the prosecutor is the reason for it. Tank his whole career if possible. We don't need people like that in office.

 

[Rotnguns]

Seems like a huge fail by WY. It's pretty rare to see poachers get charged anywhere near $10K for unlawfully killing multiple animals. This guy self reported and didn't even pull the trigger.

A hunter in Idaho who recently shot a grizzly got hammered. Over 12 000 in fines, 30 days jail, 3 years probation, cannot hunt for the rest of his life. He wasn't as honest as the fellow in Wyoming - only came forward when it was clear the jig was up.

 

[Spear0]

Crazy story I bet next time they will just keep quiet.

 

[KenLee]

Ya, while I agree a fine is appropriate, the 10k is ridiculous. If I was on a jury for this and the prosecutor was asking 10k or worse, I'd be a not guilty as an F you to the prosecutor despite the fact that I would agree with a reasonable fine.
And since it doesn't really work that way, if after a guilty verdict, and assuming the jury sets the fine, $1 bob.
And make sure it's known the prosecutor is the reason for it. Tank his whole career if possible. We don't need people like that in office.

Jury decides guilty or not guilty.
Judge issues the sentence, which can include fine amount and potential jail time.

 

[Kylerjay05]

If this was colorado, he would've faced a firing squad by comparison.