Shoot2Hunt University

[ckt3]

Quoting “Balding_Time” with Google translate:

“Hi guys, I'm new here on the forum. I've read several discussions and this one really caught my attention.
In particular, I don't understand how it's possible to shoot such wide groups at only 100 meters, from a prone position and without time limits. I think I could shoot a group like that with a muzzleloading rifle with iron sights.
I really don't understand how it's possible.
I'm not saying this to criticize anyone, but I'd like to understand how groups like that can be formed. Is there something inherently difficult about this specific shooting exercise?”

 

[BBob]

This was the “most zeroed” rifle on day one with no time limit on top, and timed shots on bottom (two separate drills)-

Anyone care to give a sensible answer?

Are you confusing the one zero check no time limit target with the timed positional drill targets? The timed positional targets still aren’t great but not quite the same category as the zero check no time target. That is if I read his description correctly.

 

[mad_angler]

Unless it is the new AMTP manual from the USMC, I would highly suggest NOT learning anything from a military manual.

Is this the correct manual?

https://defconbunkers.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/USMC-MCRP-301A-Rifle-Marksmanship.pdf

 

[Formidilosus]

Is this the correct manual?

https://defconbunkers.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/USMC-MCRP-301A-Rifle-Marksmanship.pdf

No sir.

 

[ckt3]

Is this the correct manual?

https://defconbunkers.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/USMC-MCRP-301A-Rifle-Marksmanship.pdf

My plan is to start by emulating the shooting positions seen here (particularly the seated ones). Maybe not as detailed as a manual, but should be helpful.

Thread 'S2H Winter Rifle Course Observations/lessons'

Feb 25, 2025

Shoot2Hunt held a Winter version of the 0-600 Yard Hunting Course last week. Below will follow some of the notable experiences/information.

@Ryan Avery @ztc92 @jzeblaz @longrangelead @24valve



Day 1: We started the afternoon before the official start date with 4x students and 2x teachers. 2x Tikka T3’s, 1x BAT action custom, 1x Tikka M595 Master Sporter. IIRC it was 3° F. Snowed all day.




Four more shooters arrived that night or the next morning.



The first four days it ranged from 3° F to -15°F for the day time...

• Formidilosus
• Replies: 225
• Forum: Firearms

• 

 

[ztc92]

My plan is to start by emulating the shooting positions seen here (particularly the seated ones). Maybe not as detailed as a manual, but should be helpful.

Thread 'S2H Winter Rifle Course Observations/lessons'

Feb 25, 2025

Shoot2Hunt held a Winter version of the 0-600 Yard Hunting Course last week. Below will follow some of the notable experiences/information.

@Ryan Avery @ztc92 @jzeblaz @longrangelead @24valve



Day 1: We started the afternoon before the official start date with 4x students and 2x teachers. 2x Tikka T3’s, 1x BAT action custom, 1x Tikka M595 Master Sporter. IIRC it was 3° F. Snowed all day.




Four more shooters arrived that night or the next morning.



The first four days it ranged from 3° F to -15°F for the day time...

• Formidilosus
• Replies: 225
• Forum: Firearms

• 

Have you seen this thread and the drills/tips within it?

Thread 'Equipment versus practice posts and Rifle practice/shooting'

Mar 31, 2020

This isn’t in response to anyone I particular, but there is an up tick in the amount of “I want a XXXX distance hunting rifle” traffic the last few months. I am getting a lot of questions relating to this, which I do not mind helping, but thought a public post might help answer some questions. It’s an attempt to get to actually using your rifles.


People online tend to act like 600/800/whatever yards is a rifle, cartridge and BDC scope purchase away. When someone asks for advice, or says I’m building an -insert whatever rifle/cartridge you want-, people are discussing hardware not...

• Formidilosus
• Replies: 865
• Forum: Firearms

• 

 

[ckt3]

Have you seen this thread and the drills/tips within it?

I saw the drills, but I must have missed the explanation and tips on the various positions. I’m also wondering how to more smoothly transition from standing with pack on and rifle in hand to sitting/kneeling/prone. Set rifle down -> take pack off -> pick rifle up and get situated? Could also try to take pack off arm by arm as you switch which hand holds the rifle… need to experiment more. But yes any and all tips are much appreciated.

 

[Snowhunter11]

Shoot2hunt video showing the whole thing on YT. For some reason it won’t load. It’s called the hunters drill.

 

[mad_angler]

Shoot2hunt video showing the whole thing on YT. For some reason it won’t load. It’s called the hunters drill.

I like the hunters drill and it seems like a great diagnostic tool. For example, I might learn that I need to work out sitting unsupported but I am pretty good at prone.

But... but once I get that information, what do I do? So I need to work on sitting unsupported. How do I learn what I'm doing wrong and what to change? It seems that I will just be reinforcing bad habits/techniques if I just go to the range and shoot a bunch in that position...

 

[Bluumoon]

I like the hunters drill and it seems like a great diagnostic tool. For example, I might learn that I need to work out sitting unsupported but I am pretty good at prone.

