New mountain rifle considerations

[texansport]

Seekins Element is a fairly light and accurate rifle. 21" barrel, threaded, and ~ 5.5 lbs bare rifle. I bought one for an upcoming Dall hunt and I've been enjoying it so far.

What cartridge did you go with? I was looking at these too, custom performance off the shelf.

Good luck on your sheep hunt!

 

[waspocrew]

What cartridge did you go with? I was looking at these too, custom performance off the shelf.

Good luck on your sheep hunt!

Thanks!

I went with the 6.5 PRC. Should work out well! The 2 port SRS brake makes spotting shots easy.

Target pics are 5 shots groups at 100 yards with Norma 143 gr golden target and Nosler 142 gr ABLR factory ammo.

 

[texansport]

I’m thinking about going another direction. Leading thought is a 7mm-08 t3x superlite, thread and drop into a lightweight folder (XLR comes to kind) topped with a Swaro Z6i 1.7-10.

I’ll keep the sako 30-06 stock as a light weight elk gun (I don’t generally apply for elk, mostly building points because I hunt solo most of the time).

Thoughts? I was strongly considering the 6mm creedmoor as well but I really think aoudad are better at soaking lead than elk, so energy is on my mind. I lost an aoudad that tumbled down a canyon onto a ledge I couldn’t recover so I really want to try to anchor them. The rest of my hunting (75%) is whitetail/muleys so 7mm-08 shouldn’t have a problem.

Only concern is ammo availability (I don’t reload) and it’s an older design cartridge.

Would love to hear opinions, maybe I should just go to 6.5cm?

Seekins Element in 6.5prc and Kimber MA 280ai are really tempting without having to go semi-custom but my main goal is weight and recoil reduction and I imagine they’ll kick.

 

[texansport]

Does energy not matter? Is it truly just terminal velocity and bullet selection I need to consider? Am I thinking about this wrong?

 

[mtnbound]

Does energy not matter? Is it truly just terminal velocity and bullet selection I need to consider? Am I thinking about this wrong?

I would focus on terminal velocity, and bullet selection.

 

[Jake Larsen]

Does energy not matter? Is it truly just terminal velocity and bullet selection I need to consider? Am I thinking about this wrong?

It’s be worth your time to take a spin through the Small caliber kill threads. 22, 6mm specifically. Even if you don’t go that route, it’s eye opening. In short, tissue damage is what kills. There’s definitely ways to achieve extremely lethal tissue damage with smaller cartridges/calibers as long as you understand bullet performance and select accordingly.

The upside is much easier and cheaper to shoot lightweight rifles. Spotting impacts and not developing flinch is a big deal


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[mtnbound]

I’m thinking about going another direction. Leading thought is a 7mm-08 t3x superlite, thread and drop into a lightweight folder (XLR comes to kind) topped with a Swaro Z6i 1.7-10.

I’ll keep the sako 30-06 stock as a light weight elk gun (I don’t generally apply for elk, mostly building points because I hunt solo most of the time).

Thoughts? I was strongly considering the 6mm creedmoor as well but I really think aoudad are better at soaking lead than elk, so energy is on my mind. I lost an aoudad that tumbled down a canyon onto a ledge I couldn’t recover so I really want to try to anchor them. The rest of my hunting (75%) is whitetail/muleys so 7mm-08 shouldn’t have a problem.

Only concern is ammo availability (I don’t reload) and it’s an older design cartridge.

Would love to hear opinions, maybe I should just go to 6.5cm?

Seekins Element in 6.5prc and Kimber MA 280ai are really tempting without having to go semi-custom but my main goal is weight and recoil reduction and I imagine they’ll kick.

6CM will do what you are talking about, as will the 6.5 PRC, but there is less recoil with the 6CM. Anchoring an animal is about CNS destruction, but even then, an animal can take a tumble off a cliff. It would be best to shoot an animal in a spot that is not next to a cliff.
I think an aoudad's chest cavity is about half the size of an elk, so I feel the 6CM will more than adequately kill.

 

[Jake Larsen]

I’m thinking about going another direction. Leading thought is a 7mm-08 t3x superlite, thread and drop into a lightweight folder (XLR comes to kind) topped with a Swaro Z6i 1.7-10.

I’ll keep the sako 30-06 stock as a light weight elk gun (I don’t generally apply for elk, mostly building points because I hunt solo most of the time).

Thoughts? I was strongly considering the 6mm creedmoor as well but I really think aoudad are better at soaking lead than elk, so energy is on my mind. I lost an aoudad that tumbled down a canyon onto a ledge I couldn’t recover so I really want to try to anchor them. The rest of my hunting (75%) is whitetail/muleys so 7mm-08 shouldn’t have a problem.

Only concern is ammo availability (I don’t reload) and it’s an older design cartridge.

Would love to hear opinions, maybe I should just go to 6.5cm?

Seekins Element in 6.5prc and Kimber MA 280ai are really tempting without having to go semi-custom but my main goal is weight and recoil reduction and I imagine they’ll kick.

I wouldn’t hesitate to shoot an elk with a 7mm-08. There’s an entire thread dedicated to kills with that cartridge.

I killed a nice bull very dead with a chopped 7SAW a couple weeks ago. Just a 7mm-08 with an ackly shoulder. 165 TGK @ 2675MV, 400 yard shot. Supressed, it’s very mild. My rifle is right at 8lbs ready to hunt. Easy to spot impacts, and I still have 1800fps at 600 yards.


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[texansport]

I wouldn’t hesitate to shoot an elk with a 7mm-08. There’s an entire thread dedicated to kills with that cartridge.

