Tipping

[mntnguide]

Will say up front I never plan on any type of guided hunt, time and money prevent this most of the time. I will say my two cents, Guides charge what you feel is a wage you can live on . Do not expect a tip . People that can afford a guided hunt will still pay it. I still can't believe in this day and age tipping is still so highly expected in a lot of professions/fields of work . Except for wait staff in a restaurant or other field where they do not pay a minimum wage , just say no to tips. Like I said , just my two cents worth of opinion... Joe

you are confusing the guide and outfitter. The outfitter is being paid the price for the hunt, the guide is not. Guides do not choose their wage, not sure how out of touch with it you are, dont really see the point in your commentary on this thread if it doesnt involve you at all

 

[IBen]

Will say up front I never plan on any type of guided hunt, time and money prevent this most of the time. I will say my two cents, Guides charge what you feel is a wage you can live on . Do not expect a tip . People that can afford a guided hunt will still pay it. I still can't believe in this day and age tipping is still so highly expected in a lot of professions/fields of work . Except for wait staff in a restaurant or other field where they do not pay a minimum wage , just say no to tips. Like I said , just my two cents worth of opinion... Joe

Tipping in the guiding industry arguably makes more sense than any other industry since there is such a wide range of acceptable effort which a guides duties lie.

Its not my job to carry someones backpack 12 miles back to the airstrip at the end of a hunt but I know it will increase my tip so i do it and many things similar to that.

 

[Pokerface]

you are confusing the guide and outfitter. The outfitter is being paid the price for the hunt, the guide is not. Guides do not choose their wage, not sure how out of touch with it you are, dont really see the point in your commentary on this thread if it doesnt involve you at all

Yes , sorry I was confusing the guide with the outfitter.... Joe

 

[Pokerface]

you are confusing the guide and outfitter. The outfitter is being paid the price for the hunt, the guide is not. Guides do not choose their wage, not sure how out of touch with it you are, dont really see the point in your commentary on this thread if it doesnt involve you at all

Very out of touch I guess, How are guides wages based. Do they get a flat fee from the outfitter and then rely on tips to pay the bills? Just trying to add other views to the topic... Joe

 

[Pokerface]

Tipping in the guiding industry arguably makes more sense than any other industry since there is such a wide range of acceptable effort which a guides duties lie.

Its not my job to carry someones backpack 12 miles back to the airstrip at the end of a hunt but I know it will increase my tip so i do it and many things similar to that.

I do see your point here. Do you think a person in any profession deserves a tip if they go well beyond the expected service and puts forth more effort?

 

[mntnguide]

Very out of touch I guess, How are guides wages based. Do they get a flat fee from the outfitter and then rely on tips to pay the bills? Just trying to add other views to the topic... Joe

Im sure wages have changed a bit since I was full time doing it, but yes, guides usually make either a flat monthly wage, or a daily wage. With backcountry type hunts and outfits, usually its a lower wage because your food and living is being provided by the outfitter during the entire season. . When i was guiding here in WY, i made about 3k/month during hunting season, then tips on top. When i first started guiding in the Frank Church in idaho, i made $50 a day...Which seems so insane being that i wont even show up to work for that amount an hour now adays.

I get the whole DIY hates outfitter stuff that is always present on this forum more so than others, but those people also dont give a rats ass the realities of the guide/outfitter world. There are tons of costs on top of your hunt that money goes to, horses arent cheap, and neither is feeding them year round to run a backcountry outfit etc. Yes, outfitters make a decent living depending on who it is and where, but all the ones I ever worked for, were great people, hard working and do it because they love being in the mountains with horses, and giving that opportunity to people who could never do that on their own.

Tipping has got out of control in this country, but that comes from whiney people with blue hair who think the 4 seconds they spend on your coffee should give them a 25% tip. I do not agree with any of that at all. But when I was spending 16-18 hours a day with clients, taking care of horses, and working my ass off to find a kill big bulls, Yes, i damn sure would expect to be tipped. And, I still stay in contact with many clients i guided today. It doesnt have to be DIY vs Guided all the time like this forum seems to like to create.

