Ok…I need to clean my 22CM after 307 rounds

[Kurts86]

I have a really hard time getting the idea of a “bad” batch of steel causing corrosion on the chemistry side. Every heat of steel I’ve ever seen poured from an electric arc furnace gets at least 1-3 samples run through a mass spectrometer and you get a read out of every element to 0.001% which have to sit within the tolerances of a certain material grade. Usually you stir the heat with inert gas like argon so you produce uniform chemistry within the batch. Every heat of steel is also going to have a test piece go into a metallurgy lab regardless of whether or not someone paid for a material certification.

Heat treating issues are way more common than chemistry issues but it would the chemistry that would impact corrosion more. I’m not saying it’s impossible but the mechanisms for corrosion don’t track with common steel defects I’ve seen in tool steel or foundries.

 

[Kurts86]

The corrosion at the breach and muzzle but not rifling leads me to think the machining tooling was contaminated by previous use on carbon steel.

 

[ChrisAU]

The corrosion at the breach and muzzle but not rifling leads me to think the machining tooling was contaminated by previous use on carbon steel.

Hmmm. This was a blank chambered and threaded by a somewhat reputable gunsmith. He did a few from me and haven’t had issues with the others. Using someone closer to me now though.

 

[Kurts86]

Hmmm. This was a blank chambered and threaded by a somewhat reputable gunsmith. He did a few from me and haven’t had issues with the others. Using someone closer to me now though.

Tooling is consumable so nothing says that even a batch done the same day used the same contaminated (or not) cutter.

I guess you could also back into a batch of 416 steel and unevenly distributed sulfur could cause corrosion but it would likely be more uniform.

 

[Formidilosus]

The area of the breech that is affected is the bottom of the barrel when it was installed if the rifle were resting horizontally. There was no rust anywhere in the entire barrel, and it never had a chemical touch it until I saw this and went to remove what I thought was caked on carbon. The photo in the OP with carbon in the neck area was easily cleaned out. The barrel killed 2 mule deer, 23 whitetails and countless hogs and coyotes in two hunting seasons. Stored horizontally during hunting season in a soft rifle case hanging on the backseat of my truck or horizontally on a rack in my game room. Practiced with pretty regularly both summers before hunting seasons. Just very strange to be pitted at both ends. Gonna screw it back in and shoot some more I suppose ha.

I believe you- I’m just relating that I have seen the same. I have 30+ rifles right now all shot and stored the same, all 100% suppressed- never cleaned, etc; and a Bartlien is the only one that has corrosion similar to what you show. I also have Bartlien’s that don’t show the same issues right beside them. The only thing I can come up with is bad steel of some sort.

For my part- I’m already being asked about whether your barrel here means that someone should be taking them apart and cleaning the barrel and can after every session, especially with the ridiculous posts about muzzle pitting and taking off brakes after every time shooting from Frank on SH.
I’m not going to change what I do with rifles/barrels because of a random weird result with one outlier though. My response is “no, I’m not using a one off anomaly to drive general behavior”.

 

[LaHunter]

Update here, the carbon was clinging to pitting it would seem. What in the world would cause this on an 18 month old barrel with 307 rounds? It never saw any chemicals. There is even pitting on the muzzle end, but the rifling is a pretty as the day it was cut. I am befuddled.

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You are on SH I think. I am sure you have read Frank Green’s (Barlien Barrels) thread about barrel bore neglect. Leaving the bore filthy collects moisture from the air and I am guessing crested some type of aggressive chemical. I respect and value his opinion and experience.

 

[Q_Sertorius]

To me, it sounds as though the rifle got put away with some rainwater in it. Or some other significant amount of moisture pooled there. I guess ordinary condensation could have run down the bore and pooled in those spots.

Apart from corrosive salts, like from old military ammunition, or blackpowder, the primary cause of pitting or corrosion is not carbon, it’s copper. In a sufficiently humid climate, moisture reacts with the copper to cause corrosion. A light layer of oil is all that is needed to keep the moisture away from the copper and prevent this from happening.

 

[rbutcher1234]

In a sufficiently humid climate, moisture reacts with the copper to cause corrosion. A light layer of oil is all that is needed to keep the moisture away from the copper and prevent this from happening.

Where do you live? I live in an incredibly humid climate and I haven’t seen this.

Again, I and the people around me combined have easily north of 50-100 barrels and hundreds of thousands of rounds fired over many years, 90%+ suppressed, and the barrels are never cleaned. My guns are stored muzzle up, others horizontal, others lying around and tucked in corners, cans always on. Not a single person has had this barrel pitting problem. With anything. AR15s, AR10s, trashcan AKs, multiple AIs, MRADs, tons of tikkas, impacts with a slew of barrel makers, MP5s, etc.

This includes guns in the rain. In sleet. In mud that are just hosed off/cleared by dumping a Nalgene on and then keep going. In one case, a gun that was in the bed of a truck during a flash flood until the water drained away. It totaled the truck, but the gun is just fine.

