The All New MRC/S2H Marshall Rifle Now Available

[atmat]

This is what I find so interesting-your 100% speculating!! The rifle is unproven.

You literally quoted me saying “if.” I’m not speculating that it will be. I’m simply saying “if” it is.

cmon man-lego parts?? You have been around long enough and in my opinion a solid contributor-however this is laughable. Kelbly has been building CUSTOM

I can order a Kelby and prefit online today, and spin it together. Like Lego parts. And yet, boom: custom.

Now, I never would order a Kelby, but that’s a whole different story.

 

[mt100gr.]

@TheCougar that is a strong showing

For the record I actually thought your Tikka comparison was pretty good, @HighUintas set me off a “touch” with calling the comparison invalid. Both of you had good points. Couger’s first post about returning and seeing the stock situation still an issue, and the optics of taking away from existing orders was spot on. To add to that, selling production spots before the rifles exist IS a pre-order….

Might need to edit my screen name to MT_Unreasonable for a little while just to own it.

So that's what "now available " means?!?

The Optics Planet model....

 

[HighUintas]

@TheCougar

 

[HuntHarder]

This new rifle is very interesting in my opinion, but the price is too high. I hope they sell a ton of them, as I appreciate a company trying to make QC more fore front in their operation. I think their are some very valid points as to the price tag and what you get for the extra $ over their Junction rifle. If this rifle offered a little bit more of a "custom" feel, I think guys wouldn't balk so much at the price.
Let a guy pick his cerekote color, whether to include or exclude the muzzlebrake, maybe have a couple different barrel length options. I get that we are getting away from factory and more to "custom" by doing this, but as some have pointed out, a guy could do this and come out considerably cheaper, minus the 10 rd group, and cycling ammo guarantee.

Time is money, so maybe that's where the extra $$$ comes in.

 

[id_jon]

I can order a Kelby and prefit online today, and spin it together. Like Lego parts. And yet, boom: custom.

Custom is definitely an odd word for what people are talking about with standalone actions. If someone has a "custom" action with a prefit and they threw it in a chassis, and call it a "custom rifle", then that's silly. But in my mind, when someone is talking about a "custom", they're at least referring to a gunsmith literally custom fitting, with exact tolerances, a barrel blank to their action, whether it's a "custom" action or not.

Edit: seems like if they started by selling bare actions, with trigger, or even barreled actions, people would probably be lining up to get the benefits that mostly come from the action.

 

[thinhorn_AK]

It’s like people have forgotten how low quality MRC rifles have historically been. I still remember when gun broker sellers were giving away free safari packages with the purchase of one just to sell it.

 

[ResearchinStuff]

It’s like people have forgotten how low quality MRC rifles have historically been. I still remember when gun broker sellers were giving away free safari packages with the purchase of one just to sell it.

I remember that

 

[atmat]

Custom is definitely an odd word for what people are talking about with standalone actions. If someone has a "custom" action with a prefit and they threw it in a chassis, and call it a "custom rifle", then that's silly. But in my mind, when someone is talking about a "custom", they're at least referring to a gunsmith literally custom fitting, with exact tolerances, a barrel blank to their action, whether it's a "custom" action or not.

Edit: seems like if they started by selling bare actions, with trigger, or even barreled actions, people would probably be lining up to get the benefits that mostly come from the action.

That’s more or less my point: the terms “custom” and “factory/production” are very binomial and tell you nothing about the product. But there’s people arguing that the rifle is at or approaching “custom” cost.

People can buy or not buy the rifle. And there’s valid discussion on whether it’s priced well. I’m just pointing out a flaw in that debate regarding custom vs production.

 

[HuntHarder]

That’s more or less my point: the terms “custom” and “factory/production” are very binomial and tell you nothing about the product. But there’s people arguing that the rifle is at or approaching “custom” cost.

People can buy or not buy the rifle. And there’s valid discussion on whether it’s priced well. I’m just pointing out a flaw in that debate regarding custom vs production.

