Lightweight Howa Mini Builds - .223 Rem & 6.5 Grendel

[4090Sharps]

I recently decided to buy or build myself a lightweight .223 after moving to AZ and realizing that any game I could hunt with any regularity in the state could be handled just fine with a .223. After soaking in all @PNWGATOR's thread ".223 for bear, deer, elk and moose" had to offer, and comparing it with my own .223 experience on deer (bang, flop), I decided a .223 was all I really needed.

The .223
Kimber Montana's in .223 being impossible to find, my plan was to purchase a Howa Carbon Stalker in .223, chop the barrel to 16", and set it up with a Griffin Armament Optimus Micro Suppressor. With an advertised weight of 4lb 10oz, it would make a handy rifle to carry on every outing in a state where any hike can become a mountain lion hunt from Aug-May with a little luck.

I ordered my first Howa Carbon Stalker, but it never shipped--before shipping the dealer realized the stock had sustained damage and would have to be returned to Howa for repairs with an estimated 60-120 day wait. So, I ordered another (HCBN223KA), and it arrived without issue until I got home and inspected it outside of the plastic seal Howa ships their rifles in. I weighed the gun, 5lb 2oz, half a pound more than I was expecting.

Bummer.

The inletting was off, and the barrel was pressed hard against the side of barrel channel. Not what I expected out of a ~$1000 rifle.



Damn.

I called Howa, and after insinuating I was at fault for not performing a closer inspection before transfer (does that mean they want the customer to QC, or that they want some schmuck who doesn't know better to buy?), they told me this was a common issue and could be remedied by putting pressure on the barrel and stock while retightening the action screws. It didn't work, and I had already tried the same on my own. I sent in a series of pictures detailing the barrel channel and a couple other stock and finish flaws, and they agreed to send me a shipping label to return the rifle for warranty repairs with a 60-120 day turnaround time.

Shame. I really liked the little action. The plastic magazine setup was pretty junky and awkward, the stock quality was lacking, and it was well over advertised weight... but I still liked it. Were it not for the rubberized finish and price tag, I would have sanded the barrel channel out and moved on with my life.

For years I'd been kicking around the thought of building a 6.5 Grendel, and knowing that I wouldn't have my .223 back any time soon to hunt with, I decided to pick up a Grendel. I thought I'd build a lightweight AR, but after handling the Howa Mini action, realizing that Stocky's sold factory second carbon fiber stocks at a discount, and finding Oregunsmithing's Howa bottom metal, I decided to have another go with Howa--this time knowing I was walking into a project...

When the .223 finally returns, it will be outfitted with a Trijicon Accupoint 3-9x40 scope with green triangle post. I might go wild later and add a Carbon Six CF barrel.

The 6.5 Build
The best price I could find for a Howa in 6.5 Grendel ended up being a Howa Mini with a heavy 20" threaded barrel in an Excl Lite chassis (HMXL65GB). Unless you have long arms or plan on replacing the stock with a shorter tube, I wouldn't recommend that chassis--the length of pull is pretty long. If you actually do want one, lemme know, as I'll be selling this chassis.

The Grendel arrived today, and after opening up the barrel channel in the factory second Stocky's carbon fiber stock, I collected some weights people might find useful. There isn't a lot of good info on weights for Howa's rifles and components, so I included them in the next section.

For now, I think I'll set this rifle up with some Talley scope mounts and a 3.5-10x50 Vortex Diamondback scope (~16 oz) I have hanging out on the workbench. I've already ditched the Howa magazine for the Oregunsmithing bottom metal.

Component Weights

• Howa Mini Action with 20" Heavy Threaded Barrel in 6.5 Grendel (no bottom metal) - 4 lb 1.9 oz
• Howa Mini Excl Lite Folding Chassis - 2 lb 3.4 oz
• Stocky's Carbon Fiber Stock - 1 lb .9 oz
• Stock's with Limb Saver pad and sling studs removed - 14.5 oz
• Howa Plastic Trigger Guard + Magazine - 3.3 oz
• Oregunsmithing Bottom Metal Assembly - 3.5 oz

The 6.5 Grendel with a 20" heavy barrel, Oregunsmithing bottom metal, and Stocky's CF stock weighed in at 5 lb 4.4 oz. Having the barrel fluted would drop some weight, but I'm pretty happy with it for now. Once I get the scope mounted I'll upload a picture and final weight. Not sure I can live with that shiny carbon fiber, so it may get sprayed down with Krylon soon.

