load testing bergers

[Retterath]

how do u guys go about load testing your berger? i am shooting a 7wsm 168 bergers with H1000. Do u guys do a ladder test then try at different yardages, or do u load up half grain incriments and then go out and shoot? What yardage are u load testing when starting off with your load data?

 

[Sam Millard]

I load tested for that exact combo. I load a few charges in 1/2 grain increments and shoot first for accuracy. If the accuracy looks good, I shoot the load over a chrono. If the ES and velocity are acceptable, I shoot to distance to see how it holds up.

I start at 100 yards, in three round batches; no ladder tests. If it won't shoot three into .5 MOA at 100 yards, it certainly won't shoot five into .5 MOA at 300 yards.

With H1000 and that case capacity, a charge difference of less than 1/2 grain won't show you much. Primers will make a difference in velocity, ES, and accuracy.

 

[IAHNTR]

Sam- When in the process do you test seating depth?

I have found that just changing that up can take a 2moa down to a .5moa.

 

[Retterath]

thanks sam, i did some shooting yesterday and need to go out again and then head to the 1000 yard range and give it a try. I hate load testing and my patience isnt very good when it comes to load testing. i will let u guys know how it goes. thanks alot

 

[Sam Millard]

With Bergers, I start at .010 off, then look in .010 increments further out. With the four barrels I've tried them in, they either shot very well at .010 off, or needed another .020 (.030 off) to shoot well. The exception is my 260, which doesn't care where they are. It's currently shooting Hybrids .220 off.

I've never had much luck with AMAX further than .010 off. They shoot extremely well there, though.

SMKs have been the easiest for me to find a good load for right away. .010 has been the most consistent for me across all calibers.

Be careful about getting wrapped around the axle with precise seating depths in small increments. Normal throat erosion will keep you chasing that depth, making you load test more than wind practice

 

[Retterath]

hey sam usually if your loads with bergers shoot good at 100 do they usually shoot good at longer ranges? if they dont do u go back to 100 and try something different?

 

[Sam Millard]

hey sam usually if your loads with bergers shoot good at 100 do they usually shoot good at longer ranges? if they dont do u go back to 100 and try something different?

Yes. Bergers, AMAX, and SMKs have all shot well at distance. I've never had to change anything to go long if they shot well at 100. The only time I've had trouble is when I tried shooting some 168 VLDs with high ES. Predictably, there was vertical dispersion @ 1000 yards.

Now keep in mind, I'm no bench rest shooter. I don't care about group sizes at distance beyond fun and entertainment. I am in it for first round hits on targets the same size or smaller than the kill zones on animals. I despise spending time on tweaking loads that don't need it to get where I want to be. I'd rather be field shooting in realistic conditions, than tying myself to a reloading bench.

In my experience, if the barrel will shoot 3-5 shots, with a high BC bullet, into .5 MOA and with ES < 20 fps, it will do well @ 1000 yards. For ELR shooting (think 338Edge), I like .25 MOA and single digit ES.

 

[Retterath]

great info sam, thanks for all your input. i also do not like shooting for groups, im with u on the first round hits on a kill zone on an animal. thanks again.

 

[squeekieslayer]

I just went through this with my 7mm and the same bullet. I ended up starting out shooting groups at .5 gr increments... did it twice. Picked the best group which was surprisingly easy. I started at .010 jump for all of them. I then loaded three with .010 increments shorter. I found two jumps that held around .5 moa. One was .005 from the lands the other much further, but I can't remember off the top of my head. I shot them over the magnetto speed and got 11 ES with WLRM primers. I have been shooting these well out to 750. Haven't gotten a chance to stretch them out much further... My edge is done this week, so that may be as far as that gun gets played with for a long time haha

This is in a stock browning a bolt with a questionable barrel and only new trigger springs as far as mods go. I tried the ladder method one time... it did NOT go well. I couldnt find a "node" or any real consistency.

