To Upgrade or not - based on Axle to Axle

[fatlander]

Cam size has more to do with string angle than ATA. There are 31 inch bows that have the same string angle as older 35s.

That’s true. But we’re not talking about him getting rid of a 3 year old for a 15 year old 35” bow. If he buys any of the 33+” bows built since his current bow or forward, he’s going to have a much better string angle. Period.

Coming from 28” , a 31” bow would do him wonders; 33” would be even better.


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[nphunter]

Anyone who is saying ATA length doesn't matter has no idea what they are talking about or are trying to make themselves feel better about shooting a less accurate short ATA bow. Shorter bows have some advantages for hunting but zero for accuracy. Almost every pro shooter shoots long ATA bows and every company's target bows are long ATA, which should tell you more than anyone's opinions on an internet forum.

The most accurate bows have, longer ATA, larger BH and very little reflex or some deflex in the riser. Target bows aren't being sold or advertised to shoot from blinds or stands or pack around the woods they are made to be as accurate and forgiving as possible. If giant cams and short bows were more accurate or more forgiving you would see them lined up at all of the archery competitions, they are not and have never been, the whole string angle thing is a sales gimmick, a new 35" bow will be more accurate and forgiving than a new 30" bow.

The bows I was talking about in my previous post were not new 34" & 37" bows, they were 10yr old Strothers Archery bows with long ATA and large BH and they were both more forgiving and accurate than my new 29" Hoyt RX4 with supposed better string angle and wide limb pockets.

 

[Zac]

That’s true. But we’re not talking about him getting rid of a 3 year old for a 15 year old 35” bow. If he buys any of the 33+” bows built since his current bow or forward, he’s going to have a much better string angle. Period.

Coming from 28” , a 31” bow would do him wonders; 33” would be even better.


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It may, however string angle was never his problem. Come to think of it he never did have a problem to begin with. I cringe to think of what the OP will do when someone tells him that micro diameter arrows are the best in the wind.

 

[InteriorAKPopsicle]

Thanks everyone - I know that archers are extremally passionate about our sport.
I want to give myself the best chance for success and accuracy not in the yard but in that heart pumping moment on the tundra.

I appreciate all the conversation and I will agree that I have gotten into my own head a bit about this. But I like to know that I'm setting myself up for success so I am the only factor to fail and that is why I even started considering this. Lots of good stuff out there, some cool bows and a lot of fun to be had.

I'll see if the wife can help me talk sense into myself.

@Zac HA! I already have changed my mind about arrows but I won't get into that hear and has nothing to do with Diameter. I also have decided I don't like the broadheads I've used as they are extremely hard to find after the local shop shut down and nobody else seems to have heard of them. So I'm planning on switching up quite a bit this season anyway. Might as well be the whole kit and kaboodle right?

In all seriousness I haven't been involved in the archery world much. I drew a sheep tag in 2020 and planned a massive hunt - shot some bows and went with what was recommended by the shop for everything else. I shot almost daily for 2 years straight and then due to some circumstances at home I stopped shooting regularly and had to change my target setup which limited me to 20-30 yards. I don't have any 'archery' seasons and so I wasn't as focused on it. Now I have found an opportunity for an annual archery hunt and want to start prepping for that better.

 

[InteriorAKPopsicle]

 

[InteriorAKPopsicle]

Got this Goose at 50 yards with the bow. No not on the wing.

 

[Zac]

I can’t wait to hear what your wife says when you tell her you shoot your current bow really good, but your friend told you it wasn’t long enough.

 

[Zac]

If she doesn't go with it, just tell her that a bunch of self proclaimed internet pros also agree that you need a new bow.

 

[jmez]

Cam size has more to do with string angle than ATA. There are 31 inch bows that have the same string angle as older 35s.

That isn't true. Guy on Archery talk took every bow made a couple years ago and measured them. Came size/shirt riser improving string angle is a marketing gimmick.

The short bows with dinner plate cams all had more acute string angles than the longer ATA bows.

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[180ls1]

That isn't true. Guy on Archery talk took every bow made a couple years ago and measured them. Came size/shirt riser improving string angle is a marketing gimmick.

The short bows with dinner plate cams all had more acute string angles than the longer ATA bows.

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Yup, there is a good data showing this. It's mostly marketing and while cams do have influence, ATA is still the main driver.

 

[sndmn11]

Anyone who is saying ATA length doesn't matter has no idea

The most accurate bows have, longer ATA, larger BH and very little reflex or some deflex in the riser. Target bows aren't being sold or advertised to shoot from blinds or stands or pack around the woods they are made to be as accurate and forgiving as possible. If giant cams and short bows were more accurate or more forgiving you would see them lined up at all of the archery competitions

In the context of the thread topic "upgrade based on ATA" I think the answer is "no".

There are a lot of things one doesn't see within manufacturer's target bow lineups; parallel limbs should jump out as not being present as well. I do think it is worthwhile to not just focus on one spec, ATA called out in this instance, and to consider the entirety of the design. Once a few interesting bows are identified, the only way to learn if the results are better is to go shoot them to find out if an equipment change means better measurable results via accuracy/forgiveness. I don't golf, but I am sure there are oodles and oodles of folks who drop thousands on new clubs and "feel" better about their game, but their handicap stays the same. Or folks who throw thousands at a "custom" rifle to see the same results, etc.

 

[InteriorAKPopsicle]

If she doesn't go with it, just tell her that a bunch of self proclaimed internet pros also agree that you need a new bow.