I’m just trying to say, as a counterpoint to all these comments, that I am not saying this from a sample size of 5 and filling gaps with internet posts.

Everyone should do that they are comfortable with and feel is worth their investment in time. This is one of those things that I feel is not only not worth time but is detrimental to performance. My own guns always work, always hit what they are expected to hit, and remain consistent. I am the biggest variable, not the equipment. Why would I want to do anything that changes that situation?

Edit: clarifying this because of messages I got. I’m not saying I’ve never seen a single barrel problem. I’ve seen lots. I just haven’t seen this one

 

[Q_Sertorius]

Where do you live? I live in an incredibly humid climate and I haven’t seen this.

Again, I and the people around me combined have easily north of 50-100 barrels and hundreds of thousands of rounds fired over the years, 90%+ suppressed, and the barrels are never cleaned. My guns are stored muzzle up, others horizontal, others lying around and tucked in corners, cans always on. Not a single person has had this barrel pitting problem. With anything. AR15s, AR10s, trashcan AKs, multiple AIs, MRADs, tons of tikkas, impacts with a slew of barrel makers, MP5s, etc.

This includes guns in the rain. In sleet. In mud that are just hosed off/cleared by dumping a Nalgene on and then keep going. In one case, a gun that was in the bed of a truck during a flash flood until the water drained away. It totaled the truck, but the gun is just fine.

I’m just trying to say, as a counterpoint to all these comments, that I am not saying this from a sample size of 5 and filling gaps with internet posts.

Everyone should do that they are comfortable with and feel is worth their investment in time. This is one of those things that I feel is not only not worth time but is detrimental to performance. My own guns always work, always hit what they are expected to hit, and remain consistent. I am the biggest variable, not the equipment. Why would I want to do anything that changes that situation?

I’m not saying all guns rust like that. I am telling you what causes the rust when it happens.

And I have seen plenty of rusty rifles in overly damp armories.

 

[Ucsdryder]

Another thread where it proves cleaning good, not cleaning potentially bad. Still don’t get the reason to NOT clean periodically. Sure, you might not have issues, MIGHT, being the key word. There just isn’t a reason NOT to clean, other than the couple shots to foul.

 

[ddowning]

Another thread where it proves cleaning good, not cleaning potentially bad. Still don’t get the reason to NOT clean periodically. Sure, you might not have issues, MIGHT, being the key word. There just isn’t a reason NOT to clean, other than the couple shots to foul.

I agree that cleaning is good. Some people shoot so much that cleaning would have to take the place of their job. They shoot stuff until it is done, throw it in the trash, and screw on new. From that standpoint, cleaning is bad.

I personally have guns I shoot very little that I baby, and guns that are for shooting that get ridden like a rented mule. I have shot enough in my life that it would not make me sad if I never again touched a cleaning rod or a reloading press, so much so that this disdain makes the decision of archery or guns right now. Maybe it will soften after a few years, but right now I am really burned out on guns. No cleaning certainly reduces the work involved in shooting.

 

[Wrench]

Nature's battery. Stainless barrel found a bit of carbon and did it's natural cathodic event.

Look at the nobility chart and see how different materials react with each other.

 

[Xperimental]

i clean mine every 500 rounds but i guess 307 is as good as any number or point to consider cleaning.

 

[HuntHarder]

Another thread where it proves cleaning good, not cleaning potentially bad. Still don’t get the reason to NOT clean periodically. Sure, you might not have issues, MIGHT, being the key word. There just isn’t a reason NOT to clean, other than the couple shots to foul.

But Form doesn't clean his....

 

[Castle Rock]

But Form doesn't clean his....

Prolly doesn’t change the oil in his truck either

 

[SDHNTR]

Frank green would probably tell you carbon fouling holds moisture and results in corrosion. I imagine there is plenty of humidity in your part of the country. A recent related thread.

Not bad steel.... this is putting it away dirty and not cleaning it syndrome

So here is a good picture of what happens when you put a barrel away dirty for X amount of time and then you take it out and clean it. The SS is more forgiving then a CM steel barrel but I keep telling guys... put it away dirty for X amount of time and add in the conditions it was shot in and...

www.snipershide.com

This. Where I live. If a gun is not cleaned within days of it being shot, you can count on similar pitting.

 

[Castle Rock]

Yeah, who would have imagined that steel rusts.
Galvanic corrosion is real.

 

[Ratamahatta]

Does the military do this? Just curious with all their rifles with cans on them.

 

[Castle Rock]

I’m hesitant to reply to someone with that avatar

 

[wind gypsy]

I live in a very humid part of the country, leave my cans on all the time, store guns vertically, and never clean my guns. I have never seen this issue ever.

If you never clean them, how would you see it?

My rifles tend to get a nice layer of carbon on the face of the muzzle, how would I know if they are pitted without cleaning it off?