I killed a nice bull very dead with a chopped 7SAW a couple weeks ago. Just a 7mm-08 with an ackly shoulder. 165 TGK @ 2675MV, 400 yard shot. Supressed, it’s very mild. My rifle is right at 8lbs ready to hunt. Easy to spot impacts, and I still have 1800fps at 600 yards.


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Fair point, I’ve seen a lot of posts with 400yd + elk kills with the 7mm-08, but would you use a 6cm/6.5cm on elk personally?

Still not questioning that lots of folks get it done with less.

7mm-08 does deliver a little more energy with a larger diameter bullet with little recoil trade off which makes it seem like a “good value”.

I think 6cm/6.5cm/7mm-08/25-06 are all in the same recoil class, 6.5PRC is a step up so I was looking at the 4 former for a super light rifle. Y’all turned me away from the 280ai/6.5PRC which I appreciate.

I genuinely appreciate y’all’s replies.

 

[Jake Larsen]

Fair point, I’ve seen a lot of posts with 400yd + elk kills with the 7mm-08, but would you use a 6cm/6.5cm on elk personally?

Still not questioning that lots of folks get it done with less.

7mm-08 does deliver a little more energy with a larger diameter bullet with little recoil trade off which makes it seem like a “good value”.

I think 6cm/6.5cm/7mm-08/25-06 are all in the same recoil class, 6.5PRC is a step up so I was looking at the 4 former for a super light rifle. Y’all turned me away from the 280ai/6.5PRC which I appreciate.

I genuinely appreciate y’all’s replies.

I’m about to rebarrel my 30 cal custom down to 6CM if that answers your question…would I choose it for an elk? Ehhhh idk. I’d probably grab the 7SAW if they were side by side. Would I worry about shooting an elk with it? With the right bullet, no. Not based on what I’ve seen of photos on here, and my understanding of bullet performance. I’m planning on loading 108 Elite Hunters from an 18 or maybe 20” tube. They will still have 1800fps at 700-800 yards without stepping on the gas too hard. When that bullet upsets, it’s absolutely lethal. If it hits vitals, it’ll create massive tissue damage, which is all it takes to kill. Energy doesn’t kill, tissue damage kills. I’m totally confident that bullet will create a wound channel equal to or greater than my .30 cal chambering did with a bonded bullet.

I grew up shooting .260 Remington, which is basically identical to 6.5Creed. Killed deer, elk, antelope with it. Mostly with hornady interlocks or Speer grand slams. Old school bonded type bullets. Modern bullets are FAR more lethal, and the 6.5 Creed is optimized to use them.

My grandpa killed 42 elk with a .243 and Nosler partitions. Basically identical to a 6CM, just optimized for high BC bullets…

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[texansport]

I’m about to rebarrel my 30 cal custom down to 6CM if that answers your question…would I choose it for an elk? Ehhhh idk. I’d probably grab the 7SAW if they were side by side. Would I worry about shooting an elk with it? With the right bullet, no. Not based on what I’ve seen of photos on here, and my understanding of bullet performance. I’m planning on loading 108 Elite Hunters from an 18 or maybe 20” tube. They will still have 1800fps at 700-800 yards without stepping on the gas too hard. When that bullet upsets, it’s absolutely lethal. If it hits vitals, it’ll create massive tissue damage, which is all it takes to kill. Energy doesn’t kill, tissue damage kills. I’m totally confident that bullet will create a wound channel equal to or greater than my .30 cal chambering did with a bonded bullet.

I grew up shooting .260 Remington, which is basically identical to 6.5Creed. Killed deer, elk, antelope with it. Mostly with hornady interlocks or Speer grand slams. Old school bonded type bullets. Modern bullets are FAR more lethal, and the 6.5 Creed is optimized to use them.

My grandpa killed 42 elk with a .243 and Nosler partitions. Basically identical to a 6CM, just optimized for high BC bullets…

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7 SAW looks sweet, I’m just not 100% dedicated to reloading yet.

Vortex has a good #10minutetalk where they basically say the .243 and 6cm are comparable, 6cm more efficient, .243 a little more powder, similar terminal performance.

Thanks again.

 

[Jake Larsen]

7 SAW looks sweet, I’m just not 100% dedicated to reloading yet.

Vortex has a good #10minutetalk where they basically say the .243 and 6cm are comparable, 6cm more efficient, .243 a little more powder, similar terminal performance.

I wouldn’t do a 7SAW as my only/primary unless you’re really into custom gun stuff. Juice isn’t worth the squeeze. Go with something you can buy otc.

The 22Creed, 6.5 Creed and 6Creed are just optimized for these modern high BC match type bullets. Barrel twists ect. You could achieve the same thing with more classic cartridges if you were able to select proper barrel twists and freebore them appropriately.


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[Jake Larsen]

Had to post this. My brother killed this bull at first light this morning with a .260 (6.5 CM). Went 20 yards. Shot it right above the heart. He didn’t care how much energy that bullet had. Tissue damage = death.

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[FrankieP1988]

Had to post this. My brother killed this bulk at first light this morning with a .260 (6.5 CM). Went 20 yards. Shot it right above the heart

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Congrats to your brother! I shot my bull this year with a 6.5 cm also!


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[texansport]

Had to post this. My brother killed this bull at first light this morning with a .260 (6.5 CM). Went 20 yards. Shot it right above the heart. He didn’t care how much energy that bullet had. Tissue damage = death.

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Congratulations! What range?

 

[Jake Larsen]

Congratulations! What range?

Just under 200. With a hornady interlock, which is a quite tough bullet. Not what I’d choose if you’re planning on killing something at 500 yards with it haha.

Relevant to your earlier question about “if energy matters” I used to think so, but the more evidence I look at, the more my opinion/understanding changes. If you put a bullet into vitals at a velocity which causes upset/tissue damage, it’ll kill.


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