What’s your balance between cardio and heavy weights?

[Poser]

Good read on the subject matter.

How to Do Conditioning: It Depends | Nick Delgadillo

"[T]he Principle of Diminishing Returns coupled with the stress, recovery, adaptation cycle, and the need for complexity, individualization, and specific programming at any given time – applies to conditioning as well [as strength training]."

startingstrength.com

 

[Dragonfish]

Good read on the subject matter.

How to Do Conditioning: It Depends | Nick Delgadillo

"[T]he Principle of Diminishing Returns coupled with the stress, recovery, adaptation cycle, and the need for complexity, individualization, and specific programming at any given time – applies to conditioning as well [as strength training]."

startingstrength.com

Thanks for sharing, validates my approach getting ready for my sheep hunt this august. spent the last 18 months getting stronger- starting in April, plan to spend more time on conditioning.

 

[justinspicher]

It seems like some of your programs are pretty complicated. That’s probably why I don’t do them. I’d lose interest pretty fast.

 

[cuttiebrownbow]

I love lifting heavy and I hate cardio so I feel you there. I am 5'9" and 200lbs as well so we have very similar stats. I

My compromise has been lifting three times a week hitting bench, squat and deadlift for 4 sets of 6 for my heavy sets and then accessory work plus cardio 3 for 30 minutes times a week.

This has been working and I have actually lost 10 lbs the past month (although most of that was christmas cookie weight)

I do know that I can run a lot easier for much longer once I get down to 185 so that is my goal.

My workout this morning looked like

Bench (warm up) then 4x6
Cable Crossovers 4x12
db incline bench 4x8
Tri pulldown 4x12

Squat (warm up) then 4x6
Walking lunges 4x10 paces
Calf raises 4x12

Bench I am just doing 255lbs for the set of 6 and squat I am at 275. My bench hasn't seen strength loss with my running and weight loss but my squat has.

I did 1rm max after my bench sets last week and I got 355 up easy. I would love to get 400lbs when I weight 185.

 

[zog]

Mobility!

Personal experience, not a trainer . . .

Years ago at 45 I got in what felt like the best shape of my life, training for a pack-in archery hunt. Cardio (running and carrying a 50 lb pack walking) and lifting. But I neglected the most important - mobility. Neither cardio or lifting prepared me enough for climbing/high stepping over deadfall, shimmying up and slipping down ravines, sidehilling, climbing up and down rock faces, hopping streams, and slipping on my butt, all while keeping my bow unharmed. The second morning (first overnight) I hurt so bad in my core, hips, upper thighs I just wanted to quit! I almost let everybody else go on and was going to stay in and recover. I was the slowest of the four all trip.

The problem is that longer cardio like running and cycling just doesn't involve enough movement. My heart and lungs were in tremendous shape, but my core and hips were weak.

Lesson learned - the next season prep I did less cardio/lifting and way more mobility, balance, and core. Swing kicks, turkish getups, bench vaults, rope climbing, one leg deadlifts, skaters, lunges and side lunges, box jumps, etc. plus a short but good stretching routine that I did in camp as well. Second morning of that hunt on the same route as the prior year, my feet ached but nothing else did. I was up and at 'em before light, and often in front. Even with less cardio prep my heart and lungs were just as capable to get me up a mountain because my body was easier to mobilize. Makes sense, huh?

I hope you are lifting properly by including lots of stretching and mobility. Those walking lunges are great, do more of that stuff and do them sideways and over benches and stuff. You'll be 45 before you know it, then you'll be . . . 46.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

I lift 2-3x per week, I don't really care about being as strong as absolutely possible because for me, I think cardio is more important, strength is important too but I dont care if I squat 315 vs 300lbs, I dont see how that would help me more than having good cardio.

Yesterday, my squats were 300lbs, Deadlifts 405 and OHP was 145, IMO thats ok for me, I'm mostly focused on cardio stuff right now but I'm trying to keep a base level of strength. No, I;m not as strong as when I was power lifting but I don't care.

 

[LostArra]

I lift 2-3x per week, I don't really care about being as strong as absolutely possible because for me, I think cardio is more important, strength is important too but I dont care if I squat 315 vs 300lbs, I dont see how that would help me more than having good cardio.

Yesterday, my squats were 300lbs, Deadlifts 405 and OHP was 145, IMO thats ok for me, I'm mostly focused on cardio stuff right now but I'm trying to keep a base level of strength. No, I;m not as strong as when I was power lifting but I don't care.

I think the strength issue comes into play for the 3 hour marathon runner squatting 90#, not someone squatting 300#.

 

[Pigdog]

My only advice on training is to make sure you spend a fair amount of time hiking with your pack weighted and your boots on. Your feet will thank you. You can be in great shape, but if your feet get thrashed on the first day your hunt is going to suck. Sore and fatigued muscles are much easier to push through than blisters.

