School me on Kestrel Units

[Dobermann]

For my part it’s just an acknowledgment of what you need/what system is easier or better. I prefer a weather meter that gives me wind speed and DA as it’s quicker. The chart for DA is a great back up field tool.

As for weather meters the one I really preferred was the Brunton ADC Pro as it did both wind speed and DA, but also a clock and an alarm and the battery lasted a year plus constant on. They had some QC issues and were discontinued however.

I wonder if the Brunton ADC Summit is an option?

It's not showing on Brunton's US site, but is still showing as available but discontinued on their NZ site, and on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Brunton-ADC-Atmospheric-Data-Center/dp/B000FKMUE4/ref=sr_1_2

Manual seems to suggest it will do DA:



Manual is here: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0217/7948/files/ADC_Summit_Manual.pdf?17230039625499351574

 

[Formidilosus]

I wonder if the Brunton ADC Summit is an option?

It's not showing on Brunton's US site, but is still showing as available but discontinued on their NZ site, and on Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/Brunton-ADC-Atmospheric-Data-Center/dp/B000FKMUE4/ref=sr_1_2

Manual seems to suggest it will do DA:

View attachment 559259

Manual is here: https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0217/7948/files/ADC_Summit_Manual.pdf?17230039625499351574

I believe that is a mistype. The Summits I’ve seen do not give DA.

 

[Tahoe1305]

In ref to min kestrel to get the job done….

I have a sportsman (from a few years back) that is a 5700 link (non elite but can upgrade for $300). I debated upgrading for a recent LR shooting course but didn’t.

It hit everything I aimed the rifle at out to 1200 yds and the link pushed the data and solution to my new sig 6k compact binos. I was pretty impressed with the setup. For hunting I don’t plan on shooting that far so it’s more than enough for me and nice to prove out the dope. I think elite is only helpful for multiple targets or if you plan to shoot Uber far or subsonic region (not in my plans).

 

[Jake Leibke]

Picked up a Kestrel 500 link model. Just got it yesterday so haven’t had a lot of time with it.

Not sure what to think of it so far. Linked it to StrelokPro. I have no way to test accuracy of unit but wind seems off judging by my actual wind corrections. Shot last night and had to hold .8 mil over what app was saying when linked to kestrel unit. Shot the Cold Bore Challenge this morning and knowing that I held .5 more to get a solid hit. Elevation has been spot on.

Also last night unit was reading 6-7 mph and was at about 10:30 position. Had to enter 11 mph at a 90° position to get right wind calls.

Here’s a picture of what the screen in the app looks like. Any ideas on what’s going on?

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[Dos XX]

What about a Kestrel drop D3? It looks like it will send info directly to shooter and some other ballistic apps.

 

[Jake Leibke]

What about a Kestrel drop D3? It looks like it will send info directly to shooter and some other ballistic apps.

I searched that in the App Store and didn’t find it. The kestrel ballistics app only works with the 5700 series.


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[Dos XX]

I searched that in the App Store and didn’t find it. The kestrel ballistics app only works with the 5700 series.


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Scroll down to "Drop apps" on the below link. I just ordered one. I'll know soon.

DROP Apps: A few companies (might be more) producing Apps that work with the DROP​

• Ballistic AE
• Shooter
• AB Mobile (tactical version only)
• MD Ballistics
• StrelokPro

Kestrel DROP D3 Ballistics

Get More Advanced Environmental Monitoring with the DROP D3 Wireless Data Logger

kestrelmeters.com

I have no idea why it says stack path. If you don't like the skanky looking link, go to the Kestrel sight and look at it.

 

[Formidilosus]

Picked up a Kestrel 500 link model. Just got it yesterday so haven’t had a lot of time with it.

Not sure what to think of it so far. Linked it to StrelokPro. I have no way to test accuracy of unit but wind seems off judging by my actual wind corrections. Shot last night and had to hold .8 mil over what app was saying when linked to kestrel unit. Shot the Cold Bore Challenge this morning and knowing that I held .5 more to get a solid hit. Elevation has been spot on.

Also last night unit was reading 6-7 mph and was at about 10:30 position. Had to enter 11 mph at a 90° position to get right wind calls.

