Suggest a 6.5 Creedmoor Hunting Bullet

[TX_Diver]

Been about a year but finally finished getting some velocity data from various bullets. I still have 147 ELD-M, 143 ELD-X, and 140 Elite Hunters and 140 Hybrid Targets available (have more hornady stuff than berger on hand).

These are what I'm getting velocity wise from a 19.25" T3x Lite barrel. Will load up a few 10 round groups in the next few weeks and make sure they all group.

Probably try 143 ELD-X, 147 ELD-M, and 140 Elite Hunters all at 42. Maybe 42.5 for the bergers.




T3x Lite w/ original barrel cut to 19.25". New starline brass 1x resized w/ CCI primers & H4350. Measured w/ a magnetospeed sporter attached to a suppressor w/ sensitivity on Hi 2.

Went through a ladder with some 140s and 143s today just to get an idea of what velocity I'm getting. 32 degrees out. 70 in the house and I brought rounds out 3 at a time and shot them in different orders each time. Just trying to see if I get pressure signs anywhere. Loaded as long as they'd fit in my CTR magazine. I have all the measurements written down and how far off the lands they are in a different book. I loaded these a year ago and never got around to shooting them. Will post headstamp pics later and see if anyone has an opinion on pressure signs. Maybe a minor swipe at 43+ but I get that fairly often from this gun so hard to say.

One thing that's interesting is that the 143s are slightly faster than the 140s. Guessing that has to do w/ bullet shape and bearing surface? 147s are also faster but it was 15 degrees warmer when I shot those.

140 Hybrid Target

H4350	6.5 CM	Charge	36	37	38	39	40	40.5	41	41.5	42	42.5	43	43.5
	140 Hybrid	Book Velocity	2378 @36.5						2634
Berger	34-40.3	Chrono Velocity			2298	2354	2435	2450	2509	2529	2556	2605	2634	2657

140 Elite Hunter

H4350	6.5 CM	Charge			38	39	40	40.5	41	41.5	42	42.5	43	43.5
	140 Elite Hunter	Book Velocity			2471							2731
Berger	38 to 42.3	Chrono Velocity			2290	2344	2408	2460	2479	2512	2570	2598	2633	2649

143 ELD-X

H4350	6.5 CM	Charge	36	37	38	39	40	40.5	41	41.5	42	42.5	43	43.5
	143 ELD-X	Book Velocity	2400		2500		2600	2650		2700
Hornady		Chrono Velocity			2344	2405	2444	2511	2503	2557	2563	2629	2651	2662

Older data for reference
156 EOL shot at 42 degrees

H4350	6.5 CM	Charge		37	38	39	40	40.5	41	41.5	42	42.5
	156 EOL	Book Velocity	2405 @36.5					2627 @ 40.3
Berger	34-40.3	Chrono Velocity		2265	2282	2354	2449	2447	2473	2500	2536	2576

147 ELD-M w/ CCI Primers at 47 degrees

H4350	6.5 CM	Charge	36	37	38	39	40	40.5	41	41.5	42	42.5	43
CCI	147 ELD-M	Book Velocity	2400		2500	2550		2600
Hornady	34-40.3	Chrono Velocity	2252	2291	2321	2455	2495	2491	2548	2553	2583	2616	2629

147 ELD-M w/ WIN Primers at 47 degrees

H4350	6.5 CM	Charge	36	37	38	39	40	40.5	41	41.5	42	42.5	43
WIN	147 ELD-M	Book Velocity	2400		2500	2550		2600
Hornady	34-40.3	Chrono Velocity	2254	2323	2370	2430	2510	2534	2558	2590	2621	2658	2637

 

[Thebigbaby]

1. 143 eldx
2. 156 Berger.

 

[trailblazer75]

To me, the 143eld-x seems to have phenomenal performance. I'm sure there are examples where it hasn't performed as there always are. But, I have yet to have an issue with that bullet. It flies well, shoots great in both 6.5's I own.

My son and I shot 5 deer with this exact round the year before last and it was the worst performer I’ve seen. 4/5 deer were recovered as all the hits were lethal. But there were pencil holes and minimal blood. Never recovered a bullet but it seemed like there was extremely minimal expansion. The 5th deer was never recovered. I was so disappointed that I grounded the rifle and moved on.

 

[Sled]

My son and I shot 5 deer with this exact round the year before last and it was the worst performer I’ve seen. 4/5 deer were recovered as all the hits were lethal. But there were pencil holes and minimal blood. Never recovered a bullet but it seemed like there was extremely minimal expansion. The 5th deer was never recovered. I was so disappointed that I grounded the rifle and moved on.

What distances were you shooting?

 

[ResearchinStuff]

My son and I shot 5 deer with this exact round the year before last and it was the worst performer I’ve seen. 4/5 deer were recovered as all the hits were lethal. But there were pencil holes and minimal blood. Never recovered a bullet but it seemed like there was extremely minimal expansion. The 5th deer was never recovered. I was so disappointed that I grounded the rifle and moved on.

