Riflescope debate

[CRJR45]

This is probably the worst counter point I’ve ever heard on here, and the bar is pretty high to be honest.

Things happen and rifles get dropped. Particularly if you’re exhausted and moving in tough country. Why people accept scopes that can’t handle even minor abuse is mind boggling to me. Would you buy a truck if the suspension couldn’t handle even minor potholes? Buy a backpack that ripped as easily as a garbage bag? Of course not, but yet scopes get a pass. Even worse, guys get emotionally attached to their optic choices.

And never confuse being capable of doing something with optimal for doing something. That elk deserved more respect than the plastic tubed Simmons could offer.

Speaking of bad counterpoints , I think you should look in the mirror . Trucks are made to go over potholes and backpacks are made to be tough . Scopes are not made to be dropped or thrown around .
Sentimental value always seemed funny to me too .
But not as funny as people who get caught up in the whole "I've gotta have the latest greatest rifle and scope or I can't kill an animal" vibe .

 

[cmahoney]

Speaking of bad counterpoints , I think you should look in the mirror . Trucks are made to go over potholes and backpacks are made to be tough . Scopes are not made to be dropped or thrown around .
Sentimental value always seemed funny to me too .
But not as funny as people who get caught up in the whole "I've gotta have the latest greatest rifle and scope or I can't kill an animal" vibe .

Scopes are made to hit what you are aiming at. If they don’t do that they are worthless.


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[CRJR45]

I have the same philosophy with seatbelts and aircraft.


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Right ! The whole - There are bold pilots , and there are old pilots , but there are no Old bold pilots , saying . Same thing , LOL

 

[Helislacker]

I know this is sarcasm , and I get it , but if I drop my gun , I'm off to the truck for my back up .

Really? If you drop your gun or it takes a slide/impact while strapped to your pack you’re gonna hike back 5-6 miles to the truck? Maybe in some situations if you’re not hiking in very far that would work, but not for anyone I hunt with or myself. That’s a good way to waste a day of the season and unnecessarily wear yourself down with dumb mileage.

 

[CRJR45]

Scopes are made to hit what you are aiming at. If they don’t do that they are worthless.


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Well , if you don't drop them or throw them around , they should be ok , LOL

 

[CRJR45]

Really? If you drop your gun or it takes a slide/impact while strapped to your pack you’re gonna hike back 5-6 miles to the truck? Maybe in some situations if you’re not hiking in very far that would work, but not for anyone I hunt with or myself. That’s a good way to waste a day of the season and unnecessarily wear yourself down with dumb mileage.

I said in an earlier post -

All well and good , you do you . I probably hunt in a less fall prone manner or environment , and what works for you wouldn't really apply to me . The odds that I would experience a fall bad enough to affect my scope seem small to me , as opposed to the known fact that carrying around a heavy ass scope all day just in case I fall .

I see your point , but thats not my scenario .

 

[Helislacker]

Speaking of bad counterpoints , I think you should look in the mirror . Trucks are made to go over potholes and backpacks are made to be tough . Scopes are not made to be dropped or thrown around .
Sentimental value always seemed funny to me too .
But not as funny as people who get caught up in the whole "I've gotta have the latest greatest rifle and scope or I can't kill an animal" vibe .

Yes, and some (the good ones) are made to take abuse and work correctly after taking that abuse. If you had some trucks built to drive over craters and some trucks unable to withstand potholes, no one would buy the latter. Yet the same thing occurs in the scope world and it’s a big point of debate.

Good scopes are made so that you don’t have to be compulsively worried about where your rifle is in relation to your body, rocks, and the ground at all times. Instead you can focus on hunting. I’m not suggesting scopes should be designed to replace a football either, or that I throw mine around for fun. I am careful, but I also understand that impacts at some point with enough time spent in the backcountry are inevitable.

 

[CRJR45]

Guys , I tire of this debate and I will agree to disagree , y'all have a nice day .

 

[Macintosh]

This is religion. Where’s that popcorn eating emojie??

Op, you have mainly budget PRS scopes on your list. Shameless plug—If you have used a 5-ish to 25ish power scope like these and you think it suits you for hunting, then hands down I think the used athlon cronus I have in the classifeds is a better quality scope than any you have listed (except for the swfa which Ive never seen and cant say one way or another). The Meopta that you have listed is the only one that, to me, has the footprint of a hunting scope. Outside of that, if its a hunting scope for a trip you will put a lot of planning, time, effort and $ into, frankly I think it makes sense to stick to a scope with a reputation for reliability. Not a reputation for clear glass, not a reputation for just the right set of features, not a reputation for a great warranty (useless to you when your scope fails on a trip) a reputation for reliability. You can find a bad scope or break any scope, but the ones with a reputation for durability have a reputation because MOST people found them to be durable. SWFA has an exceptional reputation for durability, not just on this site. Nightforce has an exceptional reputation for durability, not just on this website. Trijicon has an exceptional reputation for durability, not just on this website. Schmitt and bender has an exceptional reputation for durability, not just on this website. If you look and ask the question, you will find people that had a bad experience with every single scope on earth. And, not unsurprisingly, you will find plenty of people that have had good experiences with every scope out there, because even on the worst scopes most of them are fine for most people. All of the brands I mentioned have scopes that are either in or very close to your budget that would be perfectly appropriate on a western hunting rifle, so unless one of the other scopes has some characteristic or feature that you absolutely have to have and the other options DONT, why settle?

