MK Machining Needs your Help! Good/Better/Best optics

[Tony R-MkMachining]

Hey guys, Tony from MK Machining here. I'm not on here often, but I try to check in from time to time. Today, I need help and I think this community is the best to seek this sort of information from.

I have been tasked at work to come up with a "Good, Better, Best" list of optics that revolve around the Hunting genre. I was also asked to come up with a list of optics for general long range shooting (tactical/PRS ect..) which I knocked out pretty quick, but hunting optics are so highly debated. I'm curious to hear everyone's three choices. I have a few picked out, but I will refrain mentioning those as I don't want to skew the conversation.

The driving factor is price point. For perspective, my tactical list started out at $700 for the "good", better is roughly $2,500 and best essentially doesn't have a price range, but $3,500-5,500. Every feature is a consideration (weight/size/reticle/holds zero), but again to try and not push the conversation a certain direction, I'm going to leave all of those up to you guys. I also can not come up with a more tailored use case "western spot stalk" or "white tail inside of 200", but rather the overall best picks for each category. They initially asked me to come up with the top 3 scopes of all time for every use, to which I replied, "I can't do that as optics are made with wildly varying end uses", but I can't break this down any further.


When we make public opinions known to our audience, we really try to consider every factor. We really try to remain unbiased as we sell multiple brands. Trying not to step on any toes, but will do so if the answer is really clear.

 

[alexnelon]

Good - SWFA 3-9, 3-15, NF SHV f1

Better - NF NX8, Maven RS1.2, Trijicon Tenmile 3-18, ATACR 4-16

Best - I don't think there is a scope that fits into this category for hunting.

 

[Tony R-MkMachining]

Good - SWFA 3-9, 3-15, NF SHV f1

Better - NF NX8, Maven RS1.2, Trijicon Tenmile 3-18, ATACR 4-16

Best - I don't think there is a scope that fits into this category for hunting.

Curious on your "best" statement. Do you think it just doesn't exist, or there are too many very high performers to nail one or a couple down?

 

[alexnelon]

Curious on your "best" statement. Do you think it just doesn't exist, or there are too many very high performers to nail one or a couple down?

There's not one. Nobody makes a "high end" scope that ever even considered hunting in the design process.

They all have goofy reticles and weigh 3 pounds. That's not useful for hunting. We need a 20 oz scope that holds zero, dials accurately, with a zero stop, capped windage, and is ~3-15x40, FFP with a reticle that is usable through the whole magnification range.

Nobody makes one. Nobody even tries.

 

[MagnumHntr]

Good- NF 4-16x42 mil-r- heavy at 30oz

Better- swfa 3-9x42 MQ- no capped windage

Best-Maven RS 1.2- needs NF turret caps and clicks


Good better best is mainly based on reticle being useable for ffp scopes in western hunting terrain at almost all powers. All scopes listed are also durable and retain zero

 

[nm.otter]

Some background here just in case. The overwhelming majority of current offerings don't function reliably under realistic field conditions.

 

[RockAndSage]

@Tony R-MkMachining , if you dig into the link @nm.otter posted, you'll see a lot of stuff related to reliability, as he mentioned. This has profoundly influenced a lot of the community here.

There's a segment of us who have been burned by wandering zeros or hard-breaks internally from a relatively minor drop (gun sliding down a closet wall, for example, or riding along dirt roads even), who have tended to become pretty ruthless in seeking out reliable, durable, usable optics. The tests in that link are perfectly reasonable, and realistically sufficient in protocol and repeated results to be "scientific enough", especially when you see the consistent patterns of which companies have few or no problems, and which ones end up being expensive trash.

And most of that expensive trash is what the vast majority of the hunting world would see as high-quality hunting optics.

That fact alone will make any list coming from Rokslide pretty problematic for your audience. Unless they come here and spend a few hours digging into the drop tests across a couple dozen scopes, and see the repeated results of all those "best" scopes just getting crap results, they just won't get it.

Even then, you get some severe cognitive dissonance - people seeing the repeated results, while being absolutely unwilling and unable to reconcile it all with what they "know".

Your safe route would be to focus on optical quality and lightweight - but that also wouldn't be the truth of what makes a good hunting scope. In reality.

 

[Macintosh]

I also can not come up with a more tailored use case "western spot stalk" or "white tail inside of 200",

If you cant make even this level of differentiation, then you’re wasting your time.