YES! Totally reasonable and will work.

 

[180ls1]

Thanks everyone - I know that archers are extremally passionate about our sport.
I want to give myself the best chance for success and accuracy not in the yard but in that heart pumping moment on the tundra.

I appreciate all the conversation and I will agree that I have gotten into my own head a bit about this. But I like to know that I'm setting myself up for success so I am the only factor to fail and that is why I even started considering this. Lots of good stuff out there, some cool bows and a lot of fun to be had.

I'll see if the wife can help me talk sense into myself.

@Zac HA! I already have changed my mind about arrows but I won't get into that hear and has nothing to do with Diameter. I also have decided I don't like the broadheads I've used as they are extremely hard to find after the local shop shut down and nobody else seems to have heard of them. So I'm planning on switching up quite a bit this season anyway. Might as well be the whole kit and kaboodle right?

In all seriousness I haven't been involved in the archery world much. I drew a sheep tag in 2020 and planned a massive hunt - shot some bows and went with what was recommended by the shop for everything else. I shot almost daily for 2 years straight and then due to some circumstances at home I stopped shooting regularly and had to change my target setup which limited me to 20-30 yards. I don't have any 'archery' seasons and so I wasn't as focused on it. Now I have found an opportunity for an annual archery hunt and want to start prepping for that better.
View attachment 655225

In my opinion/experience, it's worth trying. I'd question the guy selling you a bow with an ATA shorter than your draw length.... Many times the techs at shops have WAY less experience than you would believe, some don't even hunt.

You won't be out much buying used and "target" bows depreciate like crazy after the first year or two.

 

[Zac]

Dudley shot incredibly well with that tiny Ember bow at Tac. Jesse Broadwater was shooting fishing bobbers at 100 yards with the VXR 28. I know both of these guys are way out of your league. However the point is that your ATA issue would be solved if you’d just shut up and go shoot your bow. There is so much mental masterbation in archery. I am guilty for falling for most of it as well. Also anytime you ask a question on a forum the members are more than happy to spend your money for you.

 

[fatlander]

Dudley shot incredibly well with that tiny Ember bow at Tac. Jesse Broadwater was shooting fishing bobbers at 100 yards with the VXR 28. I know both of these guys are way out of your league. However the point is that your ATA issue would be solved if you’d just shut up and go shoot your bow. There is so much mental masterbation in archery. I am guilty for falling for most of it as well. Also anytime you ask a question on a forum the members are more than happy to spend your money for you.

OP, just be one of the best archers in the world, and you’ll still choose a longer ATA bow when money and OIL animals are on the line. If the stubby bows were better, they’d shoot them all the time.


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[InteriorAKPopsicle]

go shoot your bow.

biggest problem with that right now is I don’t have a place to shoot.
-6* right now- no indoor range - 10:35am is sunrise and 3:21pm is sunset.
I’m going to make a target to shoot in the garage but I need something that will stop the arrow from penetrating the wall which I do not currently have.
I guess that is part of why my brain is going.

 

[180ls1]

I would buy a used Vx33, throw your accessories on it, sell the current bow, and add a back/offset bar. It'll probably cost you a few hundred but will extend your effective range 15 or more yards. To me, that is worth it.

 

[roosiebull]

Good evening - I just learned something I'm a little frustrated I wasn't told years ago OR more likely I was told and the information didn't stick.
I bought a Mathews VXR28 and have really enjoyed the bow though I haven't shot it as much as I should have the last 18 months.

I was just talking with a man who has shot a lot longer than me and he showed me his 35" AtA bow and we were talking about why he decided to go with a bow that long. I didn't realize that longer bows decrease your error inputs. I bought the 28" because I thought it would be shorter and slightly lighter for packing.
Now I have shot some good groups out to 60 and 70 yards with my VXR but now I'm considering buying a new 33"-34" bow and gaining the forgiveness of a longer bow. Wondering what the overall thoughts from everyone are - is it worth the upgrade or not?
Currently shooting a 28.5" Draw Length - Last time I checked drawing 69.9#s.

Thanks in Advance.

It will not be life changing in accuracy. I have the same draw length as you and owned a triax when they came out, and it wasn’t hard to shoot

I prefer 32-35” ata but it’s more of a comfort thing to me at full draw.

My biggest beef with the triax was balance, it had horrible balance and shot better with a back bar, and I am not willing to have a back bar on a hunting bow. The balance also made it suck to carry, but the ata length wasn’t that big of a deal in terms of accuracy

I think you would appreciate a longer bow because it will feel more natural at full draw, but you won’t see an appreciable difference in accuracy

 

[roosiebull]

biggest problem with that right now is I don’t have a place to shoot.
-6* right now- no indoor range - 10:35am is sunrise and 3:21pm is sunset.
I’m going to make a target to shoot in the garage but I need something that will stop the arrow from penetrating the wall which I do not currently have.
I guess that is part of why my brain is going.

Get a blob or rinehart target, both will stop arrows, take advantage of your limitations and work on your shot process, that will help you a lot in the long run if you can practice your release a lot.

I wouldn’t shoot for groups at 6’

Practice separating your aim from your release, because you probably won’t when you have lots of room to shoot, and that will form good habits (get punchy right out of the gate and it’s hard to break that habit)

 

[InteriorAKPopsicle]

@roosiebull
Sorry - not sure what you mean by separating your aim from your release?
Essentially practicing back tension, pulling through the arm, not punching the trigger but not focusing on small groups?