Why you should not take equity out or dump your 401 K to take super expensive hunts.

[MallardSX2]

I would imagine he's trying to point out that the government, in all its wisdom, regulates traditional 401ks and the age at which you can withdraw from the without penalty, i.e. 'retirement age'. Because most people see this as their only option, they fail to supplement their retirement with bridge accounts such as Roth 401ks/IRAs and brokerage accounts. Both can be withdrawn penalty free, and in the Roth's case, tax free, BEFORE the government's bogus retirement age to bridge those years. Most don't do this, however, and are forced to work until they can withdraw penalty free from their traditional 401k.

Rule of 55
72T

Lots of options.

 

[eamyrick]

There are so many people that want to live like today might be their last day on planet earth. It’s almost as if they are surprised when they wake up the next day…… Lol

Taking money from your 401(k) to fund hunting trips has got to be the stupidest thing I’ve ever read.

But, everyone has different goals. You do you and I will do me. Just don't let me hear your crying when you find out that you live into a ripe old age and your so broke you can't take a crummy bus tour with your wife

Say we are both 40 years old. Hypothetically I have 3.5 million in my 401k and you have 1.2 million in yours. Is it still the stupidest thing if I take out 30k to go on a bucket list hunt, all other things being equal?

It’s impossible to know someone’s financial situation on the internet. I have been listening to Dave Ramsey since he was on the radio and his ideals have inspired many of my financial decisions but I still use a credit card, occasionally use debt to my advantage, and have zero issue pulling out money for a hunt while I can still do it.

I think a debt ratio is probably a much better indicator of financial health. I still have debt and am going on a bucket list Grizzly Hunt next month but could also retire in 3.5 years and never work again.

 

[pacoalcracker]

Once you get so much money into your retirement account, at some point more is just a waste. You will never need it, you will never spend it and no matter who you leave it to outside of a charity, a huge amount of it will go to the tax man, and the rest will likely be wasted anyways. In addition, what is an 75 year old person going to do with millions if he can only look out his window while sitting in his wheelchair hooked up to an oxygen bottle? Your only satisfaction will be to count the number of zero's in the balance until the curtain drops. So, save and keep what you feel you will likely need and then enjoy the rest doing whatever the hell you want with it, while you can. My wife passed away 6 years ago. She got cancer at 55 and left this earth at 56. Very healthy otherwise. I will never forget these words.....I can't believe I'm dying and I'm only 56.

Eamyrick......I like your debt ratio thought.

 

[180ls1]

Once you get so much money into your retirement account, at some point more is just a waste. You will never need it, you will never spend it and no matter who you leave it to outside of a charity, a huge amount of it will go to the tax man, and the rest will likely be wasted anyways. In addition, what is an 75 year old person going to do with millions if he can only look out his window while sitting in his wheelchair hooked up to an oxygen bottle? Your only satisfaction will be to count the number of zero's in the balance until the curtain drops. So, save and keep what you feel you will likely need and then enjoy the rest doing whatever the hell you want with it, while you can. My wife passed away 6 years ago. She got cancer at 55 and left this earth at 56. Very healthy otherwise. I will never forget these words.....I can't believe I'm dying and I'm only 56.

Eamyrick......I like your debt ratio thought.

Wise words.

I am sorry to hear that.

 

[huntnful]

Anyone know if the market (say S&P) is still doubling your money every 7 years without any additional money added? If so, I probably don't need any more in my 401K. I never really thought about it. I always just max it out for the tax break and the company much. I highly doubt I'll need 6 million dollars when I'm 59 1/2 though.

I could invest it in my personal account which I'm going to use to hopefully retire early, and bridge the gap until I can draw a pension at 55.

Just thinking out loud. I'll be fine either way, but I love getting feedback from people more knowledgeable than myself.

 

[MallardSX2]

ML season will have the following hunters:

ML elk
ML deer
Archery Elk
Archery Deer
Rifle Bear
ML Bear
Archery Bear
ML Moose
Archery Moose

1st Rifle will have the following hunters:

Rifle Elk

Say we are both 40 years old. Hypothetically I have 3.5 million in my 401k and you have 1.2 million in yours. Is it still the stupidest thing if I take out 30k to go on a bucket list hunt, all other things being equal?

It’s impossible to know someone’s financial situation on the internet. I have been listening to Dave Ramsey since he was on the radio and his ideals have inspired many of my financial decisions but I still use a credit card, occasionally use debt to my advantage, and have zero issue pulling out money for a hunt while I can still do it.