 

[KoolBreeze]

This is a debate where there is no single answer for everyone. I get that people hunting in rugged terrain, miles from there vehicle, with thousands invested, shooting over long distances, need a rugged scope that dials accurately.

There are those of us where that isn’t as important though. My hunting usually consists of walking half a mile, at most, into my stand where most shots are under 100 yards. Most I could take with iron sights on a 30-30. But there are others like one that presented itself at about 80 yards yesterday afternoon with only maybe a couple minutes of light left. It was all the VX5-HD I was using could do to make out the rack and I decided to pass. That’s why glass trumps drop testing for me.

 

[Macintosh]

I could argue that point, but in this case the guy is asking about 18-27x scopes to go on a 28 nosler I believe he said, for a traveling hunt (of what type is unknown, just “out west”). It doesnt sound like he’s looking for a short range point and shoot scope that gets carried 10 min into a stand.

 

[Precisionbear300prc]

Nothing wrong with an NXS 10 power. How far do you shoot?


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Out to 800yards

 

[fwafwow]

I love rifle scope threads… they all end the same anymore lol

My Google search was a little slow. You were right. ~”I’m out” (or “ I am out .”) I did learn that some things I had considered risks I can avoid by not planning on them happening.

 

[Precisionbear300prc]

I could argue that point, but in this case the guy is asking about 18-27x scopes to go on a 28 nosler I believe he said, for a traveling hunt (of what type is unknown, just “out west”). It doesnt sound like he’s looking for a short range point and shoot scope that gets carried 10 min into a stand.

You are Correct! I’m talking miles of walking through rough terrain… game includes mule deer, black bear and elk.. my rifle will be a .300prc.

 

[cmahoney]

Out to 800yards

15 power is plenty for me at that distance.


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[Precisionbear300prc]

Really? If you drop your gun or it takes a slide/impact while strapped to your pack you’re gonna hike back 5-6 miles to the truck? Maybe in some situations if you’re not hiking in very far that would work, but not for anyone I hunt with or myself. That’s a good way to waste a day of the season and unnecessarily wear yourself down with dumb mileage.

Our camp is going to be 7.5 miles in im not walking back to get a backup rifle unless the barrel is bent and the glass is blow out of the scope… sounds like i need to cough up some money and get an ATACR

 

[Precisionbear300prc]

15 power is plenty for me at that distance.


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I was thinking the Nightforce atacr 4-20

 

[Marbles]

I think this can be looked at like the difference between fixed wing and rotor wing aircraft. To broadly overgeneralize.

A fixed wing wants to fly, cut power and it will glide, you have to screw up to make it fall from the sky, so fixed wing pilots tend to expect things to work out.

A rotor wing aircraft does not want to fly, it beats the laws of physics into submission and loose that ability and it wants to drop like a stone and you have to work to keep it from doing that. Rotor wing pilots expect things to go wrong and prepare accordingly.

While I'm not a pilot, I was raised by a helicopter pilot and taught to expect problems and proactively deal with them.

As for weight, if weight is the ultimate monkey, the iron sights are lighter than even my 9 ounce Weaver K4. So, lightest and most reliable, but most of us prefer scopes for good reason.

 

[35WhelenAI]

I've used Leupolds for 30 years and not had a failure when it was time to shoot the animal or otherwise. Practice rounds, load development, all of that equates to hundreds of rounds through a rifle with the same scope. Although if someone has but one rifle and a 32 ounce scope is the way to peace of mind, it is what it is.

So I understand- you use scopes that are unreliable- it’s easily proven that they are unreliable, then because you use certain scopes, you need to check zero if you take a spill. You don’t see a connection here?


Ok- what “skill” would you deem prudent to check zero? If it tips over on a bipod? What if it’s leaned against a tree and slides off? A small fall with light impact of the rifle? Exactly what level of “accident” will make you say- “nope, gotta go shoot it”?

Incorrect. I was clear. There's more than just a scope that can be jarred in an impact. My choice of words was deliberate, and it was "mounted scope". I specifically mentioned a difference relative scopes by themselves. If there's security when equipment hits something it shouldn't, and hunters feel comfortable using a mechanical system, not just a scope that has suffered an adverse impact that's up to them.

In 30 years results show I have made reliable choices. There are lots of reliable choices, and scopes that can survive a series of drop tests for guys to fall in love with, my friend.

With respect to the level of impact, that determines said caution, I trust hunters individually to know what an adverse impact would be.

It's an assumption on your part that anything was off with respect to proper zero. I haven't experienced it. But I do check it.

I enjoy the debate that goes on, let's keep it up in good civil ways.

 

[freddyG]

How often do the guys that plan on not falling, zero their scopes after traveling rough roads? If a scope cannot survive a fall on a padded mat from a few feet, it sure as hell isn’t going to stay zeroed after traveling washboard roads for a while.

Apologists for junk scopes aren’t hard to find.