Here’s a picture of what the screen in the app looks like. Any ideas on what’s going on?

Well one issue is that wind at the shooter, isn’t wind at the target or wind in between the two. Using a kestrel or any wind meter to pull a wind correction just at the shooter is loaded with failure. You must note the wind at the gun, wind in the middle, wind at the target, and then come up with a total correction to reliably hit.

 

[Jake Leibke]

Scroll down to "Drop apps" on the below link. I just ordered one. I'll know soon.

DROP Apps: A few companies (might be more) producing Apps that work with the DROP​

• Ballistic AE
• Shooter
• AB Mobile (tactical version only)
• MD Ballistics
• StrelokPro

Kestrel DROP D3 Ballistics

Get More Advanced Environmental Monitoring with the DROP D3 Wireless Data Logger

kestrelmeters.com

I have no idea why it says stack path. If you don't like the skanky looking link, go to the Kestrel sight and look at it.

Got ya. I was thinking it was an app you were talking about, not another unit.


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[mcr-85]

Scroll down to "Drop apps" on the below link. I just ordered one. I'll know soon.

DROP Apps: A few companies (might be more) producing Apps that work with the DROP​

• Ballistic AE
• Shooter
• AB Mobile (tactical version only)
• MD Ballistics
• StrelokPro

Kestrel DROP D3 Ballistics

Get More Advanced Environmental Monitoring with the DROP D3 Wireless Data Logger

kestrelmeters.com

I have no idea why it says stack path. If you don't like the skanky looking link, go to the Kestrel sight and look at it.

What are you doing for wind speed?

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[Jake Leibke]

Well one issue is that wind at the shooter, isn’t wind at the target or wind in between the two. Using a kestrel or any wind meter to pull a wind correction just at the shooter is loaded with failure. You must note the wind at the gun, wind in the middle, wind at the target, and then come up with a total correction to reliably hit.

I didn’t have the kestrel with me when I painted targets but I am shooting from an elevated position from them and the wind seemed less down lower where they were.

I need to play with it some more and learn it.


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[Dobermann]

I believe that is a mistype. The Summits I’ve seen do not give DA.

Thanks. I've written to Brunton to ask them definitively and will post back here.

 

[THLR]

The shooting world is full of fudd lore, “we’ve always done it this way” nonsense.

Career-ending truths right there!

I'm firmly with Form. I'll just add emphasis on not to worry about the discrepancy between the DA chart number and the actual DA number measured. The discrepancy is never large enough to be SIGNIFICANT for the bullet impact.

Please note that this is truly a worldwide system. If you are geographically limited (hunt the same area/mountain/season) the same approach can be further simplified, but the DA approach is the best I am aware of (outside automated systems)

I was introduced to DA chart in 2002, but I suspect they are so oldschool they have been pushed into oblivion by cooler, gear-oriented shooters. There was a few difficult years where tech-nonsense dominated conversations.

Anyway, do the maths and put the significant change needed right on your turret.

Re Brunton. I've used and killed a few. It works, but a simple Kestrel has been the better longterm investment.

 

[Roosterstraw]

When using a kestrel is it pretty easy to tell wind direction on the models without a compass or do you suggest getting one with a compass? Looks like the cheapest model that will show environmental data with wind direction is the 5500.

 

[Formidilosus]

When using a kestrel is it pretty easy to tell wind direction on the models without a compass or do you suggest getting one with a compass? Looks like the cheapest model that will show environmental data with wind direction is the 5500.

Can you explain how the compass feature would help you in making a wind call in broken terrain?

 

[mcr-85]

Can you explain how the compass feature would help you in making a wind call in broken terrain?

I would like to hear about how you make wind calls and predictions based on the info you gather at your location.

I know I have read things you've posted about wind at your location, between you and the target and wind at the target. How do you determine your wind call? Especially in broken terrain, ie shooting across a canyon?

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[Roosterstraw]

Can you explain how the compass feature would help you in making a wind call in broken terrain?

