Outdoor life suppressor testing

[Huntnpack 2]

Muzzle Device emphasis progression example.

Recoil
Sound
Lightweight

Sound - lightweight

Sound - lightweight - recoil
Recoil - lightweight - sound

several manufacturers would be well advised to take note. Consumer priorities may be shifting or at least widening. New technologies & Creative ideas make things possible.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Muzzle Device emphasis progression example.

Recoil
Sound
Lightweight

Sound - lightweight

Sound - lightweight - recoil
Recoil - lightweight - sound

several manufacturers would be well advised to take note. Consumer priorities may be shifting or at least widening. New technologies & Creative ideas make things possible.

For some people maybe… I don’t really care about extra recoil management from the suppressor or muzzle device. The reduction in blast effects from a suppressor makes shooting any rifle more pleasant. Apart from my 9.3x62s, I don’t really shoot rifles that are heavy on recoil.

I don’t think adding another factor to the equation and then scoring around that does anything for me. The relevant factors for me are suppression, length, weight, and diameter.

 

[omicron1792]

For some people maybe… I don’t really care about extra recoil management from the suppressor or muzzle device. The reduction in blast effects from a suppressor makes shooting any rifle more pleasant. Apart from my 9.3x62s, I don’t really shoot rifles that are heavy on recoil.

I don’t think adding another factor to the equation and then scoring around that does anything for me. The relevant factors for me are suppression, length, weight, and diameter.

Diameter?

 

[Ucsdryder]

Not sure what you’re talking about. Here’s the ranking I referenced.

@Escalante11 are you struggling with your comprehension of basic rankings? You keep posting an unsure face like you don’t understand basic rankings. I’m not sure I can make it any simpler for you to understand, but I’m willing to try.

 

[Huntnpack 2]

For some people maybe… I don’t really care about extra recoil management from the suppressor or muzzle device. The reduction in blast effects from a suppressor makes shooting any rifle more pleasant. Apart from my 9.3x62s, I don’t really shoot rifles that are heavy on recoil.

I don’t think adding another factor to the equation and then scoring around that does anything for me. The relevant factors for me are suppression, length, weight, and diameter.

My point exactly. Some people do care about recoil management from a muzzle device.
some may even have that as a higher priority than
others when choosing.

I pointed out an observation I’ve seen over many years. Starting with the popularity of Brakes as a single focus muzzle device, to a suppressor as a single focus muzzle device, to a focus of making both of those lighter & improving designs of each.
Ie: port design, baffle designs, materials, length, weight, size etc.

Then jump forward to a combined approach by adding brakes to suppressor (for some apparent reason) with the addition of OTB / Reflex.
To Today an approach the other direction of adding a suppressor to Brake.


Both of the above addressing the same 3 priorities
But with different sequences.

Sound - lightweight - recoil
Recoil - lightweight - sound

Kinda seeing an evolution if I step back from viewing thru 15X and drop to 8x & widen the
field of view so to speak.

It’s Good to have options.

 

[Megalodon]

Wow... this has been up for 2.5 days and the King of UM/US/S2H White Knights (since he isn't compensated or have any financial stake in the matter) hasn't shown up to shit on this testing and tell us how stupid everyone is for believing anything he doesn't say is impressive. I figured him and his crew would be here immediately to smear anything that doesn't corroborate their narrative.

Amazing how things shake out when you get an actual 3rd party to test things.

 

[Lawnboi]

For some people maybe… I don’t really care about extra recoil management from the suppressor or muzzle device. The reduction in blast effects from a suppressor makes shooting any rifle more pleasant. Apart from my 9.3x62s, I don’t really shoot rifles that are heavy on recoil.

I don’t think adding another factor to the equation and then scoring around that does anything for me. The relevant factors for me are suppression, length, weight, and diameter.

Recoil/muzzle control imo is just as big of a factor. The fact that you appreciate smaller cartridges means you probably already understand. When someone makes a suppressor that is quiet enough, light enough, small enough, and has the benefit of controlling the muzzle; that can has the possibility of rendering my entire stable irrelevant.

Recoil matters and one of the hardest skills there is in shooting is spotting your shot.

Me…. I’ll put a braked can on my dasher if that means less recoil; but for hunting that can’t come with a huge noise cost. Almost anything over 223 in a hunting weight gun will benefit from some muzzle control.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Diameter?

Yes, if the suppressor is too big around, it starts to occlude the optic. There are workarounds for that, as there are for most things, but they start to come with significant drawbacks (to me at least). No matter what anyone claims about the magical baffle configuration inside the suppressor, suppression is still a volume game. A longer, fatter suppressor with thinner walls and good baffle design is going to trap more gas than a shorter, thinner suppressor with thicker walls and good baffle design. Weight will also increase as a function of increased length, increased diameter, and thicker walls. One significant advantage of the 3d printed designs are that you can have thinner walls without sacrificing strength. This also helps keep weight down.

The Airlock ZG 6.5 is a great option because it is short, fat, and has thin walls (without turning into a rifle grenade like the Scythe Ti). This keeps its weight down. But, on a couple of my rifles, it just barely occludes the bottom of my optic on low power. Just a bit of a distraction, but enough that I would not want it any fatter.

