New bore cleaning strategies for 2025

[huntnful]

The guys who clean a lot can mess things up just as much as the guys who clean too little. Gotta be smart.

Isn’t that the truth hahaha. I’ve been on both ends lol.

 

[wind gypsy]

Who says never clean? I don’t ever remember that. I think you are over simplifying it way too far.

You been under a rock? Ryan Avery and Form are 2 that are pretty influential around here that say they never clean bores.

 

[BRTreedogs]

@justin davis
To be fair you groups “opened up” to what .5-.6?

That’s better than most fells shoot to begin with.
And if you go with @Formidilosus match he has show with hit rate prob it doesn’t matter as long as you stay under 1.5 cone of accuracy.

So yeah doesn’t matter. Really

 

[Turkeytider]

Who says never clean? I don’t ever remember that. I think you are over simplifying it way too far.

The “no clean” guys say they never clean until accuracy degrades. Which is what you said.

My question for the “ no clean “ guys is this. If you NEVER clean, or clean “ when the rifle tells you”, do you end up having to deal with the dreaded CARBON RING? I wonder if the majority of those who report the nightmares related to the carbon ring, and those having to use stuff only slightly less dramatic than dynamite to get it out, are most often those who rarely if ever clean their barrels or those who wait until “ the rifle tells them “.

 

[nobody]

Clean when issues arise. I’m at 1800 rounds on my current Tikka 6.5 creed, I’ve pulled a bore snake through after some particularly dusty trips, probably 2-3 times total. It’s never seen a cleaning rod. Traded off a ruger American in 6.5 recently with over 2500 rounds down the tube and just had the occasional bore snake. Was shooting great when I traded it off. Same with a 308, multiple AR’s, and a couple ruger 10/22’s. They all shoot/shot great still.

I do blow things out with compressed air after every range trip though, just to get rid of dust. And muzzleloaders are always scrubbed squeaky clean with acetone after each use/trip because of the corrosiveness of black powder.

 

[hereinaz]

You been under a rock? Ryan Avery and Form for 2 that are pretty influential around here that say they never clean bores.

I have been under a rock, apparently. I don’t remember any specific bore cleaning threads cause it’s not that overall important in the grand scheme of things. Could be cause I am getting old…

I was wrong.

@justin davis
To be fair you groups “opened up” to what .5-.6?

That’s better than most fells shoot to begin with.
And if you go with @Formidilosus match he has show with hit rate prob it doesn’t matter as long as you stay under 1.5 cone of accuracy.

So yeah doesn’t matter. Really

I largely agree, if the rifle hits what you want, who cares about cleaning. It’s not a magical mystical thing for the vast majority, but the details get lost on people. Or, at least they don’t know who to believe or why.

Those that “never” clean, based on what people are saying, they “never” get beyond their acceptable level of precision. That’s ok and reasonable. It saves barrels from the error of over cleaning too much.

Many barrels don’t need much cleaning to stay precise enough for the “cone of accuracy” for increased tolerance towards group size. Many chambers and cartridges will never have a problem with the carbon ring.

Never cleaners are falling into a subset that don’t need it because of rifle/chamber/cartridge choices. Also some laziness cause they see it doesn’t matter.

There are factors and preferences that put them in that camp. The other side is the “must clean” camp.

Like many things, change the criteria and circumstances and change the answer.

The answer I give is nearly always, it depends… there is rarely a “correct” answer. Carbon rings are real, so I would assume the never cleaners are making choices that avoid it.

“Frequent” cleaners are falling into the category where they care about ultimate precision, cartridge choices that have problems with carbon rings, and some OCD maybe cause they like stuff clean.

For me, I don’t chase super small groups so I don’t freak out about cleaning. I am good with a real 1 moa on my long range guns and some rifles only need to meet a 3 moa group for its purpose.

I have nice barrels that haven’t been cleaned in over 1000 rounds. Is that “never cleaning” if I happen to burn the barrel maintaining my level of accuracy, si guess for that barrel am I a never cleaner?