My thought is It will help me get wind speed and direction at the muzzle. Direction so I don’t have to think about the degree, I can just type it in the ballistic calculator or br4 vector wind. I understand what you’re saying about broken terrain and being able to judge wind between the target and at the target as well.

 

[THLR]

I would like to hear about how you make wind calls and predictions based on the info you gather at your location.
[...]
Especially in broken terrain, ie shooting across a canyon?
[...]

Here´s what I do

• Simplest solution is to shoot twice using two wind brackets. If fast shooting isn't required
• Use what you see --> make a regular windcall
• Modify windcall based on what type of terrain --> Is the wind compressed or are you shooting high overground. Then I know my windcall is a minimum, it will be "something more". I acknowledge higher error and if target/error budget match I simply shoot edge of vitals and let the bullet drift in.
• You will have rotor behind egdes/downwind or in terrain traps/ pockets (terrain traps as in avalanche assessment). Don't take windcalls from here.
• If the wind is strong, you will also have turbulence behind said edges ("broken wind" for a shooter, meaning it messes with your windcall unpredictably). if the target is right on the edge, no problem. If the target is a few hundred in from the edge it can be difficult to hit.
• Check for "gaps". If you have funnels in the terrain blowing into your trajectory, winddrift will be "more". The worst gaps I find to be V cuts when you shoot along/below ridgelines, can produce very strong gusts. I don't need to shoot past them when hunting, so I just identify them.

Before I do this I have looked around to determine if I am in a sheltered position or a position with "false wind" meaning wind at shooter position is shaped by the terrain feature I'm on. If so, I take wind at target or closer to target or even a short range in front of me. It depends on where I see the wind best.

U shapes are easy, V shapes or broken terrain also breaks the wind and can be difficult
If you want a basic idea how wind increase with elevation (meaning height above surface, not altitude above sealevel) look here https://wind-data.ch/tools/profile.php?lng=en

It's not an exact science, but not hard either. Like shooting up/down, one can theorize it forever but once you do it, it's quite easy as long as you understand the bullet will be above your crosshairs.
I trust the basic windcall and modify it, I never revert to voodoo or long processes.

 

[Formidilosus]

I would like to hear about how you make wind calls and predictions based on the info you gather at your location.

I know I have read things you've posted about wind at your location, between you and the target and wind at the target. How do you determine your wind call? Especially in broken terrain, ie shooting across a canyon?

What @THLR wrote is a very good starting point or overview. For basic shooting, I am looking for- what is the wind at the gun? Is the gun protected from the wind. I.E., is the gun position getting the real wind, or is it in a protected position or pocket as THLR stated? Is the wind consistent between the gun and the target? If not, what obstacles are effecting the wind, and how will that wind effect the bullet? Think about the wind if it was water rushing through.

That all determines a wind hold based on MPH and whether it’s a full value, half value, or no value. 0-600 yards or so, I am not getting cute with devices or calls.

 

[Formidilosus]

My thought is It will help me get wind speed and direction at the muzzle. Direction so I don’t have to think about the degree, I can just type it in the ballistic calculator or br4 vector wind.

Except that you can’t in broken terrain.

This week we were shooting across, through, up, and down this canyon. The wind at the gun was spot on 90° (Right to left) at 2-4 MPH. Both shooters missed their first shots on a 10” target at just under 600 yards doing what amounts to getting the wind speed and direction from a Kestrel and putting that into the data.


The reason they both missed was because they took the direction and speed at the gun as you are wanting, and didn’t notice or observe that they were in a pocket where the wind was blocked by not only the hill to their right 100 yards away, but also that friction from the hill and brush was slowing the wind down at their position. To their right about 100 yards were bushes and trees on the edge of the canyon that showed the wind much higher than 3mph, and not directly at 90°. Additionally, directly to the left was a bowl about 200 yards across that caused the wind to swirl back into itself not only slowing the apparent speed, but quite often showing a left to right wind at the gun, instead of right to left that it actually was.
After their first shots, we went over to the edge and the wind speed at 6-7 foot high was between 8-14mph, with an average of 9 mph.


Using a Kestrel to get the wind degree was useless there. It’s useless in most environments outside of flat prairies and shooting ranges.