This is the exact opposite of my experience. 143 eldx at 160 yards made a racquetball sized hole and dropped the deer in its tracks.

 

[Formidilosus]

My son and I shot 5 deer with this exact round the year before last and it was the worst performer I’ve seen. 4/5 deer were recovered as all the hits were lethal. But there were pencil holes and minimal blood. Never recovered a bullet but it seemed like there was extremely minimal expansion. The 5th deer was never recovered. I was so disappointed that I grounded the rifle and moved on.

What did the lungs and organs look like? Got any pictures?

 

[Unckebob]

Anyone try the Terminal Ascent?

If I could find some bullets, I would love to test them.

My rifle shoots140g Nosler BT's and 143g ELD-x bullets great. Last year I managed to shoot two does from the same blind at the same distance.

Factory BT load: she collapsed DRT
ELD-x hand load: she ran about 20-30 yards. She was easy to find because of the blood dripping out the exit wound.

Looking at the two, the two wound channels were virtually identical with clear pass throughs. The only difference was the BT hit a little higher than the ELD-x and disrupted the deer's central nervous system.

 

[trailblazer75]

What did the lungs and organs look like? Got any pictures?

I wish I did. There was obvious trauma but not like you’d expect from a round that expanded well.

 

[trailblazer75]

This is the exact opposite of my experience. 143 eldx at 160 yards made a racquetball sized hole and dropped the deer in its tracks.

We had one shot at 130 that was a pencil hole, then a couple at around 50 yards, one at 80 and one at 6 yards. lol. I thought maybe I needed some more distance to get the bullet to mushroom. Who knows?

 

[Formidilosus]

We had one shot at 130 that was a pencil hole, then a couple at around 50 yards, one at 80 and one at 6 yards. lol. I thought maybe I needed some more distance to get the bullet to mushroom. Who knows?

That’s not how it works. The higher the impact speed, the more dramatic the bullet upset.

As for ELD-X’s not expanding- every bullet will fail at some point. However, in a couple hundred animals with full field necropsies, and hundreds of test shots in calibrated gelatin, I have not seen an ELD-X fail to open. What can happen is that at high impact velocities the bullet rapidly upsets/fragments leaving only the base with little to no petals to exit. Animals die quickly, but lots of people mistake the wounds without looking closely for a failure to expand.

This is what an ELD-X typically does-

 

[trailblazer75]

That’s not how it works. The higher the impact speed, the more dramatic the bullet upset.

As for ELD-X’s not expanding- every bullet will fail at some point. However, in a couple hundred animals with full field necropsies, and hundreds of test shots in calibrated gelatin, I have not seen an ELD-X fail to open. What can happen is that at high impact velocities the bullet rapidly upsets/fragments leaving only the base with little to no petals to exit. Animals die quickly, but lots of people mistake the wounds without looking closely for a failure to expand.

This is what an ELD-X typically does-

View attachment 501641

There was just a touch of sarcasm in there. And yeah, I’d read and heard nothing but good about the eld-x round. Still haven’t found anyone else to say anything bad. But I saw those 5 rounds poorly perform on those 5 animals. I’m not saying anyone is wrong but I know what my experience was.

I shot 123 gr eld-Ms this year and the performance was out of this world better. This was through the Grendel like I said. However, there was my experience. Bad batch? Idk. Doubtful knowing hornady. Bad placement? Most likely not because 3 of the 4 were double lung shots. One was shot side shoulder, shot side lung and out guts and the 5th I’ll never know of.

I will say I didn’t do full necropsies and wouldn’t just because it wasn’t THAT important to me. So there could be something I’ve missed.

 

[General RE LEE]

140 ELD-M

 

[Darryle]

140gr Partion
140gr Accubond

And surprisingly, 140gr Sellier & Bellot SP. I will test these on pigs out to 450yds this winter and spring, there is a wallow down in a small draw that they have been using quite regular. The factory ammo has proven very accurate in 2 different X-Bolt 6.5 Creedmoor rifles, it's cheap and I have been able to consistently hit an 8" plate at that same 450-500yd range with them. I won't be too upset if the pigs run off and die though.

The 140gr Partions seem to anchor them pretty consistently, the Accubonds have been the second best at leaving them in their tracks. I have tried the 127gr LRX on 2 different bigger pigs with perplexing results, one punched thru both shoulders and left an approximate 3" diameter hole on exit, the second LRX went thru plate/ribs and left a 2 finger sized exit hole, it turned everything inside to mush based on sloshing around and the amount of blood that poured from the exit when moving it to the bone pile. The Partion has left fist sized holes, one when passing thru the ribs and one when passing thru the soft meaty area below the ear in the "Triangle".

I have one X-Bolt zeroed at 450yds with the Sellier & Bellot SP and the other is zeroed with the Federal 130gr Terminal Ascent. I have a wide variety of off the shelf ammo still to try, just need a couple of decent rains to get the wallow saturated and the slow drain off back to it's normal activity to get the pigs back in to play.

 

[TX_Diver]

That’s not how it works. The higher the impact speed, the more dramatic the bullet upset.

