The 6UM

[1Alex]

What is the expected velocity loss/ inch of barrel cut off? Running some numbers it looks like 2750fps with a 109 eldm gets me to 1800fps at 625 yards at sea level. That’s plenty for what I want it for. Would love to go as short as possible on the barrel. Any experience or ideas on what to expect?

 

[Schmo]

What is the expected velocity loss/ inch of barrel cut off? Running some numbers it looks like 2750fps with a 109 eldm gets me to 1800fps at 625 yards at sea level. That’s plenty for what I want it for. Would love to go as short as possible on the barrel. Any experience or ideas on what to expect?

You can do that with a 16” 6 Creed. No need for a 6 UM for that velocity.

 

[1Alex]

I want to go as short as possible I’d love to be able to get these numbers with a 12” barrel hence the reason for the UM

 

[bielenbm]

Just to make sure. You are aware that you’ll have to do a SBR tax stamp with that.

 

[Schmo]

I want to go as short as possible I’d love to be able to get these numbers with a 12” barrel hence the reason for the UM

Ah. Well, you might get there. I’m not quite sure. Someone more knowledgeable than I should give input on it. I’d be curious if it could burn enough powder in that short length.

 

[1Alex]

Ya fully aware of the tax stamp for the short barrel.

 

[rbutcher1234]

Someone running the numbers on WEZ for hit probability between 6cm, 6prc, and 6um really helped me decide that I'm sticking with 243win or 6cm

Not to necro this post, but where would I find the WEZ output of this if it’s lying around on a post?

 

[Schmo]

Not to necro this post, but where would I find the WEZ output of this if it’s lying around on a post?

Give me the specs and I can run it if it’s not posted

 

[BBob]

Not to necro this post, but where would I find the WEZ output of this if it’s lying around on a post?

Probably buried in here:

Thread 'WEZ hit rates.'

Mar 12, 2025

I bought the Applied ballistics pro version app so I could play with the WEZ portion. It’s pretty cool to play around with realistic and unrealistic numbers haha. If anyone wants me to punch in numbers for them and their specific rifle/use case and post a screen shot of their data, it only takes a second. I’d be happy to do it.

You can select the target size and yardage. I have a 10X14” rectangle for a broadside elkish sized target.



Uncertainties (the MV is your SD)

• huntnful
• Replies: 322
• Forum: Long Range Hunting

• 

 

[Montucky]

So who’s had any luck killing with the 108 Berger EHs…..?

 

[Gstew1930]

The more i shoot this cartridge the more i like it. At this rate my barrel will be toast sooner rather than later. I'll go easier on the next one. Also tried my OG 6.5 on it this morning. It sounded better than I expected

 

[TradLife406]

Finally got tired of carrying to the same area every day to glass and not shooting.

Had a pretty good tag. Super challenging area that's stupid steep. There's a lot of big bulls. Passed a 330 one day. Another 300" broken up old warrior.

The problem was for how little pressure there is there's no rhyme or reason to how the elk behave. Zero pattern. Everyone I saw was completely random. One morning I had two rags 250 yards below my camp. Then I'd go three days without seeing a thing. All pretty open so if anything leaves the timber youll see it.

Anyways freezing my butt off glassing the other evening. And three bulls come at a fast trot down the drainage below me. Like something spooked them.

They're at 1035. Too far and not much cover to get closer. I pack up my stuff and am able to get to the last patch of trees before no man's land. About an hour of light left so I couldn't get creative with a stalk.

Also oddly enough there was zero wind. Dead calm.

I find a gap in the trees and setup prone.

Dial the dope. The middle of the three had the largest body. Honestly I can't remember which way he was standing. But shot one was an impact. He seemed dead on his feet but without a spotter I sent another. Second shot was good and he falls and rolls down the hill a little ways.

Two lung hits at 905 yards


It's really weird that I can't remember exactly how he was standing for each shot. I think the first was a broadside shot behind the shoulder. The second he turned and it was a quartering away to the right side.

115 DTac fk'ed him up good.

Shot placement was absolutely text book.

One exit was 5".