 

[alaska_bou]

Sometimes the best tip is seeing the guy that trained all year “running” all the newest gear struggle on the mountain. The big tip comes when he says he’s a long range shooter and wiffs a 200 yard shot. At that point I feel rich beyond belief Hunts ending early are lame anyhow…

This comment say a lot more about you than it does about these clients...

 

[IBen]

I do see your point here. Do you think a person in any profession deserves a tip if they go well beyond the expected service and puts forth more effort?

when you go “above and beyond” in other professions you bill them for it. When you are in the service industry you get tipped for it.

 

[cuerro viejo]

I’ve always been a 10% guy barring extreme circumstances either way. Still, it seems odd to leave $10,000 on a $100,000 sheep hunt that may last two days vs a 10 day elk hunt where $1000 tip may be considered good.

If you order a $50 steak dinner and leave 20% and the next guy happens to order the same dinner with a $200 bottle of wine, does that waiter deserve 5 times the tip? I see the illogic in it all but have always followed the norms.

What about a $10,000 hunt with a $50,000 auction tag? Do you tip the tag value too??

Auction tags are completely separate service, not related to outfitter. Why would you tip what you paid the state? Same on a draw tag, you wouldn’t tip outfitter 10% of what you paid the state.

 

[2ski]

Haven't read any posts in this thread but saw it was tipping in the sheep forum.

Stay with cow tipping. Big horn sheep tipping sounds dangerous potentially. Leave it alone guy.

 

[SW hunter]

One thing that sinks a tip fast?
The guide s*** talking past clients. Making fun of guys missing shots or bringing stupid gear or expensive gun or not tipping enough or being in lousy shape or being from X state or being wealthy or dumb or inexperienced.

What are you gonna being saying about me in 2 weeks? Youre gonna be s*** talking me so why should I go out of my way to be generous to a guy like that? I’ll make sure to give him enough money to cover his fuel.

I think it should also work in the opposite direction. Why should a guide go above and beyond for a client that just s*** talks the last 3 guides he used? He knows, regardless of what he does, he is going to be the next name you drag through the mud.

Sorry I got so far off the trail here.

 

[the hack]

One thing that sinks a tip fast?
The guide s*** talking past clients. Making fun of guys missing shots or bringing stupid gear or expensive gun or not tipping enough or being in lousy shape or being from X state or being wealthy or dumb or inexperienced.

What are you gonna being saying about me in 2 weeks? Youre gonna be s*** talking me so why should I go out of my way to be generous to a guy like that? I’ll make sure to give him enough money to cover his fuel.

I think it should also work in the opposite direction. Why should a guide go above and beyond for a client that just s*** talks the last 3 guides he used? He knows, regardless of what he does, he is going to be the next name you drag through the mud.

Sorry I got so far off the trail here.

Experienced this the last year. Was surprised when the outfitter/guide s*** talked the previous client, a guy I told him I knew, and ripped on the other hunter in camp. Not surprisingly, this behavior tracked with poor logistics, prep and scouting. Sometimes you get what you pay for.

 

[alaska_bou]

Hahaha it was a joke, lighten up Francis

Maybe you should focus on posting up the outfitters you claim saying 15% is the norm for tipping

Here is one:

How Much Should I Tip? | Huntin' Fool

The Huntin' Fool is your guide to western big game hunting, tag services, and consulting by providing the finest Hunter Services Program in the world.

www.huntinfool.com

And another from Montana guide:
All hunts are fair chase. We will need to see your Montana hunting or fishing licenses and we will need to fill out liability release forms before you begin hunting. Please bring your necessary personal hunting equipment and be prepared for any kind of weather. We require you carry bear spray in the field. Gratuities are not included in the price of your hunt. Guide tips average 10% to 20% of the hunt price. The Camp cook keeps us all well fed and the Lodge in order. Please inform the cook of any dietary issues. Tips for the cook and camp tender average $100+. Enjoy your hunt and thank you for your business!

