Which Red Dot for a Pistol?

[slowr1der]

I'm hoping to pick up a Glock in 10mm soon with the MOS system. I'd like to add a red dot on top to use for deer hunting. I just don't have much experience with micro dots. The only two I've had have been a Burris FastFire 3 and a Vortex Razor. I have no complaints about the FastFire 3, but it's been on a 22. So I'm not sure it's a fair comparison. The Razor has been a disappointment because it recently failed despite really not having much use. On the plus side Vortex did replace it quickly for me. While it was working, I was pretty happy with it.

So that's led me to research other options. I think I've pretty much ruled out the Trijicon RMR line despite it initially being my original #1 choice. I know the warranty doesn't mean everything and that the best warranty is one you never have to use. I'd prefer durability over a warranty, but I'm just seeing too many reports of the RMR failing to feel comfortable with a 5 year warranty. I'm seeing similar amounts of complaints as to what I am seeing with the other brands, but they all have a lifetime warranty vs 5 years.

Some co-workers like Holosun, but I have the same concern. They have a 10 year warranty which leaves me feeling like I'm going to be buying another one after the warranty is up and it fails. It seems like from what I'm reading that all of these things have a somewhat limited life and failures aren't uncommon. At least with one of the companies with a lifetime warranty, they can just keep replacing it.

So that brings me back to Burris, Vortex, and Leupold. I know what my experiences are with the FastFire 3 and Razor and it has me tempted to go with another FF3. My only hesitation is that almost every thread I read people like the Vortex Venom and Razor over the FF3 due to the additional brightness adjustments, and the fact that the FF3 turns itself off. Which I don't necessarily love about the FF3. This has led me back to another Vortex Razor, although I'm not opposed to the Venom. I'm not set against it, but I'm just not sold on it either after the failure I had. I've also had numerous Vortex scopes fail, which hasn't left the best taste in my mouth.

Then there is the Leupold Delta Point Pro. Initially I thought this might be the one. I really like most everything I'm reading about it. My hesitation comes from the fact that I have been unhappy with pretty much every Leupold scope I've owned and I've tried a bunch. I've had numerous failures, none that tracked correctly, several that lost zero with slight bumps, etc. 15 years ago when you would post online about this, you'd get bashed for days by Leupold fan boys. I find it comical to see how may people now are posting the same things that I've been saying about Leupold for 15 years. I'm worried the posts about this red dot may be the same scenario. People love them based on the name. Almost every report around the time it came out is positive, while I've ready several a few years later indicating the electronics failed. Although I'm seeing this with every brand. This one really seems promising, but I'm really hesitant.

Has anyone used all three? Does anyone have any recommendations? I'm open to other suggestions as well. I'm starting to think there may just not be a perfect red dot.

 

[Turkeygetpwnd38]

There are only a few that actually work, the gold standard being the Trijicon RMR. Do some digging on Sage Dynamics/Aaron Cowan.

 

[elkguide]

I have a couple of the Trijicon SROs on my competition pistols and they have been great.

 

[IBen]

Get a regular glock and send it out to get milled. I think I sent my to a place in Michigan that was very good. I havent been following the gun industry lately but when i was rmr 3.25 dot was the standard.

 

[IBen]

^Jagerwerks was the place

 

[Snicklefritz]

I know a few guys that have used the DPP, but I think watching sage dynamics videos would be the best way to make your decision.

 

[sierracharlie338]

I run a holosun on one gun with zero issues and know 10 plus other people that are in the same boat and carry it every day, you are doing yourself a disservice by not considering them especially over the vortex and other "budget" brands. I had to get over the stigma of buying an "off brand" when I purchased mine as well. Of course the Trijicon SRO and RMR are the way most people would go if they dont mind the price tag. The Leupold Deltapoint is another solid option that gets overlooked and generally falls between the previous two in price. Out of the three ive mentioned I dont think you can go wrong depending on your budget.

As a side note, if you have never shot with a red dot and are a proficient handgun shooter, there will be a learning curve to get used to finding the dot and not chasing it on the target versus the iron sights. I suggest maybe going a less expensive route until you know you will like it? Totally your call and budget.

 

[sierracharlie338]

^Jagerwerks was the place

Great company that does great work in my experience

 

[eamyrick]

My PD of 1600 officers rigorously tested most of the available options. The Aimpoint Acro P2 was chosen. I’ve seen them pretty beaten up and still work. My only complaint is the lack of auto brightness. Working at night vs day I definitely need to bump it down a level. The new Trijicon (tested by Sage Dymamics), seems very promising.

 

[CCooper]

I did an EOTech EFLX late last year on a Springfield Elite 9mm. So far so good. I have been happy with all of the EOTech products I have tried.

 

[Bearwhisky]

Trijicon RMR is the most durable open emitter red dot on the market.


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[Kurts86]

The Holosun 507c is absolutely a better optic than a Trijicon RMR. It has better glass, a bigger window better electronics and cost less while maintaining a high level of durability. The RMR is a legacy product with a bottom load battery, really blue glass tint and a tiny window because the ear shaped frame eats up window size. The RMR is American made and super durable and 5-10 years ago they were the only viable pistol optic so they have a massive presence for that reason. The RMR replacements just came out a month or 2 ago so RMR’s are cheap right now and the new stuff is still unobtainable.

