Masculinity and Caliber Choice

[HighUintas]

Since I've already done and replied to this thread I'll add my 2 cents.

I've got a 30-06 barrel, a 6.5cm barrel, a 308 barrel, and a 30-284ai barrel. Only 2 actions though.

Currently I've got the 6.5cm installed on one. I chose it primarily because it has accurate affordable factory ammo available, the ability to shoot SRP brass, more affordable bullets, and less powder consumption. It will be my backup gun this year. Possibly the main gun, tbd.

My other main gun is my 30-284ai and will likely be the main gun I hunt with, for no reason other than I designed the reamer and I like it. I do wish that it recoiled less, like the 6.5cm. spotting shots is nice.

I started with the 30-06 because I was misinformed that bigger is better and wanted better range than the 308.

I've never felt manly about any of them, however I have been proud at times of the ability to shoot decently with a medium caliber rifle due to growing up hunting with a 12ga slug gun. Do I shoot better with the lower recoiling cartridge 6.5cm? It appears so!!

 

[ddowning]

You need a magnum to kill elk reliably, but you believe you can reliably and consistently hit a moving elk at 400 yards?

Hit it, or kill it? Elk are big. Vitals not so much.

 

[BLJ]

I’ve never seen a pelvis target, but the most helpful practice seems to be spent visualizing what’s going on around the pelvis. The point we’re aiming for is as far forward as the visible bumps of the hips. We call it aiming for the base of the tail, but it’s a little farther forward than that. Height down from the hairline is the most important - that’s where “base of the tail” is about right. If the spine is going directly away from you, the target is little more than a tennis ball. If the animal is going uphill slightly, or you’re a little above, there is more spine to hit if the bullet goes a little high.

When an animal is on the ground a hands-on anatomy lesson is the best teacher.

Pretty soon you’ll pick out anatomy drawings that aren’t quite right - it seem somewhat common for illustrators to assume the spine is straight as an arrow or bowed like a hunchback. Lol
View attachment 701244View attachment 701245View attachment 701247

So with a directly facing away shot I’m aiming for the tennis ball at the base of the tail? In your experience this is a mortally wounding shot?

 

[Jason Snyder]

Who is Marry Lou?

Retton?

 

[wyosam]

Hit it, or kill it? Elk are big. Vitals not so much.

Elk vitals are actually pretty big. I get the point you’re making, but it’s not shooting golf balls.


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[TaperPin]

So with a directly facing away shot I’m aiming for the tennis ball at the base of the tail? In your experience this is a mortally wounding shot?

It anchors the animal and may or may not need a finishing shot depending on the angle and what else is damaged - if it clips the spine and end up buried in the gut I wouldnt expect that to kill the animal outright. A different angle and it might affect enough things to put the lights out.

 

[Drenalin]

Thoughts on why some people seem to think their masculinity coincides with their caliber choice?

I can see how this question might be misconstrued as "What number should I say in my head to determine lead when shooting a moving animal?" or "What tricks have you picked up for ass shooting elk and deer?" Though I think both of those topics deserve their own thread.

 

[TaperPin]

Retton?

 

[yeti12]

It anchors the animal and may or may not need a finishing shot depending on the angle and what else is damaged - if it clips the spine and end up buried in the gut I would expect that to kill the animal outright. A different angle and it might affect enough things to put the lights out.

Nothing says sportsman like shooting something in the ass and hoping the bullet in the gut kills it slowly...

 

[fwafwow]

View attachment 701250

That’s a very famous picture in which she was replying to the question “how wide does a bullet need to be to kill a bull elk?” The problem is that some interpret her answer as the width of the circle created by her index finger and thumb, and others think it is the very tiny (0.224”) space between her thumb and index finger. Clearly it is the latter, with the appropriate projectile.

 

[fwafwow]

This elk is moving at the speed of smell - if it were an elk or antelope I’d hope most people could connect.

I was flummoxed with this. AI (ChatGPT) to the rescue:

“The speed at which smells travel can vary depending on factors like temperature, humidity, and the specific molecules involved. On average, though, the speed of smell is around 1 meter per second.”

I can attest to 1 m/s from an “incident” with Mrs fwafwow some years ago. She also ran at 2-3x the SofS to get to the bathroom from the bed to yak.

 

[atmat]

Elk are big. Vitals not so much.

What? Have you seen elk vitals?

 

[timberland156]

Caliber selection comes down to game size and shot distance. White tail at 300 yd can be handled by 308 or 6.5cm or similar. Longer distances may require a heavier bullet in the 7mm or 30 cal category. The best cartridge is the one you can shoot accurately.

 

[UpNorth89]

Anchoring an animal with a rear spine shot isn’t covered in the 223 post? Hmm…

So now you're trying to make shooting an animal in the ass sound acceptable by calling it a "rear spine shot"? Wowzers SMH

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[yeti12]

Caliber selection comes down to game size and shot distance. White tail at 300 yd can be handled by 308 or 6.5cm or similar. Longer distances may require a heavier bullet in the 7mm or 30 cal category. The best cartridge is the one you can shoot accurately.

So how does going .020"-.044" larger in diameter get me a significantly different wound channel? What about impact velocity? What about changes in those bullets themselves? What if a 147gr 6.5 bullet actually performs better on game than a 162gr 7mm or a 180gr 30 cal?

Have you taken a white tail beyond 300yds? Have you done it with a 6.5 creed or another 6.5 variant? Have you done it numerous times?

 

[HighUintas]

So how does going .020"-.044" larger in diameter get me a significantly different wound channel? What about impact velocity?

It's not the diameter that matters but the difference in mass. For similarly constructed bullets, say 147eldm vs 208eldm, that's 61 extra grains of bullet to fragment and do damage.

I'm not advocating for one or the other, but clarifying the difference.

 

[yeti12]

It's not the diameter that matters but the difference in mass. For similarly constructed bullets, say 147eldm vs 208eldm, that's 61 extra grains of bullet to fragment and do damage.

I'm not advocating for one or the other, but clarifying the difference.

I know the difference, but if that 208 impacts a bit slower it was all for nothing. Or if you didn't manage recoil well and the shot doesn't land in a good spot, it was all for nothing.

I wanted his response to those questions. Cause everyone seems to say go bigger with no reasoning or experience behind it other than "its bigger, bigger better".

I don't understand the point to go to a much higher recoil cartridge for the same impact velocity or possibly less. It makes no sense. Sometimes even with worse ballistics because the internet told them they need a bigger bullet without people shooting the animals with small bullets. If I was a deer I'd be most worried about a guy with a 22 creedmoor.

 

[Thegman]

What? Have you seen elk vitals?

Well, from the rear they're apparently the size of a tennis ball, which you're supposed to hit as the tennis-ball -size target bounces over the ridge, if it's got really big antlers that is. I'm going to start using my dog's tennis ball chucker to hone my ass-shooting skills. You can learn so much useful stuff here...

 

[yeti12]

Well, fom the rear they're apparently the size of a tennis ball, which you're supposed to hit as the tennis-ball -size target bounces over the ridge, if it's got really big antlers that is. I'm going to start using my dog's tennis ball chucker to hone my ass-shooting skills. You can learn so much useful stuff here...

I present to you the anal buster

 

[Thegman]

I present to you the anal busterView attachment 701325

Now I need to bleach my eyes...I can just imagine a guy's face if he has to grab the "grip". On second thought maybe I'll just stick with heart/lung shots...I don't need a trophy elk that bad.