 

[EastCoaster]

I actually just put together a Howa mini 223. Pretty handy rifle so far! I have only shot factory fiocchi 77s and it shoots around 1.25 MOA. Hoping I can tighten it up with some 8208 and 77 TMKs. Should find out this weekend.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

I have a standard 22” barrelled action in 6.5g in my safe that’s been cut down to 18.5” and has had the action slabbed and the bolt fluted and bolt handle knob hollowed and it’s 3 lb 5 oz with the action screws. So ya you can still diet quite a bit of metal out of that for a sub 5 lb unscoped. The slabbing took 1.5 oz of action, the bolt work was another 1.5 oz.

Just doing some math as I may finish mine one day.

53 oz (barrelled action)
Stocky's cf stock 17 oz
Bottom metal 3.5 oz
Equals 73.5 oz (4 lb 9.5 oz)

Add 2.0 oz Talley 1” lows for 4 lb 11.5 oz and go scope shopping. I have a Leupold fx2 6x36 kicking around at 9.5 oz that would land the scoped rifle at 5 lb 5 oz. (a smidge over 5 1/4 lbs). I also have an fx2 4x33 that would be about half oz less so might hit 5 1/4 on nose. With a Trijicon accupoint 3-9x40 (13.5 oz) it would be 5 lb 9 oz or just a smidge over 5 1/2 lbs scoped but I’d go green mil-dot reticle to get over 600 yard capability.

Oal would be just under 36” on mine.

Guess one day I’ll finish this one. The stock is what I’ve been waiting for. I think Pendleton stock is 18 oz.

Oh and I’d do the trigger as well. All the stuff to make a Howa mini done right.

Nice little money pit you got there.

 

[JVS]

I just put the standard mini action with 22” barrel into a Boyd minimalist stock. I will have to get some pictures when I get home. It’s been a fun gun. 3/4 MOA with 120 gold dots and XBR hand loads

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Just don’t put it on the scale.

 

[Mike D Texas]

I have a 20” 6.5 Grendel heavy barrel. It shoots so good from the factory with Hornady Black 123ELDM I don’t want to mess with it.


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[SDHNTR]

I had the same issue with a Howa .308. Worst inletting I’ve ever seen. Stock was so sloppy and barrel way off center. Called Legacy and they gave me the same story. Said they’d send me a new stock but the wait would be 8-10 months. I tried to shoot it just to see. 5-6” groups. Just awful. Took it apart and you could see where the receiver was smashing into the wood at one corner of the recoil lug only.

Got out the dremel tool and hogged the begeezus out to the inletting. Slopped in gobs of Acraglass. While I was at it I hogged out the forend and dropped in a stainless rod. Bedded all the way out the forend. Then sanded it back to a nice centered free float. It became a solid 1/2” rifle.

 

[4090Sharps]

Nice little money pit you got there.

Definitely. So where did you get your action and bolt lightened up?.....

 

[jaredg]

490Sharps, I have the Howa Mini in 223, bought for same reasons you did. Take some sandpaper (I think I used 400grit) and lightly sand stock. Shiny will come off and it will look more like the Sako cf stocks (very subdued matte). I would post a pic, but gun is at office...

 

[4090Sharps]

490Sharps, I have the Howa Mini in 223, bought for same reasons you did. Take some sandpaper (I think I used 400grit) and lightly sand stock. Shiny will come off and it will look more like the Sako cf stocks (very subdued matte). I would post a pic, but gun is at office...

Thanks for the tip, I'll give that a try. I figure if I don't like how it comes out, I can count the sanding as surface prep.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

Definitely. So where did you get your action and bolt lightened up?.....

my smith, machinest by trade, lots of them around used to slabbing and fluting bolts etc. You’ll have to make some local inquiries

 

[1denogean]

Great read here I'm going to build one of these in a grendel soon

 

[Stinky Coyote]

For poops and giggles on my eventual completion the recoil energy using hornady black 123gr eld-m at assumed 2450 fps from 18.5" (I get 2386 from 16.1" ruger and 2500 from broken in 20" howa)) and just over 5 1/4 lb finished rifle with fixed 6x36 leupold would be 11.0 ft/lbs and if use the heavier Trijicon 3-9 then about 10.4 ft/lbs. Pretty tolerable and shootable recoil levels similar to a .243 win in an 8.5 lb all up rig.

My Howa 20" was tight and around 2475 fps at first but after break-in loosened up to about 2500 fps with Hornady Black fyi.

At 2500 fps launch (hornady black from 20") and my elevations 1800 fps lands around 500 yards.

Currently shooting hornady black from 8 1/4 lb ruger ranch in chassis with 6.5 ft/lbs recoil energy and we watch it all in the scope but the howa project when done will feel like a little .22 in your hands and kick you like a proper rifle would.

