Steels, sharpening, edge angles?

[S-3 ranch]

I've tried it with high polished, 100k edges and with coarse edges as well, ended up choosing coarse edge, lasts a lot longer, especially on highly abrasive mediums.
sharpen with 800-1000 grit diamond stone, then strop or ceramic stick to maintain the edge, resharping in the woods or mountains sux

 

[TaperPin]

If someone ever applies for a job in a meat factory, they will often give a knife sharpening test with a knife and ceramic stick (steel). Consistent angle is very important to getting an edge and muscle memory is important. People taking the test can struggle for hours going through the motions, but the edge doesn’t get sharp until their motions and angles become more consistent. Honestly, if a knife isn’t super hard a ceramic stick is what keeps the nations butcher shops and meat factories running.

I’m a fan of diamond sticks because they can be aggressive or leave a fine edge based on pressure. I used to enjoy sharpening other people’s pocket knives - at the time I had no idea why it came naturally to me and knives became sharp quickly, but it was obviously just muscle memory. Eventually I had an opportunity to sharpen some very hard blades, and it works just fine on them as well.

Diamond sharpeners have to be used lightly or you’ll just have what looks like a serrated blade under the microscope and it will never get super sharp. I like to do 10 light strokes to each side, then 9, then 8, etc then once you reach one check it - if it appears sharp, then start at 5 strokes and repeat, but use very light strokes. Then put a few strokes on a smooth hardened steel rod. If 3 super light strokes each side are used every time it’s used, the blade will stay sharp indefinitely.

Having said that, there’s nothing wrong with water stones and a very traditional sharpening method, this just work well for me and our knives the way we use them.

 

[hereinaz]

If someone ever applies for a job in a meat factory, they will often give a knife sharpening test with a knife and ceramic stick (steel). Consistent angle is very important to getting an edge and muscle memory is important. People taking the test can struggle for hours going through the motions, but the edge doesn’t get sharp until their motions and angles become more consistent. Honestly, if a knife isn’t super hard a ceramic stick is what keeps the nations butcher shops and meat factories running.

I’m a fan of diamond sticks because they can be aggressive or leave a fine edge based on pressure. I used to enjoy sharpening other people’s pocket knives - at the time I had no idea why it came naturally to me and knives became sharp quickly, but it was obviously just muscle memory. Eventually I had an opportunity to sharpen some very hard blades, and it works just fine on them as well.

Diamond sharpeners have to be used lightly or you’ll just have what looks like a serrated blade under the microscope and it will never get super sharp. I like to do 10 light strokes to each side, then 9, then 8, etc then once you reach one check it - if it appears sharp, then start at 5 strokes and repeat, but use very light strokes. Then put a few strokes on a smooth hardened steel rod. If 3 super light strokes each side are used every time it’s used, the blade will stay sharp indefinitely.

Having said that, there’s nothing wrong with water stones and a very traditional sharpening method, this just work well for me and our knives the way we use them.

I found the same thing with diamond blades. Let the stone work, not pressure.

It didn’t come naturally to me, but once I learned it, every knife can become razor sharp, except the worst Chinese stuff.

Boy Scout knives got a lot of attention over the years. It was fun to show kids and men how “simple it is” but once they got it they could use a single diamond stone and strip to sharpen a knife in 15-20 minutes.

Blades with the right geometry need a little maintenance and very little sharpening. A quick hit in the field with a fine pocket stone straightens the edge and polished the bevel back to razor. It doesn’t take much to dull a knife and it doesn’t take much to sharpen it right away.

 

[doc holiday13]

if you're looking for a good edge and want to put in the time and effort; get a leather strop and a coarse/fine benchstone (Norton abrasives makes this) . Bench stones need some sort of oil lube. Bench stones generally sharpen all but the hardest of metal knives.