I think a debt ratio is probably a much better indicator of financial health. I still have debt and am going on a bucket list Grizzly Hunt next month but could also retire in 3.5 years and never work again.

Honestly, yes, strictly speaking from an early penalty and tax ramification perspective, I still feel that is a very poor choice. You’ll potentially have to take out 60k to get 30k and that’s just a bad financial decision (for most people). I believe if I was in a position to potentially have 6 million in a handful of years, I would do that and file a 72T and retire at 47 getting $150,000-$235,000 a year and do my hunt then but I guess if you don’t mind giving away your money, then hey, do whatever blows your dress up. It’s your choice to make and we could all die tomorrow, odds are you won’t.

It’s probably a trade off anyhow because a $30,000 grizzly hunt today will in 6-8 years likely cost $60,000-$80,000. lol

Spend your money how ya want and good luck on your grizzly hunt!

 

[Mike D Texas]

You act like a 401k isn't thier money, when it most certainly is.

A 401k is simply an investment instrument with strings attached to DISCOURAGE early withdrawal, if your not discouraged go enjoy the fruits of your labor.

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How in the world did you come to that conclusion?

Of course it’s their money but they tied it up in an investment in their future with known, stiff penalties for early withdrawals.


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[Axlrod]

I would imagine he's trying to point out that the government, in all its wisdom, regulates traditional 401ks and the age at which you can withdraw from the without penalty, i.e. 'retirement age'. Because most people see this as their only option, they fail to supplement their retirement with bridge accounts such as Roth 401ks/IRAs and brokerage accounts. Both can be withdrawn penalty free, and in the Roth's case, tax free, BEFORE the government's bogus retirement age to bridge those years. Most don't do this, however, and are forced to work until they can withdraw penalty free from their traditional 401k.

So you believe the people that "fail to supplement" because they have a 401k, would otherwise do so if they didn't have a 401k?
Probably not, they would still "fail to supplement" and not have anything saved when they retire. Sadly a lot of people need discipline provided to them.

 

[Wrench]

I'm trying to wrap my head around having enough financial responsibility to save money in a 401k to a size large enough to support the cost levels we're discussing....and then being willing to take the huge hits on it vs just running a separate post tax account.

I'm entering my last 10 years of required work. I just watched groceries and insurance go up 100 plus % in a few years.

Whatever you choose.....make sure you can flow your life when you get to the point that you are unable to generate income.

 

[MallardSX2]

^^^ I think it is stating the obvious here, but most people should only put into a 401K to get the full employer match and then put the rest of their money in other individual accounts that are available. I would be putting it somewhere that it could be easily accessed "penalty free" to bridge a gap from retirement until 59-1/2 or for a rainy day. I always thought that was just common sense.

Some people are better off having it "locked up" until they are 59-1/2 though...

 

[RidgeRunner1018]

So you believe the people that "fail to supplement" because they have a 401k, would otherwise do so if they didn't have a 401k?
Probably not, they would still "fail to supplement" and not have anything saved when they retire. Sadly a lot of people need discipline provided to them.

That's difficult to answer without knowing what the default retirement vehicle for most employers would be if a traditional 401k didn't exist. The purpose of my original post was to expand on what I thought the post I was quoting(#32 and #40) was meant to convey.

 

[cbeard64]

I am 60 years old . I have lots of friends who are hyper-focused on maximizing their retirement savings. As a result, they have never done much in the way of travel, adventure hunts, and other things my wife and I have enjoyed doing for years. My wife retired from teaching at 55 and I recently retired also. We are enjoying life together on our own terms. Travel, extended time with our grandson, etc. It is a wonderful time in our lives.

In essence, we have lived the life we wanted and traded having the next 10 years for ourselves vs. having another million or two in our retirement account when we are 70. To me, it was a no-brainer. I don’t see the point in sacrificing living the life you want just so you can watch your 401K reach a huge number after most of life has passed you by.

In short, there is more to life than money.

 

[sasquatch]

I am 60 years old . I have lots of friends who are hyper-focused on maximizing their retirement savings. As a result, they have never done much in the way of travel, adventure hunts, and other things my wife and I have enjoyed doing for years. My wife retired from teaching at 55 and I recently retired also. We are enjoying life together on our own terms. Travel, extended time with our grandson, etc. It is a wonderful time in our lives.