 

[GLB]

Everybody has to figure out what works for them. For me everyday is leg day and everyday is cardio day. I try to combine both in my workouts by doing a lot of lifts and carry.
I use sandbags (Brute Force) for the lift and carry and do it on stairs. I also do a lot with Kettle Bells and Farmer’s Walk with dumbbells. I also add stretch bands exercise deadlifts and Turkish get ups with plenty of of weighted pack hikes.
I am lucky that I live in the mountains so no excuse for me.

 

[Poser]

I think the strength issue comes into play for the 3 hour marathon runner squatting 90#, not someone squatting 300#.

Yeah, obviously, he has built a solid strength base and is likely somewhere around or close to being at the end of what is practical to maintain while improving conditioning for hunting. As you stated, the guy who stands to benefit the most from improved strength is the person who goes from no deadlift to a 275# deadlift and shoulders that heavy pack with some strong spinal erectors. Likewise, the guy who is 100% off the couch in January for hunting season in September will benefit more from several months of strength training before tackling conditioning. When it comes time to start conditioning, strength limitations won’t be a factor.

It doesn’t have to be a big, complicated and time Consuming undertaking. A novice lifter can train 3 lifts, 3 times a week in 1 hour sessions and reasonably double, triple, even quadruple their strength in 3-4 months. All that time people are apparently spending “doing core” would be better applied to squatting, pressing and deadlifting since those movement sufficiently train the “core” in a systematic way. The “cores” job is to protect the spine. If you can deadlift 300# with a straight back, you have a strong “core”. If you desire a 6 pack, that is a separate thread, but the “core” never works in isolation when doing anything “functional” in the real world and there’s really no reason to train it in isolation if your desired outcome is performance. Again, if you want pretty abs, go for it, but squatting, deadlifting and pressing will result in a “core” that is far stronger than any isolation training will produce. Also “core” includes the hips and lower back.

 

[JTS]

This is a really good thread and I'm surprised to see Starting Strength mentioned here. I work out in Rips gym and Nick (the guy who wrote the above article) actually helped program my workouts while getting ready for elk and sheep hunts over the last couple years. My workouts were basically lift hard (squat, dead lift, bench and press) and a couple months before the hunt beat yourself up on the prowler a couple times a week.

Btw I'm 46 5'10 220lbs and had been doing crossfit for a few years before starting to workout at Rips gym. My squats went up from 225 for 5x5 to 365 for 5x5, bench from 190 5x5 to 290 5x5. I was a bit worried about not doing crossfit type workouts prior to my hunts but I actually felt well prepared while on my hunts.

 

[Dragonfish]

This is a really good thread and I'm surprised to see Starting Strength mentioned here. I work out in Rips gym and Nick (the guy who wrote the above article) actually helped program my workouts while getting ready for elk and sheep hunts over the last couple years. My workouts were basically lift hard (squat, dead lift, bench and press) and a couple months before the hunt beat yourself up on the prowler a couple times a week.

Btw I'm 46 5'10 220lbs and had been doing crossfit for a few years before starting to workout at Rips gym. My squats went up from 225 for 5x5 to 365 for 5x5, bench from 190 5x5 to 290 5x5. I was a bit worried about not doing crossfit type workouts prior to my hunts but I actually felt well prepared while on my hunts.

great to hear that you felt well prepared. I don't have access to a prowler, but i think taking the same approach that you did, and rucking my tail off the last two months before the sheep hunt will get me as ready as i can be.

 

[chukar_chaser]

I have a hard time with cardio. I just can’t focus for more than 15 mins. I now lift heavy for 5 days and play racquetball for an hour 3 days a week. Been working for me .

 

[*zap*]

Looks like I can read a book while using some of the bikes at my gym.....wanted to start liss a few days a week and I was looking at that situation last night.

 

[Poser]

This is a really good thread and I'm surprised to see Starting Strength mentioned here. I work out in Rips gym and Nick (the guy who wrote the above article) actually helped program my workouts while getting ready for elk and sheep hunts over the last couple years. My workouts were basically lift hard (squat, dead lift, bench and press) and a couple months before the hunt beat yourself up on the prowler a couple times a week.

Btw I'm 46 5'10 220lbs and had been doing crossfit for a few years before starting to workout at Rips gym. My squats went up from 225 for 5x5 to 365 for 5x5, bench from 190 5x5 to 290 5x5. I was a bit worried about not doing crossfit type workouts prior to my hunts but I actually felt well prepared while on my hunts.

That’s pretty cool. Being local to that gym, you may not fully realize how widespread and influential SS methods and programming are.