Blade edge angle is user subjective and can be reset at just about any angle when you have enough patience. But its not hard to eyeball it either

 

[Bjones2571]

Following as I have a pile of good knives that are all not sharp enough to my liking. Bought that Amazon strop material and going to spend some time this next weekend while watching football and see what I can get done.

 

[fwafwow]

Following as I have a pile of good knives that are all not sharp enough to my liking. Bought that Amazon strop material and going to spend some time this next weekend while watching football and see what I can get done.

Do not watch football too closely while sharpening. I've been told that you can cut yourself when sharpening a knife. No, that's never happened to me.

 

[intunegp]

if you're looking for a good edge and want to put in the time and effort; get a leather strop and a coarse/fine benchstone (Norton abrasives makes this) . Bench stones need some sort of oil lube. Bench stones generally sharpen all but the hardest of metal knives.

Blade edge angle is user subjective and can be reset at just about any angle when you have enough patience. But its not hard to eyeball it either

"Bench stone" is usually only indicative of size, and even that isn't a standard. Whether to use oil or water or nothing at all depends on the stone itself. Some stones need to be soaked, some are "splash and go", and some are perfectly fine being used dry, though they will load up faster.

 

[doc holiday13]

"Bench stone" is usually only indicative of size, and even that isn't a standard. Whether to use oil or water or nothing at all depends on the stone itself. Some stones need to be soaked, some are "splash and go", and some are perfectly fine being used dry, though they will load up faster.

I probably should have said oil stone. I've found wet stones/ water stones have a softer cutting material generally. I have have oil and water stones. anything stainless goes on my oil stone. carbon steel gets water stones. everything gets leather stroped though

 

[BRobertson]

A heads up in case anyone is looking for a good strop ,
I got this a few years ago and it works great!
Stropman.com

 

[BRobertson]

This one is the large, 4 sided beast.

I over do everything!! I have been accused of that!
My Cummins/dodge has dual turbos and 800 ft lbs torque!

 

[Alpha Echo]

I found this blog recently and highly recommend it for understanding steel properties:

https://knifesteelnerds.com/2021/10...ness-edge-retention-and-corrosion-resistance/

The author is the inventor of magnacut, and he does an amazing job of explaining the tradeoffs. When you start diving into knive steels you find it's much like physics tradeoffs in rifle ballistics / bowhunting.

The more I read about knife steels the more I gravitate towards balanced steels and more toughness, rather than focusing on edge retention (I can always touch up).

 

[Beendare]

S90v is my current favorite, holds an edge like crazy.

You have to use Diamonds with S90v as the carbides in the steel are harder than some sharpening stones.

I use the jig sharpeners to hold a consistent angle. Gatco diamond works but THE best I’ve used is the Edge Pro. Other folks will be shocked at how sharp your knives are.

 

[fwafwow]

I use the jig sharpeners to hold a consistent angle. Gatco diamond works but THE best I’ve used is the Edge Pro. Other folks will be shocked at how sharp your knives are.

Do you use one of the Apex models?

 

[Alpha Echo]

S90v is my current favorite, holds an edge like crazy.

You have to use Diamonds with S90v as the carbides in the steel are harder than some sharpening stones.

I use the jig sharpeners to hold a consistent angle. Gatco diamond works but THE best I’ve used is the Edge Pro. Other folks will be shocked at how sharp your knives are.

Will the work sharp blade grinding attachment abrasives handle S90V? I've only tried S30V and non-super-steels on it so far, but can't see why it wouldn't? Just not sure if those abrasives are diamond though.

 

[sndmn11]

Will the work sharp blade grinding attachment abrasives handle S90V? I've only tried S30V and non-super-steels on it so far, but can't see why it wouldn't? Just not sure if those abrasives are diamond though.

Easily. I've done dozens of super steel to include s90v, maxamet, 15v, etc

 

[Shraggs]

Will the work sharp blade grinding attachment abrasives handle S90V? I've only tried S30V and non-super-steels on it so far, but can't see why it wouldn't? Just not sure if those abrasives are diamond though.