Both Holosun 507c/RMR’s are rapidly being replaced by closed emitter dots like the Holosun EPS and Aimpoint Acro P2. The whole market is shifting that way and I would chose a closed emitter optic on a G20 for weather resistance alone.

There is no reason to run any Burris/Leupold red dot. They offer no advantages over a Holosun. Pick between Aimpoint, Trijicon and Holosun based on price and features.

 

[Fowl Play]

Not a pistol, but I have run several different red dots across multiple 12 gauge turkey guns. Not getting the slide action, but a 3.5" turkey round is no slouch.

That being said I have had two Burris FF3's give out after 3-4 years. Don't use them anymore. The Vortex's are worse.

I currently have 2x Holosun 507's and like them the best so far. But only have 2 years on them. Time will tell.

The closed cell emitter Holosuns look very nice, an early morning fog can cause my current red dot's to get all "starry eyed" on me.

 

[croben]

Go with a closed emitter. The Trijicon RMR is bomb proof, but the open emitter can lead to problems with dirt/debris and different weather conditions. You also have to remove the sight to change the battery with the RMR. I own two of them and used them for about 6 six years now, but I wouldn’t buy another one. I personally like the Aimpoint Acro and the Holosun HE509T.

 

[Gone4Days]

I carry a personal g19 with a Holosun 508T and a g45 duty pistol with a Aimpoint Acro. I like both.

For duty carry, 100% the Acro.
For personal ccw carry, the holosun no doubt.

Holosun is good to go. Our dept issues them on some duty weapons (good size dept 400+ sworn officers). Stay away from Leupold DPP. Our dept no longer uses them for reliability issues and battery life.

I chose the Holosun over the RMR after testing both. I didn’t like the small window and blue tint of the RMR. Also battery changes are a PITA with RMR (remove optic and re-zero). I went with the 508T with green dot and don’t regret a thing.

The only other issue with the best closed emitters (Acro & 509) are the proprietary footprints. I hate the MOS and wouldn’t personally use it on my carry pistols. Milled slides are the way to go. Plates are a big source of failure.

Depends on role.

 

[Bubblehide]

I belive Form tested a closed emitter abd recommeds it. I'd do a search on his posts.

 

[FLS]

Trijicon SRO. I’ve had them on my competition guns , Glocks and 2011’s, since they came out. It’s got a top load battery, large sight window, and mine have been dead nuts reliable. The Vortex, Burris, Cmore, and Leupold dots all failed at some point. I’ve used the Holosuns but not e enough to be able to comment on their reliability.

 

[slowr1der]

There are only a few that actually work, the gold standard being the Trijicon RMR. Do some digging on Sage Dynamics/Aaron Cowan.

Thanks. I hadn't heard of him, but I've been watching some of his videos. His tests seem pretty good. It seems like he really prefers the RMR. Maybe that's the way I should go, but the short warranty just concerns me. Reading that you have to remove the optic to change the battery is another big downside for me.

Something else I didn't mention in the original post, since cost isn't necessarily a factor, is that Leupold, Vortex, Burris, Holosun, and a few others also offer us a discount though work. I don't get one through Trijicon. So while they are similarly priced at retail, I can get the Vortex Razor or the Leupold DPP for about half of the cost of the Trijicon, with a better warranty that won't leave me having to buy another one in 5 years.

 

[Turkeygetpwnd38]

Thanks. I hadn't heard of him, but I've been watching some of his videos. His tests seem pretty good. It seems like he really prefers the RMR. Maybe that's the way I should go, but the short warranty just concerns me. Reading that you have to remove the optic to change the battery is another big downside for me.

Something else I didn't mention in the original post, since cost isn't necessarily a factor, is that Leupold, Vortex, Burris, Holosun, and a few others also offer us a discount though work. I don't get one through Trijicon. So while they are similarly priced at retail, I can get the Vortex Razor or the Leupold DPP for about half of the cost of the Trijicon, with a better warranty that won't leave me having to buy another one in 5 years.

You keep saying cost/warranty aren’t the main factor but then explaining why they are. Durability and reliability should be the only criteria. You’ve been given some good advice here, figure out if you want and open or closed emitter, pick between Holosun or trijicon, maybe aim point.

For what it’s worth, I have 4 RMRs all over 5 years old. Batteries last over 2 years, I’ve never had to rezero after a swap. The debris concern with open emitter is valid, not so much for ruining the sight, but occasionally for blocking out the dot. That’s a big deal for some, others not so much. I believe trijicon has a $100 rebate for RMRs right now, so with some looking you should be able to get one under $400.

 

[Fowl Play]

Thanks. I hadn't heard of him, but I've been watching some of his videos. His tests seem pretty good. It seems like he really prefers the RMR. Maybe that's the way I should go, but the short warranty just concerns me. Reading that you have to remove the optic to change the battery is another big downside for me.

Something else I didn't mention in the original post, since cost isn't necessarily a factor, is that Leupold, Vortex, Burris, Holosun, and a few others also offer us a discount though work. I don't get one through Trijicon. So while they are similarly priced at retail, I can get the Vortex Razor or the Leupold DPP for about half of the cost of the Trijicon, with a better warranty that won't leave me having to buy another one in 5 years.

I think you will be unhappy with the two you are leaning towards. A warranty means nothing when you have a failed optic in the field or when you need it.

Is it a work specific discount? Expertvoice gets me 40% off trijicon. Not only military, it extends to DOD and government contractors as well.