And another one from Trail's West Outfitters:
Tips or Gratuities are not included in the price of the pack trip or hunt. All of our guides, cooks and wranglers work hard to assist our hunters and clients where ever possible and appreciate all gratuities. Traditional tipping today is based on 10%-20% of trip costs. Each hunter/client should tip based on his/her satisfaction of their wilderness/hunt experience.
And another:

How Much to Tip a Hunting Guide » Outdoors International

Because hunting guides are part of the service industry, it is customary, but not always expected, that a guide receives a gratuity from the client.

outdoors-international.com

And another one:

Tipping your Fishing Guide ~ Living Water Guides

Tipping your Fishing Guide. Tipping your guide is a way to show your appreciation for their hard work and dedication.

livingwaterguide.com

Should I really keep going?

 

[alaska_bou]

Ummm you need to read them again. They all say 10%+. Show me ones starting at 15% like you claimed. You couldn’t even come up with ONE example of it being 15%+. You’re “in the industry”? Booking a semi guided hunt with renfros doesn’t put you in the industry.

You’re reaching far. And no results. How much time you investing in this? Are you expecting a tip? I’ll give you the tip….

When every one of the above examples suggests 10% to 20%, it doesn't take a genius to average those numbers.

You are totally right, I must not be in the industry, and I must not have been on over 50 guided hunts on every continent over the last 20 years, so clearly you know better than I do

 

[WVELK]

Ummm you need to read them again. They all say 10%+. Show me ones starting at 15% like you claimed. You couldn’t even come up with ONE example of it being 15%+. You’re “in the industry”? Booking a semi guided hunt with renfros doesn’t put you in the industry.

You’re reaching far. And no results. How much time you investing in this? Are you expecting a tip? I’ll give you the tip….

I was not going to post, but I think FAAFO should hear this. A little background, I have went on a $shit ton of guided hunts since 1996. I hate the fact, that people like FAAFO have lost complete sight of the fact that tipping should be based on the quality of service provided, and not a simple mathmatical calculation. I am historically a very good tipper in all industries where tipping is customary, AND where the service provided exceeds the client’s (that would be me) expecations. I have tipped more than the cost of the hunt on more than one occassion. I have tipped $500 on a $20,000 elk hunt. You need to talk to your outfitter and your guide and acess everyone’s expectations going into the hunt. I have had outfitters tell me a guide probably did not deserve more than $500, and I have had outfitters tell me before the hunt that their guides always get 15 - 20 percent (I call bull$hit on that one). I have saved a guides life on a hunt because he was the most incompetent outdoorsman I have ever been around - didn’t tip him - thought I had done enough already. I have beeen on brown bear hunts where the guides base pay was $1,000 a day for a 16 day hunt. That is a great base pay, but he also got a better tip because he was one of the best guides I have ever seen (and, I literally have been around hundreds of guides). My point is communicate before the hunt with the outfitter and guide to see what each expects, tell them what you expect from the hunt, ask what they will provide, then evaluate the quality of the servcie provided. And, yes I have had guides ask me for equipment and not cash, but generally cash is king that is true.

However, in my experience far too many young guides have gone the way of our country the last 30 years. They want to do less, expect more and appear to be “entitled” in general. I have a lot of very close friends that are outfitters. The crap they have to put up with regards to guides these days is off the chart. Asking a guide to remain drug fee while taking a client on a hunt should be a BARE MINIMUM not an “unreasonable request”. In my opinion, if you are guiding to make money you need to stop - today. If you are a great guide you deserve a great tip, no doubt. However, if you go into guiding not for the love of the outdoors and the opportunity to help a hunter grasp his or her dreams, but for the money you need to stop guiding. Get your a$$ back into school where you can get an education and a job that is all about making money. Guiding is not all about making money. And, in case you are wondering, I guided many hunts in my 20s and like another guide noted above, I was out there for the experience and was glad to get whatever I received. I once guided a Saudi prince on a hunt, and did not recieve a dime as a tip because he was against tipping. I was fine with that, and we had a great time. I will end by saying the hunter that has the money and claims he forgot cash and stiffs a good guide is worse than the young guide who just shows up does the bare minimum and says he deserves 10 percent for showing up.

 

[voltage]

I once had a guide tell a story about a past client who the guide said he went above and beyond for, and the client "only tipped 10%". I often think about what he says about me for only tipping 10%.