Yes

 

[Shraggs]

You asked about angles. Nice to hear blade forums mentioned, used to be heavily involved there and knife forums.

For knives of thin stock I use 25 or even 30 per side. The later if it’s a “chippy” super or stainless. I can still shave with a 30 degree if it’s actually sharp and thinner blade. Sone small very thin knives I use 35 like my capers.

For thicker and carbon 25 or 20 per side, 20 especially if it’s a very thick blade.

I convex all my edges. Even if I reprofile with water stones I’ll use belt sander or sandpaper over leather, followed by leather stropping with compound.

Above post, if you don’t have a burr (even if your thumb thinks it’s sharp) it’s not going to be sharp or remotely be usefully sharp.

 

[Macintosh]

I convex all my edges. Even if I reprofile with water stones I’ll use belt sander or sandpaper over leather, followed by leather stropping with compound.

Above post, if you don’t have a burr (even if your thumb thinks it’s sharp) it’s not going to be sharp or remotely be usefully sharp.

Thanks. Not certain I am following everything. Could you spell out a couple of the points for me?
How thin is “thin”? 1/8”? Thinner?

Re sander followed by reprofile…could you gonover what you are doing here, in which order? Sander like a worksharp, right? So if that gets blade to a point where it needs reprofiled, you do that with stones…then are you saying you will go back to the sander to get the convex edge? Why is this? (And if Im misunderstanding what am I missing?)

Re: “if you dont have a burr”. What are you referring to?

 

[Shraggs]

Yes. 1/8” and thinner and no shorter than 3/4” tall if that gives a mental pic. Thin is less robust so a less acute angle 30 vs say 20 still is very sharp for such a thin knife and adds some sharp durability if you will. But definitely less prone to chips on bone with 30 ish in this example.

Some knives I’ve bought used or if I abused one chopping a hard wood - on a worksharp with 18” belt attachment is going to struggle restoring. I use stones or water stones before the belt.

If I desire say 25 per side I’ll set that angle first on each side. Then I’ll hold at 20 for each side. Finally 15 at each side. All on heavy grit, then repeat sequence for medium grit and again repeat for fine grit. This is for heavily damage or rounded edges. But This makes it easier to use a the work shop hobby belt system to blend the final 25 degree into a convex edge.

If I’m sharpening a definite dull knife of mine, already fully formed I just use the belt system from work sharp. Medium grit then fine great the polisher. 2 passes per side. This can also be done with a leather strop and wet dry sand paper on top. Strokes would be identical to using the stones above. After either I finish with a leather strop. See below.

If a knife of mine needs a touch up after use or during use or after significant re sharpening I use a leather strop with black (aggressive) and then white (fine).

Using a strop is a bit of an art and I’d be happy to do a visual call with you.

Also if you don’t know what exactly the edge angle you want looks like - use a protractor with your knife on a stone. Hold and stand up - Burn a mental image from your standing position on how far spine is from stone. When stropping with a knife for say 25 degree I actually hold half or 12 degrees ish. The nature of a soft medium…

Any edge I do regardless of what I’m using after the second side I check for a burr. If there is no Burr two edges are NOT intersecting and there’s no way to move forward. Repeat until theirs is a burr. Heavy grits leave burrs seen in a light above you and easily felt. Higher grit won’t be felt, use light to catch reflection.

If you’ve had a burr consistently as you move to higher grits eventually burr is too small to see or feel. Check sharp.

1 shave arm. If it pops it’s sharp, if cuts nope

2 24 or 28 lb copy paper. Cut it. High pitched is sharper. Low pitched no so snd Look close to see micro tares. Thin paper won’t reveal tares. False sharp imo.

Whittle some soft clear pine., easily making thin strips is sharp. Effort and thick not so much.

One man’s journey and methods.

 

[Beendare]

Do you use one of the Apex models?

Yes, with diamonds.

These have gotten expensive but IMO worth it if you want your knives shaving sharp Everytime.