I found another hole on the other side from the big exit. Maybe an entrance? Both shots hit. I'm pretty dang sure because after the first shot he had that dead on his feet wtf just happened posture. It's totally possible I missed the first shot and it just started him but he definitely reacted like he just got shot. But the wounds I found were confusing.
First elk with a rifle. But I've seen a lot of elk in movies do this. Either way the lungs were soup. Massive internal damage. Both hits right behind the shoulder.

Also this is after my rifle fell out of the kifaru gun nearer a few times. Honestly Form would have been proud at how I tested this rifle


Last few days of the season the 350 inch dreams go down the drain fast.

115 deep cut dtacs
2035 fps impact speed

Definitely not my going to be my default to shoot that far. Only reason was the wind was dead calm. And shooting prone. For whatever reason the elk were just frozen on the hill.

You can see my dead elk and his two buddy's on the far hillside just below the line of trees.

 

[Brontosaurus]

Finally got tired of carrying to the same area every day to glass and not shooting.

Had a pretty good tag. Super challenging area that's stupid steep. There's a lot of big bulls. Passed a 330 one day. Another 300" broken up old warrior.

The problem was for how little pressure there is there's no rhyme or reason to how the elk behave. Zero pattern. Everyone I saw was completely random. One morning I had two rags 250 yards below my camp. Then I'd go three days without seeing a thing. All pretty open so if anything leaves the timber youll see it.

Anyways freezing my butt off glassing the other evening. And three bulls come at a fast trot down the drainage below me. Like something spooked them.

They're at 1035. Too far and not much cover to get closer. I pack up my stuff and am able to get to the last patch of trees before no man's land. About an hour of light left so I couldn't get creative with a stalk.

Also oddly enough there was zero wind. Dead calm.

I find a gap in the trees and setup prone.

Dial the dope. The middle of the three had the largest body. Honestly I can't remember which way he was standing. But shot one was an impact. He seemed dead on his feet but without a spotter I sent another. Second shot was good and he falls and rolls down the hill a little ways.

Two lung hits at 905 yards


It's really weird that I can't remember exactly how he was standing for each shot. I think the first was a broadside shot behind the shoulder. The second he turned and it was a quartering away to the right side.

115 DTac fk'ed him up good.

Shot placement was absolutely text book.

One exit was 5".

I found another hole on the other side from the big exit. Maybe an entrance? Both shots hit. I'm pretty dang sure because after the first shot he had that dead on his feet wtf just happened posture. It's totally possible I missed the first shot and it just started him but he definitely reacted like he just got shot. But the wounds I found were confusing.
First elk with a rifle. But I've seen a lot of elk in movies do this. Either way the lungs were soup. Massive internal damage. Both hits right behind the shoulder.

Also this is after my rifle fell out of the kifaru gun nearer a few times. Honestly Form would have been proud at how I tested this rifle


Last few days of the season the 350 inch dreams go down the drain fast.

115 deep cut dtacs
2035 fps impact speed

Definitely not my going to be my default to shoot that far. Only reason was the wind was dead calm. And shooting prone. For whatever reason the elk were just frozen on the hill.

You can see my dead elk and his two buddy's on the far hillside just below the line of trees.

Im betting that you probably hit both times and that you found an exit. I killed my elk at 80 yds with the 6UM DTAC combo this year and didnt get any sort of pass through. Just alot of damage lol. I know it feels counterintuitive but I feel like the closer you get the less penetration you get with the dtacs imo.
Edit.
Congrats on the fantastic elk and some excellent shooting!!

 

[Lawnboi]

Finally got tired of carrying to the same area every day to glass and not shooting.

Had a pretty good tag. Super challenging area that's stupid steep. There's a lot of big bulls. Passed a 330 one day. Another 300" broken up old warrior.

The problem was for how little pressure there is there's no rhyme or reason to how the elk behave. Zero pattern. Everyone I saw was completely random. One morning I had two rags 250 yards below my camp. Then I'd go three days without seeing a thing. All pretty open so if anything leaves the timber youll see it.

Anyways freezing my butt off glassing the other evening. And three bulls come at a fast trot down the drainage below me. Like something spooked them.

They're at 1035. Too far and not much cover to get closer. I pack up my stuff and am able to get to the last patch of trees before no man's land. About an hour of light left so I couldn't get creative with a stalk.

Also oddly enough there was zero wind. Dead calm.

I find a gap in the trees and setup prone.