As for ELD-X’s not expanding- every bullet will fail at some point. However, in a couple hundred animals with full field necropsies, and hundreds of test shots in calibrated gelatin, I have not seen an ELD-X fail to open. What can happen is that at high impact velocities the bullet rapidly upsets/fragments leaving only the base with little to no petals to exit. Animals die quickly, but lots of people mistake the wounds without looking closely for a failure to expand.

This is what an ELD-X typically does-

View attachment 501641

You use the 143 ELD-X on elk pretty frequently? Based on Hornady's 4DOF calculator and bergers online calculator I'd drop below 1800 fps between 600-650 yards with my muzzle velocities. That's at 800' and 45 degrees.

I have a lot more practice to do before even considering those shots, but I have the ability to practice at home which makes it possible at least.

 

[Formidilosus]

You use the 143 ELD-X on elk pretty frequently? Based on Hornady's 4DOF calculator and bergers online calculator I'd drop below 1800 fps between 600-650 yards with my muzzle velocities. That's at 800' and 45 degrees.

I have a lot more practice to do before even considering those shots, but I have the ability to practice at home which makes it possible at least.

I’ve seen the results of 30’ish shots on elk with 143gr ELD-X’s and quite a few other animals. Elk are no more magic than any other creature- they’re made of muscle, bones, and tissue and are not in any way bulletproof. Shoot them in the front half until they go down regardless of cartridge.

 

[whoami-72]

Just throwing our my $.02. I shot a mule deer buck this year with the 143 eld-x at 75 yards. It will likely be the last time I do so. The bullet grenaded and only had a tiny exit hole. Luckily the deer dropped instantly. If it hadn't, it would've been a tough tracking job because there was almost no hole for blood to come out of. Less than the size of a dime and was actually just a piece of the jacket.

I understand the theory of bullets shredding apart in the animal to disperss all the energy in it. However, for anything mule deer size or larger I'll be looking for a complete pass through to ensure I can track them even if it's a bad shot. White tail, antelope, coyotes, self defense situations could be shrapnel based expansion IMO.

 

[Bomberodevil]

Just throwing our my $.02. I shot a mule deer buck this year with the 143 eld-x at 75 yards. It will likely be the last time I do so. The bullet grenaded and only had a tiny exit hole. Luckily the deer dropped instantly. If it hadn't, it would've been a tough tracking job because there was almost no hole for blood to come out of. Less than the size of a dime and was actually just a piece of the jacket.

I understand the theory of bullets shredding apart in the animal to disperss all the energy in it. However, for anything mule deer size or larger I'll be looking for a complete pass through to ensure I can track them even if it's a bad shot. White tail, antelope, coyotes, self defense situations could be shrapnel based expansion IMO.

So you say you understand the theory of bullets shredding apart. I take that to mean you understand the characteristics of cup and core bullets vs bonded bullets vs mono bullets. You say you want a full pass through, which would mean a bonded or mono bullet. But you use a cup and core for a deer, which in your own words did a fantastic job of dropping the deer instantly. And you’re critical of the job the bullet did?

I don’t get people…

 

[whoami-72]

So you say you understand the theory of bullets shredding apart. I take that to mean you understand the characteristics of cup and core bullets vs bonded bullets vs mono bullets. You say you want a full pass through, which would mean a bonded or mono bullet. But you use a cup and core for a deer, which in your own words did a fantastic job of dropping the deer instantly. And you’re critical of the job the bullet did?

I don’t get people…

When I started loading the bullets, I was more worried about long range performance and 143 eld-x was pretty much all that was available locally for that role. I assumed it would have left a decent exit hole on the deer which for most purposes is good enough. In this case it didn't After realizing this, I decided to switch to a bullet that would get consistent exit holes. Any type of bullet, even an FMJ, wouldve killed the deer quickly where I hit it. However, if the shot were 3 inches backwards and I would've had to track it I could've easily lost that buck. Hence the switch to wanting nice big bloody exit wounds. It's not rocket science, it's priorities. With mule deer, elk, or moose I prioritize giving myself as much of a chance to find the deer every time over having the chance of an instant drop. Feel free to reread it again if you have issues comprehending.

 

[Formidilosus]

When I started loading the bullets, I was more worried about long range performance and 143 eld-x was pretty much all that was available locally for that role. I assumed it would have left a decent exit hole on the deer which for most purposes is good enough. In this case it didn't After realizing this, I decided to switch to a bullet that would get consistent exit holes. Any type of bullet, even an FMJ, wouldve killed the deer quickly where I hit it. However, if the shot were 3 inches backwards and I would've had to track it I could've easily lost that buck. Hence the switch to wanting nice big bloody exit wounds. It's not rocket science, it's priorities. With mule deer, elk, or moose I prioritize giving myself as much of a chance to find the deer every time over having the chance of an instant drop. Feel free to reread it again if you have issues comprehending.

So what are you going to shoot to give you a big bloody exit?

 

[Darryle]

So what are you going to shoot to give you a big bloody exit?

120gr Nosler BT does a decent job