Out of curiosity, how much rucking did you do and how was it incorporated? While I definitely agree that you could get to where you need be following the above program, at a minimum, one still needs to get used to wearing a pack, get the fit dialed in with weight and get their feet and ankles ready. Even after a summer of intensive Mtn biking and strength maintenance, my first scouting mission usually results in some beat up feet. That being said, 3 weekend trips of scouting and I’m good to go. Across the board, my experience has been that reasonable sport specific conditioning shape can be achieved in 3 weeks with an appropriate strength base. I’ve found that true for Mtn biking, ski mountaineering and hunting. For that reason, I’m always trying to recommend to people on here to spend most of their year working on their strength base. I know the prevailing philosophy on Rokslide is to “cardio junky” your way into hunting shape, but that philosophy begs the question of how one can truly know their aerobic potential without sufficient a strength base?

 

[bruceleroy]

Lifting weights is far more important to back country and high country hunters than a cardio program.
At the end of the day if you did cardio to the point that your resting heart rate is hovering around 40 (really good and cardio fit) you will be lacking the strength to climb and push through the steep hikes and carrying a load at elevation. The only person or thing that cares that your resting rate is 40 is your heart rate monitor. Thats it.
We, as a society, have shifted from placing the proper amount of emphasis on strength. Being strong is awesome.
While working with Soldiers and Special Forces we noticed that even the ones that didnt run with any consistency but could squat 315 pounds around 12 times, deadlift 415 around ten times and could overhead press 150 pounds never lacked the ability (strength) to crush their 2 mile run for record. In fact, they could run just as far as before and they seemed to enjoy it more because they werent always beating up their bodies running endless, pointless miles.

 

[JTS]

That’s pretty cool. Being local to that gym, you may not fully realize how widespread and influential SS methods and programming are.

Out of curiosity, how much rucking did you do and how was it incorporated? While I definitely agree that you could get to where you need be following the above program, at a minimum, one still needs to get used to wearing a pack, get the fit dialed in with weight and get their feet and ankles ready. Even after a summer of intensive Mtn biking and strength maintenance, my first scouting mission usually results in some beat up feet. That being said, 3 weekend trips of scouting and I’m good to go. Across the board, my experience has been that reasonable sport specific conditioning shape can be achieved in 3 weeks with an appropriate strength base. I’ve found that true for Mtn biking, ski mountaineering and hunting. For that reason, I’m always trying to recommend to people on here to spend most of their year working on their strength base. I know the prevailing philosophy on Rokslide is to “cardio junky” your way into hunting shape, but that philosophy begs the question of how one can truly know their aerobic potential without sufficient a strength base?

Personally I don't do much rucking. I have a farm/ranch and will wear my hunting boots some just to get the calluses going in the correct spots. We are super flat here in Wichita Falls and I would have to drive an hour just to get some hill work in so I don't bother. My feet still get a little beat up after 5 days in the rocks. I'm sure my shoulders would feel better if I did put in more time with a heavy pack prior to my hunts, but it really isn't a big problem.

 

[Coach Chris]

Thank you. Any recommendations on the programs?

Mike Prevost: Ruck Training Programs - PART 1 - On Target Publications

Interested in the potential offered by ruck training? Because of its history as a means of military conveyance, there’s plenty of information out there on rucking. Mike Prevost sorts through it with you to help get you started.

www.otpbooks.com

Mike Prevost: Ruck Training Programs - PART 2 - On Target Publications

Interested in the potential offered by ruck training? In Part One, Mike Prevost covered the research. Here he puts it all together in two programs to get you rucking.

www.otpbooks.com

 

[MattyWight]

Second HIITS if you're really keen to crush mountains.

I run/hike/ride 3-5 times a week in hilly areas. I try go fast uphills to simulate HIITS. Not taking things serious enough to do dedicated HIITS sessions.

3-4 sessions in the gym. These are strength sessions with a big emphasis on core and legs. Box jumps, lunges and pistol squats are great for mountain fitness.

I have a session dedicated to stretching each week too. This has been excellent as I've started getting closer to 40.

 

[CB2900]

I love lifting heavy and I hate cardio so I feel you there. I am 5'9" and 200lbs as well so we have very similar stats. I

My compromise has been lifting three times a week hitting bench, squat and deadlift for 4 sets of 6 for my heavy sets and then accessory work plus cardio 3 for 30 minutes times a week.


I feel ya. That’s about where I would like to be weight wise. I graduated high school at 175 and lean. I feel good at 190. Hopefully 180 will feel better. However the only time I have gotten in the 180’s since high school I was as weak as a sick kitten.

This has been working and I have actually lost 10 lbs the past month (although most of that was christmas cookie weight)

I do know that I can run a lot easier for much longer once I get down to 185 so that is my goal.

My workout this morning looked like

Bench (warm up) then 4x6
Cable Crossovers 4x12
db incline bench 4x8
Tri pulldown 4x12

Squat (warm up) then 4x6
Walking lunges 4x10 paces
Calf raises 4x12

Bench I am just doing 255lbs for the set of 6 and squat I am at 275. My bench hasn't seen strength loss with my running and weight loss but my squat has.

I did 1rm max after my bench sets last week and I got 355 up easy. I would love to get 400lbs when I weight 185.