Is custom not just being able to pick and choose your "legos" on an action that has low enough tolerance that profits are able to screw on and off without the need of a gunsmith? Being able to specify your wants on a rifle and get it how you want it? I suppose everyone's definition is different.

 

[Grundy53]

Is custom not just being able to pick and choose your "legos" on an action that has low enough tolerance that profits are able to screw on and off without the need of a gunsmith? Being able to specify your wants on a rifle and get it how you want it? I suppose everyone's definition is different.

Exactly. You get to customize the rifle to your wants/needs.

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[BAKPAKR]

You literally quoted me saying “if.” I’m not speculating that it will be. I’m simply saying “if” it is.


I can order a Kelby and prefit online today, and spin it together. Like Lego parts. And yet, boom: custom.

Now, I never would order a Kelby, but that’s a whole different story.

Is the action on the MRC rifle machined so the ultra-accurate hand lapped barrel can be swapped, by the user, for a shouldered pre-fit (“LEGO part”)? I don’t see mention in the description.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

Is the action on the MRC rifle machined so the ultra-accurate hand lapped barrel can be swapped, by the user, for a shouldered pre-fit (“LEGO part”)? I don’t see mention in the description.

I believe the answer to this was yes but would need confirmation from Ian or Form.

 

[BAKPAKR]

I believe the answer to this was yes but would need confirmation from Ian or Form.

That would be good, especially for high volume shooters or anyone interested in a chambering other than one of the factory offerings.

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

First two rifles came in today. For now the questions or comments can be in here.

See this thread for updates on the rifles-

Montana Rifle Company Marshall Field Evaluations

The first two production* versions of the MRC/S2H Marshall rifle were received today. There will be three more rifles being sent to be used heavily by forum members. Pulled straight out of the box and mounted the scope. This will be the first rifle in 20+ years that I haven’t torn...

rokslide.com

View attachment 838111

Hey @Formidilosus I noticed the thread linked here “isn’t open for further replies”. Was there an accompanying “Q and A” thread for this that I missed?

 

[Grumman]

It’s like people have forgotten how low quality MRC rifles have historically been. I still remember when gun broker sellers were giving away free safari packages with the purchase of one just to sell it.

That is not specific to the old MRC but is the sales strategy of a reseller on there. They still have listings on there with Cooper, Mauser, Winchester and many other rifles offering “free” safaris.


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[Antares]

You guys are missing the point. This isn't just any old CRF action. This one is "correctly timed", so shut up and get out your wallets.

 

[gbflyer]

It’s like people have forgotten how low quality MRC rifles have historically been. I still remember when gun broker sellers were giving away free safari packages with the purchase of one just to sell it.

Or the factory guy calling prospective customers liars, throwing their IT folks under the bus, not honoring published pricing, and telling them that they “aren’t selling Saturns here”.

I am 100% in the new outfits corner. They have been awesome here so far from what is written.


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[Lowedog]

I must have missed it... Who makes the ULTRA-ACCURATE HAND LAPPED BARREL?

I don't see it listed on their site or the UM site...

 

[khuber84]

Is the action on the MRC rifle machined so the ultra-accurate hand lapped barrel can be swapped, by the user, for a shouldered pre-fit (“LEGO part”)? I don’t see mention in the description.

Ian says yes. Their starter threads are timed in the exact same spot on all actions, nominal headspace. This allows prefits with the extractor relief cut in the tenon. There will still be some measuring and prob a dummy tenon for indexing required. I personally wouldn't go about prefitting this action myself but it's capable. I'm sure a cnc program could be written that would nail the tenon and relief cut every time.

Threads stretch/move with torque cycles. If a guy were to say have a rifle built in 6cm for hunting, then have a practice barrel cut in 6br. After say a dozen barrel swaps back and forth, at what point in time will the extractor cut start to get off timing at the same 100'/# tenon torque? Perhaps this action as a switch barrel might not be a good idea?

I know when my smith times his barrel markings, just a few cycles of barrel swaps, the markings have def moved from their original position, this doesn't matter as they're not cut for an extractor relief.

@Imac45acp can you shed any light on that? Is it possible to test that concept? How many times of making and breaking the barrel to your recommended torque before the claw ectractor is no longer inside the relief cut?