If the number quoted above is correct, these new Tenet cans are the same diameter as the ZG 6.5, 7, and 30.

 

[Benjblt]

Yes, if the suppressor is too big around, it starts to occlude the optic. There are workarounds for that, as there are for most things, but they start to come with significant drawbacks (to me at least). No matter what anyone claims about the magical baffle configuration inside the suppressor, suppression is still a volume game. A longer, fatter suppressor with thinner walls and good baffle design is going to trap more gas than a shorter, thinner suppressor with thicker walls and good baffle design. Weight will also increase as a function of increased length, increased diameter, and thicker walls. One significant advantage of the 3d printed designs are that you can have thinner walls without sacrificing strength. This also helps keep weight down.

The Airlock ZG 6.5 is a great option because it is short, fat, and has thin walls (without turning into a rifle grenade like the Scythe Ti). This keeps its weight down. But, on a couple of my rifles, it just barely occludes the bottom of my optic on low power. Just a bit of a distraction, but enough that I would not want it any fatter.

If the number quoted above is correct, these new Tenet cans are the same diameter as the ZG 6.5, 7, and 30.

I just picked up a ZG 6.5 on preorder and that's my biggest concern is whether or not it will be in my field of view on low power. I'm glad I didn't go with the lowest scope mounts I could find. Maybe that will help.

 

[omicron1792]

Yes, if the suppressor is too big around, it starts to occlude the optic. There are workarounds for that, as there are for most things, but they start to come with significant drawbacks (to me at least). No matter what anyone claims about the magical baffle configuration inside the suppressor, suppression is still a volume game. A longer, fatter suppressor with thinner walls and good baffle design is going to trap more gas than a shorter, thinner suppressor with thicker walls and good baffle design. Weight will also increase as a function of increased length, increased diameter, and thicker walls. One significant advantage of the 3d printed designs are that you can have thinner walls without sacrificing strength. This also helps keep weight down.

The Airlock ZG 6.5 is a great option because it is short, fat, and has thin walls (without turning into a rifle grenade like the Scythe Ti). This keeps its weight down. But, on a couple of my rifles, it just barely occludes the bottom of my optic on low power. Just a bit of a distraction, but enough that I would not want it any fatter.

If the number quoted above is correct, these new Tenet cans are the same diameter as the ZG 6.5, 7, and 30.

I just never heard you mention that before someone else did with lots of your suppressor recommendations.

I also could swear you posted that the airlock didn’t occlude your view at all

The primary purpose of a suppressor is sound reduction. It would have to be one fat cat to worry about over something alot louder. Also most here shooting 16-20” rifles which makes diameter a non issue.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Recoil/muzzle control imo is just as big of a factor. The fact that you appreciate smaller cartridges means you probably already understand. When someone makes a suppressor that is quiet enough, light enough, small enough, and has the benefit of controlling the muzzle; that can has the possibility of rendering my entire stable irrelevant.

Recoil matters and one of the hardest skills there is in shooting is spotting your shot.

Me…. I’ll put a braked can on my dasher if that means less recoil; but for hunting that can’t come with a huge noise cost. Almost anything over 223 in a hunting weight gun will benefit from some muzzle control.

It’s a valid point and it is good to have options. With my focus on still hunting, I guess I am just not ready to put recoil control on a par with suppression. But I am shooting 9-11 pound rifles in .243, .25-06, 6.5 CM, and .270 from field positions. Whether I spot my hit is entirely a function of shooting position with those rifles. If I am prone from a good rest, I can spot my impacts. If I am offhand, I can’t. If somewhere between those extremes, I may or may not be able to spot impacts.

If Tenet applies the same principles to a .375 bore diameter, I will start to get very interested.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

I just never heard you mention that before someone else did with lots of your suppressor recommendations.

I also could swear you posted that the airlock didn’t occlude your view at all

Depends on the rifle on which it is at the time. I have moved scopes and suppressors around a lot trying different combinations. I had one or two combinations where it caused issues. I subsequently “solved” that by swapping a 3-9x for a 6x or 10x.

Edit - additionally, my point wasn’t so much that a 1.7” diameter can *is* a problem, but why we don’t see significantly fatter suppressors (e.g., a 2” diameter suppressor).

 

[Benjblt]

@Escalante11 are you struggling with your comprehension of basic rankings? You keep posting an unsure face like you don’t understand basic rankings. I’m not sure I can make it any simpler for you to understand, but I’m willing to try.

I think @Escalante11 does understand. He also understood my comment.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

I just picked up a ZG 6.5 on preorder and that's my biggest concern is whether or not it will be in my field of view on low power. I'm glad I didn't go with the lowest scope mounts I could find. Maybe that will help.

I honestly would not sweat over it. With the Airlock, I found one or two combinations of 3x magnification, a longer barrel, and low rings that slightly occluded the optic. Just enough to be an annoyance. My point was primarily about why we don’t see 2” diameter cans, not the problems with 1.7” cans. I certainly wouldn’t tell someone not to buy a suppressor with a 1.7” diameter.