In essence, we have lived the life we wanted and traded having the next 10 years for ourselves vs. having another million or two in our retirement account when we are 70. To me, it was a no-brainer. I don’t see the point in sacrificing living the life you want just so you can watch your 401K reach a huge number after most of life has passed you by.

In short, there is more to life than money.

This, but I think or I’d assume most of the hyper focused plan to retire a lot earlier than 60.?

That way they have a lot of life left when they become free, this also prevents a huge account balance at 70 as they started spending it down a lot earlier.

But I get your point. It matches well with a saying I like to use, “the richest person in the world can’t buy back yesterday”

Another common quote, “don’t give up life today hoping to buy it back later”


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[roadrunner]

HE keeps them in the same economic class their entire life?
News flash genius, a freaking shit ton of people that never heard of or can spell Dave Ramsey stay in the same economic class their entire life!

Pathetic response. Ramsey "teaches" people how to live on a budget where they currently are.

But you keep on being you

 

[KenLee]

It doesn't matter to me what anyone does with their money. If a guy can afford a crazy expensive hunt and considers it one of his priorities, well then good luck to him. If a guy can't really afford it and goes into debt for, again good luck to him.
I personally have a 3/4 slam and would need a stone to complete it. I could book a hunt tomorrow if I wanted too. But for me personally it just feels selfish. I would rather go on nice vacations with my wife and daughter. And leave my daughter something when I'm gone. To each his own.

Buy plenty of life insurance.

 

[180ls1]

This, but I think or I’d assume most of the hyper focused plan to retire a lot earlier than 60.?

That way they have a lot of life left when they become free, this also prevents a huge account balance at 70 as they started spending it down a lot earlier.

But I get your point. It matches well with a saying I like to use, “the richest person in the world can’t buy back yesterday”

Another common quote, “don’t give up life today hoping to buy it back later”


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Yeah, the biggest issue is when people sacrifice one chapter of their life for another. The goal is to maximize every chapter of your life while preparing for the next.

 

[cbeard64]

This, but I think or I’d assume most of the hyper focused plan to retire a lot earlier than 60.?

That way they have a lot of life left when they become free, this also prevents a huge account balance at 70 as they started spending it down a lot earlier.

But I get your point. It matches well with a saying I like to use, “the richest person in the world can’t buy back yesterday”

Another common quote, “don’t give up life today hoping to buy it back later”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

I retired fully at 60 but we also made time for ourselves during our work lives. Lots of hunting and travel. (For example, I completed the grand slam before I retired.) Plus, I never took work with me. When I was away, I was not to be bothered absent an emergency. Lee Iococa once said that if a man can’t take 6 weeks off during the year then he is not doing work right.

 

[Mojave]

Best comment on this thread!

I know a couple of folks that got an inheritance and burned $50,000 on Tanzania African safari. First trip overseas, shot everything that $50,000 paid for and have nothing left.

Not uncommon.

My taxidermist used to have a pair of Argali's in his shop. The guy had oil field money in the 1980's and went, and then couldn't afford to pick them up. So they were in his shop for years. One was a Marco Polo and the other was a Ovis Ammon.

 

[cbeard64]

Yeah, the biggest issue is when people sacrifice one chapter of their life for another. The goal is to maximize every chapter of your life while preparing for the next.

Yes, it’s a balancing act for sure. One of the reasons I went to school for 7 years was to maximize my income so that we could afford to live life to the fullest during all the chapters of our lives.

 

[Mojave]

Say we are both 40 years old. Hypothetically I have 3.5 million in my 401k and you have 1.2 million in yours. Is it still the stupidest thing if I take out 30k to go on a bucket list hunt, all other things being equal?

It’s impossible to know someone’s financial situation on the internet. I have been listening to Dave Ramsey since he was on the radio and his ideals have inspired many of my financial decisions but I still use a credit card, occasionally use debt to my advantage, and have zero issue pulling out money for a hunt while I can still do it.

I think a debt ratio is probably a much better indicator of financial health. I still have debt and am going on a bucket list Grizzly Hunt next month but could also retire in 3.5 years and never work again.

If you are 40 years old and have 3.5 million or 1.5millino in your 401K. You don't have to ask anyone's permission to hunt sheep.

Most of these people are 30-60 and have 80,000 in their 401K. Or have nothing in their 401K.