But... but once I get that information, what do I do? So I need to work on sitting unsupported. How do I learn what I'm doing wrong and what to change? It seems that I will just be reinforcing bad habits/techniques if I just go to the range and shoot a bunch in that position...

Measure outcomes from different positions. Ie pick a variation of a position and shoot 10 shots on a scorable target, write down score and try different variation.

 

[Nine Banger]

But... but once I get that information, what do I do? So I need to work on sitting unsupported. How do I learn what I'm doing wrong and what to change? It seems that I will just be reinforcing bad habits/techniques if I just go to the range and shoot a bunch in that position...

Measure outcomes from different positions. Ie pick a variation of a position and shoot 10 shots on a scorable target, write down score and try different variation.

With seated unsupported, what are your variables?

- when you're seated you can rotate right or left on the target and load or unload your spine and joints

- your legs are going to wobble, work on stretches to go lower

- don't put bones on bones, work on stretches to go lower

- you can move your off hand in and out on your rifle

- I'll hold the rifle in offhand position for 5 minutes at a time sometimes. I believe this strength building exercise transfers over to seated shooting as well.

- A strong core makes smaller groups in seated unsupported position.

- zoom power, I'm usually in 6x but I've tried 4x and 8x.

An example of testing just came up on the 100 yard HORSE thread.

You're going to reach a range limit in this position due to wobble zone and need sticks or a pack to move out farther.

Bluumoon leg wraps his pack seated but he's taller than me. I have a 25.5" frame on my back and I'm short, so I kneel in Japanese seiza and crush my elbows onto my bino harness. It's going to be different for everyone, but we figured it out by shooting groups and dry firing.
He and I have even spent time discussing right leg over left or left over right at one point for seated unsupported and shot groups about it.

 

[solarshooter]

This version of seated unsupported is the most stable I've tried by far, but doesn't have good recoil control and doesn't allow for quick racking of the bolt. But it drastically reduces wobble for me and with low recoiling guns works just fine.

 

[Bluumoon]

With seated unsupported, what are your variables?

- when you're seated you can rotate right or left on the target and load or unload your spine and joints

- your legs are going to wobble, work on stretches to go lower

- don't put bones on bones, work on stretches to go lower

- you can move your off hand in and out on your rifle

- I'll hold the rifle in offhand position for 5 minutes at a time sometimes. I believe this strength building exercise transfers over to seated shooting as well.

- A strong core makes smaller groups in seated unsupported position.

- zoom power, I'm usually in 6x but I've tried 4x and 8x.

An example of testing just came up on the 100 yard HORSE thread.

You're going to reach a range limit in this position due to wobble zone and need sticks or a pack to move out farther.

Bluumoon leg wraps his pack seated but he's taller than me. I have a 25.5" frame on my back and I'm short, so I kneel in Japanese seiza and crush my elbows onto my bino harness. It's going to be different for everyone, but we figured it out by shooting groups and dry firing.
He and I have even spent time discussing right leg over left or left over right at one point for seated unsupported and shot groups about it.

The which leg over which made a big difference for me personally, was actually the opposite of what I would have guessed for myself.

 

[Norcal18]

I saw the drills, but I must have missed the explanation and tips on the various positions. I’m also wondering how to more smoothly transition from standing with pack on and rifle in hand to sitting/kneeling/prone. Set rifle down -> take pack off -> pick rifle up and get situated? Could also try to take pack off arm by arm as you switch which hand holds the rifle… need to experiment more. But yes any and all tips are much appreciated.

Here’s the video @Snowhunter11 was talking about

 

[ResearchinStuff]

View attachment 1019865
This version of seated unsupported is the most stable I've tried by far, but doesn't have good recoil control and doesn't allow for quick racking of the bolt. But it drastically reduces wobble for me and with low recoiling guns works just fine.

I can't be the only one who has zero chance of getting into or out of that position.

 

[Nine Banger]

I can't be the only one who has zero chance of getting into or out of that position.

Anything like that with feet flat on the ground seated or kneeling is wobble city for me.

For seated I like criss cross applesauce as low as I can go with the knees and torso.

 

[solarshooter]

I can't be the only one who has zero chance of getting into or out of that position.

Anything like that with feet flat on the ground seated or kneeling is wobble city for me.

For seated I like criss cross applesauce as low as I can go with the knees and torso.

Huh? Just try it, it's really easy.

 

[mt terry d]

I suck at seated unsupported.
I doubly suck at off hand.
I'm respectable at prone and seated supported.
If I can't get steady in a certain position I just don't have a shot.
Little different than if an animal is at 700 yards- I don't have a shot.

But I'll keep practicing.

 

[WCT3]

I'm somehow better at offhand than seated unsupported. I definitely need to get back to practicing that instead of just shooting rocks/long range stuff.

 

[WCT3]

Anything like that with feet flat on the ground seated or kneeling is wobble city for me.

For seated I like criss cross applesauce as low as I can go with the knees and torso.

Criss cross applesauce is how I learned with a red ryder back in cub scouts and it's the most effective position I've tried but I suck at seated unsupported shooting. Even back then I was better off hand than seated probably from the numerous hours and thousands of BBs I shot running around my grandparents property back then.