 

[HuntHarder]

Yes, if the suppressor is too big around, it starts to occlude the optic. There are workarounds for that, as there are for most things, but they start to come with significant drawbacks (to me at least). No matter what anyone claims about the magical baffle configuration inside the suppressor, suppression is still a volume game. A longer, fatter suppressor with thinner walls and good baffle design is going to trap more gas than a shorter, thinner suppressor.

I know this is what Form has said and made you believe, but it's simply not true. Baffles absolutely matter. Design absolutely matters. It's been proven in 100's of comparisons.

 

[Benjblt]

I honestly would not sweat over it. With the Airlock, I found one or two combinations of 3x magnification, a longer barrel, and low rings that slightly occluded the optic. Just enough to be an annoyance. My point was primarily about why we don’t see 2” diameter cans, not the problems with 1.7” cans. I certainly wouldn’t tell someone not to buy a suppressor with a 1.7” diameter.

Well that makes me feel more confident. I've never owned a suppressor so it's hard to think of all the possible pitfalls. Listening to GoHunt's podcast regarding Tenet two days ago I was wondering if I made a mistake. Mostly from recoil management standpoint. I plan on putting it on a 6.5 PRC and trying it out on my kids' 6.5 creedmoor. I think I'll be happy with the ZG 6.5.

 

[Escalante11]

@Escalante11 are you struggling with your comprehension of basic rankings? You keep posting an unsure face like you don’t understand basic rankings. I’m not sure I can make it any simpler for you to understand, but I’m willing to try.

If you actually read this thread, back up where you jumped in, we were talking about their flagship suppressor. The Limited 30 with port. I stated the objective facts there, and you jumped in with metrics from their ultra-light, non-braked 6.5 suppressor claiming I was off base. Let me put things clearer for you, granted these are just my opinions:

Limited 30 w/ One Port Brake = loud (145+ db), long (7"), and heavy (8 ounces). Sure, it has good recoil mitigation attributes, but is 7" and 8 ounces worth it for a can that is still not remotely hearing safe? For me and most the people I hunt with, not worth it.

Limited 6.5 w/out Port Brake (the can you pivoted to in your defense of the company): short and lightweight, no doubt. But SIGNIFICANTLY louder than the Airlock, which is also shorter for what it's worth. Further, the small improvement on recoil mitigation this can offers is largely a non-issue given it's limited to 6.5 caliber and below rifles to begin with. I can spot impacts with an Airlock and a 6.5 PRC with a decent stock/chassis design as it is..

Again, these are my opinions. And I'm not trying to claim the product sucks. There are certaintly some cool things here. That said and I'll say it again, when a company is going on the podcast and marketing circuit claiming "7 patents" (which I can't find by the way published by the way) and "5 years of development", I guess I just expected more.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

I know this is what Form has said and made you believe, but it's simply not true. Baffles absolutely matter. Design absolutely matters. It's been proven in 100's of comparisons.

I think you need to read what I wrote again. I didn’t say baffle design doesn’t matter at all. It’s just not the most important factor. If you apply the same quality baffle design to a can with more volume, you get better results.

If you are trying to pick a fight, I am not interested. I just don’t care about reducing the recoil on my .243 or .270 as much as I care about making it quieter and shorter. As said, when I see a .375 caliber offering, I’m very interested in comparing it with my AB Raptor 10.

If this turns out to be a paradigm shift in suppressor design, as a consumer, I will be super excited. But right now, I really doubt these cans - which no consumer has purchased, used, or even handled - are going to make every suppressor I own obsolete overnight.

 

[omicron1792]

Well that makes me feel more confident. I've never owned a suppressor so it's hard to think of all the possible pitfalls. Listening to GoHunt's podcast regarding Tenet two days ago I was wondering if I made a mistake. Mostly from recoil management standpoint. I plan on putting it on a 6.5 PRC and trying it out on my kids' 6.5 creedmoor. I think I'll be happy with the ZG 6.5.

Dude. The ZG is an awesome suppressor

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Well that makes me feel more confident. I've never owned a suppressor so it's hard to think of all the possible pitfalls. Listening to GoHunt's podcast regarding Tenet two days ago I was wondering if I made a mistake. Mostly from recoil management standpoint. I plan on putting it on a 6.5 PRC and trying it out on my kids' 6.5 creedmoor. I think I'll be happy with the ZG 6.5.

As I have said elsewhere, nearly everyone I have ever met treats buying his first suppressor like a “good girl” deciding to give up her virginity. I include myself in that category. But once you have one and start to use it, you quickly figure out how much you like it and start to wonder what took you so long to try it out.

There’s always going to be a newer, sexier suppressor calling out to you. It can cause analysis paralysis. But almost any suppressor is better than no suppressor, so there’s no reason to stress that hard over it.

I am sure you will be happy with the ZG 6.5. Mine is lovely. The only suppressor I have owned that I absolutely hated is the Scythe Ti (which was also my first one), because I just couldn’t trust it. So I sold it.