 

[43.6N]

Tony, these are guys who are permanently bonding their actions to their stocks. They take system failures VERY seriously.

Best I’ve used: NF Atacr 4-16. The durability, capped windage, and locking elevation are why I chose it. Weight is the trade off. Optically is more than enough, maybe even great. MIL-R reticle is good at higher mag. Gets thin at lower mag.

Second best is the SWFA 3-9x42.
Much lighter. Very durable. Gives enough optical quality that I’m not limited by the glass. Excellent reticle though. Probably one of the best all conditions reticle I’ve ever used. Taking non illuminated shots on living creatures at the limits of legal light is doable simply because of the reticle design. Trade off is non capped windage/non locking elevation. No zero stop without aftermarket. They also go out of stock frequently enough to be an issue.

Honerable mentions (from my own experience): NX8 (both varieties), Maven RS1.2.
I’m actively in the market for a fixed power 6x42 gen 2 Swfa.

Scopes I would not use again:
Leupold VX6hd
Leupold MK4hd
Leupold MK5hd

 

[43.6N]

Curious on your "best" statement. Do you think it just doesn't exist, or there are too many very high performers to nail one or a couple down?

I agree with @alexnelon response.

There currently isn’t a “best” on the market from a true hunting perspective.

The “hunting” brands are entrenched in their ideas of what hunters want. They won’t listen to critique and won’t innovate their product in any meaningful way.

So we are left to pigeonhole ffp tactical scopes into a hunting role. That leaves us with odd features we would rather not have.

 

[eLightfoot]

The Bushnell LRHS was really close. They are pretty much the only ones who even tried to make what we want.

 

[BBob]

They are pretty much the only ones who even tried to make what we want.

That's only because they were hunters that ponied up the $$$ and told Bushnell to spec what they wanted within what Bushnell could spec within available options at the time. I say hunters because it was George Gardner and Pat Sinclair wanting a better hunting scope than what was out there at the time or at least more of what they wanted in a hunting scope. If I recall correctly Gardner/GA Precision make it a group buy on the first run to get the $$$ to even do it in the first place. That was 2013? 2014?

 

[BLJ]

I have been tasked at work to come up with a "Good, Better, Best" list of optics that revolve around the Hunting genre.

What’s the purpose of the list?

 

[eLightfoot]

That's only because they were hunters that ponied up the $$$ and told Bushnell to spec what they wanted within what Bushnell could spec within available options at the time. I say hunters because it was George Gardner and Pat Sinclair wanting a better hunting scope than what was out there at the time or at least more of what they wanted in a hunting scope. If I recall correctly Gardner/GA Precision make it a group buy on the first run to get the $$$ to even do it in the first place. That was 2013? 2014?

Exactly, at least bushnell took it on

 

[BBob]

Curious on your "best" statement. Do you think it just doesn't exist, or there are too many very high performers to nail one or a couple down?

Don't confuse what a scope costs as far as what a good, better or best scope is as far as a solid hunting scope goes or at least not around here on Rokslide. If you value high reliability the most I'd bet few to none of your "best" i.e., $3500-5500 would make the "best" grade here with high reliability high on the list.

 

[pods8 (Rugged Stitching)]

That's only because they were hunters that ponied up the $$$ and told Bushnell to spec what they wanted within what Bushnell could spec within available options at the time. I say hunters because it was George Gardner and Pat Sinclair wanting a better hunting scope than what was out there at the time or at least more of what they wanted in a hunting scope. If I recall correctly Gardner/GA Precision make it a group buy on the first run to get the $$$ to even do it in the first place. That was 2013? 2014?

So GAP did that and then bushy rolled out the LRTS afterwards but subsequently discontinued it?

GAP still has gotten orders of the LRHS2 (not offered in 3-12 though).

 

[gpo1956]

Some of these responses are comical to me.

 

[Kurts86]

Good - SWFA 3-9, 3-15, NF SHV f1

Better - NF NX8, Maven RS1.2, Trijicon Tenmile 3-18, ATACR 4-16

Best - I don't think there is a scope that fits into this category for hunting.

This with the addition of the Nightforce NXS 2.5-10x42 and the SHV 3-10x42 specifically for eastern guys who don’t dial at all.