If a shooter is happy with 1.5 moa cone of accuracy, that’s cool. And, many barrels wouldn’t need it.

To Forms point about group size and field precision, most don’t need to clean to maintain killing precision to the ranges that the vast majority shoot. Given that, I think some barrels get cleaned based off of 3 shot groups on a shooters bad range day that don’t actually represent a decline in accuracy.

Another example of a possibly confounding factor about cleaning is whether to clean between switching between monos and jacketed bullets. It has nothing to do with “clean” but rather whatever weird thing happens to the bore, if it actually happens…

 

[TaperPin]

“Frequent” cleaners are falling into the category where they care about ultimate precision, cartridge choices that have problems with carbon rings, and some OCD maybe cause they like stuff clean.

To the “frequent” cleaner category I’d add those who like reliability. Since I was 20ish I’ve never trouble shot a rifle, or just worked up a load and had to wonder if the barrel is too dirty. I’ve never had to wonder if a load is over pressure because of a carbon ring, or been hunting and had to wonder if today was the day a dirty barrel will cause a problem.

I do have to admit to having a dedicated wash bucket and detailing supplies for washing cars, and a maintenance stand for mountain bikes to give them a little scrub from time to time. I’ve always said you can tell who cleans their barrels by the way their bicycle looked back in junior high school. *chuckle*

 

[Ryan Avery]

the guys that say you don’t need to clean ever…I’m not sure I buy it. I want to get on board but I’ve seen accuracy degrade and cleaning tighten it up. Just recently my 6.5 prc started shooting bigger groups. I was trying to figure out what the deal was. It has it had about 180 shots thru it since last cleaning. It Was shooting weird.

I cleaned barrel and the group tighten right up

Three-shot groups don't tell you much.

I haven't cleaned a rifle bore in at least ten years.

 

[huntnful]

I have been under a rock, apparently. I don’t remember any specific bore cleaning threads cause it’s not that overall important in the grand scheme of things. Could be cause I am getting old…

I was wrong.



I largely agree, if the rifle hits what you want, who cares about cleaning. It’s not a magical mystical thing for the vast majority, but the details get lost on people. Or, at least they don’t know who to believe or why.

Those that “never” clean, based on what people are saying, they “never” get beyond their acceptable level of precision. That’s ok and reasonable. It saves barrels from the error of over cleaning too much.

Many barrels don’t need much cleaning to stay precise enough for the “cone of accuracy” for increased tolerance towards group size. Many chambers and cartridges will never have a problem with the carbon ring.

Never cleaners are falling into a subset that don’t need it because of rifle/chamber/cartridge choices. Also some laziness cause they see it doesn’t matter.

There are factors and preferences that put them in that camp. The other side is the “must clean” camp.

Like many things, change the criteria and circumstances and change the answer.

The answer I give is nearly always, it depends… there is rarely a “correct” answer. Carbon rings are real, so I would assume the never cleaners are making choices that avoid it.

“Frequent” cleaners are falling into the category where they care about ultimate precision, cartridge choices that have problems with carbon rings, and some OCD maybe cause they like stuff clean.

For me, I don’t chase super small groups so I don’t freak out about cleaning. I am good with a real 1 moa on my long range guns and some rifles only need to meet a 3 moa group for its purpose.

I have nice barrels that haven’t been cleaned in over 1000 rounds. Is that “never cleaning” if I happen to burn the barrel maintaining my level of accuracy, si guess for that barrel am I a never cleaner?

If a shooter is happy with 1.5 moa cone of accuracy, that’s cool. And, many barrels wouldn’t need it.

To Forms point about group size and field precision, most don’t need to clean to maintain killing precision to the ranges that the vast majority shoot. Given that, I think some barrels get cleaned based off of 3 shot groups on a shooters bad range day that don’t actually represent a decline in accuracy.