 

[WVELK]

I’ve never seen an outfitter claim 15% tipping is normal. Almost every website says 10%.

It’s kinda like building code, the code is the standard we are all held to, but it is the minimum. That’s kinda what the 10% is in the guiding world.

I always hate the part of the hunt where the client gives the tip. It’s just awkward. So many of the hunts end up feeling like you just finished a hunt with a friend. And now he gives you money? Weird. But I know one thing; I’ve always got over 10% and it doesn’t matter if it’s an expensive hunt or not.

Your guide may not be worth the minimum of 10%. But he may be worth a lot more. Plan accordingly.

This is the post that caught my attention. With all due respect, 10 percent is not the minimum. It may be in your world, and you may be one of the best guides on the planet. And, if I hunted with you I might tip you 50%. But, for the OP original post, 10 percent is not a minium. If a guide is worthless, the minimum might be 0%.

 

[WVELK]

I disagree. 10% seems be the number consistent and I would treat that as a Minimum if you’re happy with your client. It’s like going to a restaurant, my wife tells me 15% is standard. Shitty service they are going to barely get anything. Exceptional way more than 15%.

May I ask, what animals do your guide, what state(s) and what is your age? You may be making my point with your responses. Lets say you are an elk guide in New Mexico hunting out of a lodge. Lets say you live in Texas. You drive to the lodge the day before the client arrives (two day before season opener). The outfitter assigns you a new hunter, lets say the OP, and tells you the area he wants you to go into opening morning. You have hunted the area and are familar with the area, but have done zero pre-season scouting (this happens a lot, not necessary you, but guides in general with elk). The client arrives the next day. You meet your client, have a good evening and hunt the next day. On the first day of the season your client kills his first bull with a muzzleloader (280 inches) two hours into the hunt. Lets up the game and say, you were in unit 16A and the client has paid $21,000 for the landowner tag and $11,000 for the hunt.

By 4 PM on the first day, you and the client are back at the lodge. If I understand you correctly, that client owes you a “Minimum” of $3,200. Is that what your are saying?

 

[RdRdrFan]

May I ask, what animals do your guide, what state(s) and what is your age? You may be making my point with your responses. Lets say you are an elk guide in New Mexico hunting out of a lodge. Lets say you live in Texas. You drive to the lodge the day before the client arrives (two day before season opener). The outfitter assigns you a new hunter, lets say the OP, and tells you the area he wants you to go into opening morning. You have hunted the area and are familar with the area, but have done zero pre-season scouting (this happens a lot, not necessary you, but guides in general with elk). The client arrives the next day. You meet your client, have a good evening and hunt the next day. On the first day of the season your client kills his first bull with a muzzleloader (280 inches) two hours into the hunt. Lets up the game and say, you were in unit 16A and the client has paid $21,000 for the landowner tag and $11,000 for the hunt.

By 4 PM on the first day, you and the client are back at the lodge. If I understand you correctly, that client owes you a “Minimum” of $3,200. Is that what your are saying?

Ok so I get where you are going with this and I absolutely disagree with FAAFO's opinion that 10% is a minimum. However, I disagree with your point in this specific scenario. If someone buys a tag in 16A and that client makes the decision to pull the trigger on the morning of day 1.....why should the guide be punished? Size of the animal doesn't matter at that point. The client decided to pull the trigger and end the hunt early. Presumably the guide was prepared and had planned on being there working all week to get a bull for the client. Luck (or skill of the guide) put them in position to take an animal that the client is happy with. Why punish the guide? To go back to an earlier point you made about guides not scouting and just showing up shortly before the hunt....why would they if you are going to shortchange them if they have a bull located before the season starts??

 

[Dragonfish]

Dall sheep last year I left 15% with the guide last year, and let him take care of the packer at his discretion- which is a pattern i've kind of fallen in to on these hunts. I've given gear to guides, including last year, but not in place of a tip, and not big ticket items. Last year was a solar panel to charge batteries, because theirs sucked and they had another few weeks left in the backcountry. and i won't need one for a while! Also have left an air mattress when the packers went bad on him. but never in place of cash.