Dial the dope. The middle of the three had the largest body. Honestly I can't remember which way he was standing. But shot one was an impact. He seemed dead on his feet but without a spotter I sent another. Second shot was good and he falls and rolls down the hill a little ways.

Two lung hits at 905 yards


It's really weird that I can't remember exactly how he was standing for each shot. I think the first was a broadside shot behind the shoulder. The second he turned and it was a quartering away to the right side.

115 DTac fk'ed him up good.

Shot placement was absolutely text book.

One exit was 5".

I found another hole on the other side from the big exit. Maybe an entrance? Both shots hit. I'm pretty dang sure because after the first shot he had that dead on his feet wtf just happened posture. It's totally possible I missed the first shot and it just started him but he definitely reacted like he just got shot. But the wounds I found were confusing.
First elk with a rifle. But I've seen a lot of elk in movies do this. Either way the lungs were soup. Massive internal damage. Both hits right behind the shoulder.

Also this is after my rifle fell out of the kifaru gun nearer a few times. Honestly Form would have been proud at how I tested this rifle


Last few days of the season the 350 inch dreams go down the drain fast.

115 deep cut dtacs
2035 fps impact speed

Definitely not my going to be my default to shoot that far. Only reason was the wind was dead calm. And shooting prone. For whatever reason the elk were just frozen on the hill.

You can see my dead elk and his two buddy's on the far hillside just below the line of trees.

We changed the name this year, we call it the kifaru gun dropper.

 

[Coleredding00]

So who’s had any luck killing with the 108 Berger EHs…..?

Not my rifle, but my hunting partners. He has been shooting them in his 6 creed this year. Moderate muzzle velocity of 2800. It’s killed 2 bulls and a cow and nothing has taken more than 10 steps with lung shots. One at 80 yards, one at 330 and one at 500.

 

[Armageddon91]

So who’s had any luck killing with the 108 Berger EHs…..?

I got a kill with the 109 LRHT impacting at about 2800 fps and it did great and it's basically the same bullet. Also saw on a Facebook group that a guy killed an elk with a 6mm PRC throwing the 108 EH at 3400fps and it worked great for him too.

 

[Brucebarker024]

If someone was going to primarily shoot 108s and maybe 115s is 570 still the powder of choice?

 

[amassi]

If someone was going to primarily shoot 108s and maybe 115s is 570 still the powder of choice?

For absolute speed yes
But if I was going to start with 108s I’d reach for H1000 or N565.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[TradLife406]

We changed the name this year, we call it the kifaru gun dropper.

Haha I've been using one of these for years. Probably 8 or 9 years. I've never had an issue. I think what it was is when I have the buckle under the gun it comes undone.


About the hits and pass throughs. I was wondering that. Man this hunt was probably the most physically and demanding challenge a guy in the lower 48 could do without doing the Montana unlimited sheep. Or I just suck at hunting so it felt that way. Laid awake replaying the shots and what I found. The one wound looked like an out hole. And the other one looked like an in. That or that exist was just a violent entry wound. First time shooting dtacs so I'm not sure. I'll give Avery a call this evening. Maybe he'll answer

Usually on deer when I've missed the first shot they don't react. They just stay put. This dude definitely acted like he was hit. That or I was so close I startled him. But I don't think so. I don't know.

I definitely wouldn't have taken that shot if there had been any wind. Or atleast anything over 5 mph.

It's funny how Fudds will say a long shot isn't hunting. I think I had 20 days of getting my ass kicked before I took a shot. To be fair early on I had 350" dreams. So I let a 330" walk at 200 yards. Also let a broken up 6x walk at 200.

I should have listen to my buddy who's had the tag about how you just can't pass a decent bull even early in the hunt here. The elk are just too random.

At the end of the day I've got a lot of babies to feed and being able to drop a bomb in the right circumstances helps.


Now when I go to the shooting school this next spring and Form asks how far I feel confident to shoot I'm definitely not going to say 900. Hell last week I made a horrible shot on a doe from the tent door at 25 yards.

 

[Brucebarker024]

For absolute speed yes
But if I was going to start with 108s I’d reach for H1000 or N565.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Sweet. I have 6 pounds of h1000 so I’ll start there. Especially for fire forming.