Joe

 

[IAHNTR]

I have tried the shoot different charges at 100 thing and came away from it with a lot of used components and not much learned. Many of the charge weights shot the same, so how does one pick? This was before I had my Magnetospeed so I guess if I did it now I'd shoot with it on and pick the best group with the lowest ES. But then, can't the chrono mess with the groups? I have found a big difference though when taking similar shooting loads at 100 and stretched to 800+.

 

[mtnclimber]

I use the 168 Bergers and h1000 in my 7 rem mag.

I do my load testing at 220 yards, load in .5 grain increments and see what happens with the groups.

67, 67.5, 68, 68.5 (grain loads) were able to be covered with a dime at 220. So I loaded them up at 68 grains and called it good. Been lights out to 800 yards.

 

[Sam Millard]

You have to accurately know what your load's velocity is. I've seen more time wasted because a shooter didn't know their velocity, than for any other reason. Use an Oehler or a Magnetospeed. Both of them have been proven to be accurate and reliable.

If you have a load that is .5 MOA or better, an ES of < 20 fps, firing a high BC bullet through a tube that will stabilize it, it will shoot well at distance.

68.0 H1000 is the same load I use in my 7WSM.

 

[Sam Millard]

I have tried the shoot different charges at 100 thing and came away from it with a lot of used components and not much learned. Many of the charge weights shot the same, so how does one pick? This was before I had my Magnetospeed so I guess if I did it now I'd shoot with it on and pick the best group with the lowest ES. But then, can't the chrono mess with the groups? I have found a big difference though when taking similar shooting loads at 100 and stretched to 800+.

The Magnetospeed will cause a POI shift on some barrels, but the times I've tested known good loads, it showed very little group dispersion. On my 7WSM, it causes a POI shift 3 MOA high. It's consistent enough to shoot long range, and get first round hits, with it on. That barrel is a #4 Hart.

 

[squeekieslayer]

I use the 168 Bergers and h1000 in my 7 rem mag.

I do my load testing at 220 yards, load in .5 grain increments and see what happens with the groups.

67, 67.5, 68, 68.5 (grain loads) were able to be covered with a dime at 220. So I loaded them up at 68 grains and called it good. Been lights out to 800 yards.

That's holding .19 MOA for 67-68.5 grains. That's a freaking awesome shooter and gun. I wish I could shoot groups like that with my 7mm

JOe

 

[Retterath]

You have to accurately know what your load's velocity is. I've seen more time wasted because a shooter didn't know their velocity, than for any other reason. Use an Oehler or a Magnetospeed. Both of them have been proven to be accurate and reliable.

If you have a load that is .5 MOA or better, an ES of < 20 fps, firing a high BC bullet through a tube that will stabilize it, it will shoot well at distance.

68.0 H1000 is the same load I use in my 7WSM.

what are u getting with velocity with that? i shot some through the chrono and was loaded at 71.8 gr h1000 and was getting 3055fps.

 

[squeekieslayer]

Not to sidetrack... but have you guys tried retumbo vs h1000 and seen a big difference in accuracy? I have been using retumbo but have a ton of h1000 that I could use instead.

thanks

JOe

 

[mtnclimber]

My average ES was 9fps so I called it good. I'm not nearly as picky or strict as some serious reloader's/LR shooters.

I have 8lbs of retumbo that I've never broken Into. From all the research Ive done you gain a little velocity most of the time but the ES is significantly higher. Have never tried it myself and Im ok with my H1000 load so I'll stick with it.

I'll probably just sell the retumbo.

 

[Sam Millard]

what are u getting with velocity with that? i shot some through the chrono and was loaded at 71.8 gr h1000 and was getting 3055fps.

2950

 

[goatboy]

All I've ever shot is retumbo with this combo, accuracy is 1/2 moa, velocity is 2920 from factory tikka and es is 6 fps. Had a chance at H1000 but I'm in Canada and Berger's are scarce as hens teeth and switching powders seems like a waste of bullets at this point.

 

[Retterath]

2950

i didn't think u could get that much velocity out of 68grains, You are probally running a 26" barrel?