 

[mxgsfmdpx]

If you walk into a custom shop, not many.

I just assembled another custom action rifle for around 2700. This is a Kelbly action, "custom" barrel I ordered to my specs, and a chassis. I've been doing it for years.

$2,700 is very affordable for action, trigger, bottom metal, and a good quality barrel. What are the build parts and specs on this if you don’t mind? I don’t think you are the “norm” at all for “building” a custom gun. Nearly everyone who I know who’s shooting customs has close to or over half your costs in just smithing a gun build.

So many folks on here that buy a stock rifle and then replace the stock, have the barrel sent out for threading, and or replace it seems like a waste of money.

Using Tikka as an example (it is Rokslide after all) I never understand why guys practically throw away some of the most consistent and accurate barrels in the world and then replace with some carbon wrapped monstrosity.

Replacing the stock is $600 and then selling the factory stock for $50-$200. That’s not a waste at all especially for what the Rokstok offers in shoot-ability. I get there are other stocks and chassis that can land over $1,000 adding in a ton of cost.

Cutting and threading for a suppressor is only $100-$200 and is a personal preference choice.

Anyone can purchase exactly what they want and not pay for wasted, or parts that need additional smithing, shipping costs, time lost etc.

I think the “issue” with this for most folks is the initial cost, lack of knowledge so smith costs, and then having to deal with Rem700 based downfalls (not as dramatic as some would think especially with how little most folks shoot them).

No dog in this fight, and haven't read all the comments. I agree with others that you can't compare it to some rifles, and it sounds like this rifle is more for hunters who don't geek out on gear, and love doing things themselves.

I believe the point of this gun is a company truly proofing a rifle before it leaves the shop. Sako and Tikka do something similar where chambering/feeding/extracting is checked by a smith who stamps the paperwork for that exact serial number. They are then shot over pressure for 3 rounds and if they pass they are then accuracy proofed for 3-5 rounds for Tikka/Sako respectively. There’s a reason the field failures and reliability on these guns is world renown. Processes like this are welcomed in my opinion and it seems MRC is going even a step further.

As for this rifle being discussed, it's not a custom rifle, it's a factory rifle. To pay extra for someone to shoot a 10 round group-which most are going to do themselves....why? 1.5 moa isn't screaming accurate, but is a darn good standard.

If a “factory rifle” runs for 10,000 rounds without hiccup and maintains 1-1.5 MOA it will be on par with what I’ve seen from Sako for decades now and Tikkas for the last 7ish years. That’s a standard that no “custom” guns I’ve owned and shot have maintained yet. Maybe you have seen differently?

I fully understand the 10K rounds is very low sample size. Looking forward to several more being put to heavy use this winter/spring and seeing results from different shooters.

Add in a much higher spec'd custom action and better barrel, 1.5 and better is much more attainable, and can be done all day for under $3k.

In what way are a Kelby and “custom” barrel higher spec’d? Are you basing that on the stated 1.5 and better spec or factoring in other variables?

So $1k-1300 extra for someone to rack the bolt and feed rounds, again, who doesn't check their rifle out? This place is the most hardcore DIY group of dudes, but somehow these are attractive options from the factory for near actual custom pricing?

I agree that shooting and proofing a gun is still on the end user 100% and I don’t think this QA/QC process is where the costs are incurred. I also wish the gun was $800 cheaper or more but I don’t think folks truly grasp the concept of landed costs plus burden and trying to maintain profitability in today’s economy. Especially when acquiring American made goods from multiple OEMs. This is especially exacerbated in an overly saturated market with overall low margins such as the gun industry (other than niche parts and suppressors).

Higher volume and low profitability is the name of the gun making game, so when a “boutique” gun like this comes in at the price point it does, folks minds immediately go to “custom” without realizing they really aren’t gaining anything there (speaking from a true heavily used hunting gun standpoint) and will for sure spend more if using a smith.

I can appreciate what this rifle plans to be even though I lean more towards “DIY” personally. Looking forward to seeing more of them in the field.