Another example of a possibly confounding factor about cleaning is whether to clean between switching between monos and jacketed bullets. It has nothing to do with “clean” but rather whatever weird thing happens to the bore, if it actually happens…

Very well said. That exactly how I view it as well.

 

[SloppyJ]

Thorroclean is legit. If I'm cleaning I'm using that because it's easy, quick, and painless. Just a little messy with the paste. I havent found a reason not to use it.

I have a bunch of barrels for a few custom actions. A practice set including a prs rig and a hunting set. I clean them once a year when I change them out unless I start getting pressure or accuracy signs

 

[RWT]

If I buy a used rifle. I clean it and treat it like a prom queen for the first 100 rounds.
This also involves pulling action and rails to remove all oil/unknown substances from previous owner. This is to see what it likes and how she wants to be treated. I’ll run a few wet patchs after I found a round that it likes and I’ve decided to shoot only that load. This is assuming I am going to keep the rifle.

After this it is wiped down the exterior and action when it fills with dust. I generally won’t touch the bore again unless accuracy degrades drastically.

I have a 30 year old savage 308 that I lost count at 2500 rounds in 2005 that shoots terrible after cleaning. So I stopped cleaning it. I was a believer in cleaning every 250ish rounds. When I did clean the first 10 rounds after cleaning were always 2-3” groups. After the first box settles in and shoots 1.2ish groups consistently. I did this 3 or 4 times. I got tired of wasting a box to “lead it up” after cleaning. Probably means a poorly cut barrel, but the critters don’t know that.

 

[justin davis]

Three-shot groups don't tell you much.

I haven't cleaned a rifle bore in at least ten years.

Yea I know 3 shots don’t mean squat. But I just used those pics as a reference to what I saw. There was a clear increase in accuracy after cleaning

 

[Unckebob]

When I discovered Wipe Out, it was like a gift from God.

Steps:
1) Fill bore with Wipe Out before dawn (I am an early riser)
2) Live my life all day
3) Run a few patches through it to get the gunk out when it is convenient

 

[BRTreedogs]

Yea I know 3 shots don’t mean squat. But I just used those pics as a reference to what I saw. There was a clear increase in accuracy after cleaning

But does that increased accuracy do anything for you besides make you feel good?

 

[huntnful]

But does that increased accuracy do anything for you besides make you feel good?

The honest answer for me is no. I just like it haha. My guns do seem to shoot a LITTLE better on a clean bore.

 

[PC356]

Yea I know 3 shots don’t mean squat. But I just used those pics as a reference to what I saw. There was a clear increase in accuracy after cleaning

Argument could be made that was a coincidence. All six of those shots are most likely within that rifles “cone”. Not enough shots fired after the fact to make that determination.

 

[wind gypsy]

I've had enough times where things seem to tighten up and shoot more consistent on a clean bore that I think there is something to it. That said, I still have days where things aren't shooting tight that I cant explain so it makes me take one off results with a grain of salt.

 

[justin davis]

Argument could be made that was a coincidence. All six of those shots are most likely within that rifles “cone”. Not enough shots fired after the fact to make that determination.

Yea well it wasnt just 6 shots. It was over multiple shots and multiple days. I was scratching my head thinking that these bullets just wouldn’t shoot in my gun. In my mind it didn’t have to do with cleaning. I just thought the bullets didn’t shoot in the gun. But cleaning made a big difference

 

[justin davis]

But does that increased accuracy do anything for you besides make you feel good?

Yea probably not. Just in my mind a gun that shoots .5 moa is gonna shoot tighter and better at long range than a gun that shoots 1.5 moa. But maybe I’m off in that thinking

 

[BRTreedogs]

Yea probably not. Just in my mind a gun that shoots .5 moa is gonna shoot tighter and better at long range than a gun that shoots 1.5 moa. But maybe I’m off in that thinking

If you listen to @Formidilosus podcast on S2H the difference in a .5 rifle and a 1.5 rifle at I believe it was 800 yards was under 1% hit rate difference if I remember correctly.

It was basically negligible.