 

[4090Sharps]

I hadn't even considered the recoil aspect. Whenever the ATF speeds things up, I'll be shooting both suppressed which will reduce recoil (near nonexistent in .223 anyhow) through weight and the brake effect.

After thinking about it some more, and considering the Grendel is good to go while the .223 will almost certainly be out of pocket for a while longer, I'll just get a carbon fiber barrel for it too. Carbon Six Featherweight, 16" long in .223 Rem. Screw it.

 

[chutinlead]

I've looked at the 6ARC howa mini in the kryptek dipped CF stock, but this story of the issues gives me pause. Would make a sweet kids first deer rifle.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

I've looked at the 6ARC howa mini in the kryptek dipped CF stock, but this story of the issues gives me pause. Would make a sweet kids first deer rifle.

Howa's are money pits, the only good part is the barrel and the action. Yes the trigger gets some praise as a decent budget trigger but it's a 2 stage with blade feel like a gas station cap gun so all it does is break decent and light enough. The bottom plastic and magazine have to go, reliability not there, tip rounds down after shot, no confidence there once it happens meaning no go hunting platform unless changed out...ie; hinged bottom metal. There was a guy making CZ 5 round magazine bottom metal conversion that I would consider tracking down along side hinged floor plate kits that a couple guys provide to remedy, and the main stocks are junk also. But they are accurate af and people gobble that up happily ignoring that everything around the rifle is below budget garbage.

Yes you can do it right the second time with a fat wallet, because howa/legacy has no interest doing it right the first time. Case in point, they have stainless in other markets, even here, but not here where the mountain obsessed will dump coin into doing it right the second time, not a mini anyway and not with howa stamped on it (Weatherby vanguard only)? How do you make a miss that big in a market this big?

Anyway, I went down the rabbit hole a couple times and came away very sour with all things howa/legacy. When I finish my lightweight it will be for sale, it will be awesome and someone will get all the value and then some while my wallet will remember forever...but I'll be out. The only ones to look at here imo say Weatherby vanguard on them in stainless, then McMillan (Sako pattern) stock it and do a Timney or Triggertech and all set but you can't get a mini stainless so you're stuck to longer cartridges...that's the only way to do a howa here imo...Weatherby Vanguard stainless.

You have ALL the info you need now to proceed into the Howa world cautiously lol.

Yup you can build a quality 5 1/4 to 5 1/2 lb scoped mini in 6.5g or .223 and 6arc etc. but have a chubby wallet, time, and a decent smith. For project guys it can be a thing. I'd rather look at a 6 cm in a Kimber stainless project than another howa for that weight class of rifle as an ultralight sheeper.

 

[4090Sharps]

I'd rather look at a 6 cm in a Kimber stainless project than another howa for that weight class of rifle as an ultralight sheeper.

If it wasn't for the appeal of the .223 with a short bolt, plentiful brass, endless bullet options, low powder use, no recoil, and an ultralight suppressor, this is the EXACT path I would have gone.

 

[Stinky Coyote]

If it wasn't for the appeal of the .223 with a short bolt, plentiful brass, endless bullet options, low powder use, no recoil, and an ultralight suppressor, this is the EXACT path I would have gone.

I hear you completely, you have to be obsessed about the extra short action cartridges (AR length cartridges) to go down this path...which I am and which my wallet is very familiar with. So ALL the info is available here now. There isn't too many options to choose from out there to play with the AR length options in bolt action quality builds even though the cartridges are well deserving of higher end options...sadly it's budget rifles that seem to get the nod for smaller cartridges no matter how kick ass they are.

I'm 6.5g all the way, so I built up CZ 527 and a couple Howa's already (proof carbon barrels etc.).

Now I'm in a ruger ranch chassis at 8.25 lbs all up that me and boys shoot and love it but a little heavy for 8 year old girl or what have you, 12 is minimum legal age here and not like I'd let them shoot unsupported anyway so the weight is useful for all but carry as we watch everything in scope (we aren't allowed suppressors and our legal big game minimum is 6mm so no .223's). I'd go CZ before howa for traditional stock option, maybe even that savage 6arc I've heard about and really if a guy could find the old boat paddle stocked ruger m77 stainless in 7.62x39...rebarrel to Grendel or arc and be done with it. Sako has a brilliant 85 XS short action stainless that would be ideal to build grendel/arc/slow twist .223's around but good luck...took them how long to chamber a 6.5 cm? Anyway, I'll be one foot in the grave by the time Sako gets up to speed and it doesn't matter anymore as love the chassis versatility with rapid adjust lop to fit any situation or family member. So highly unlikely I'd take on another project unless I come across one of them old ruger stainless 7.62x39's but I won't be looking too hard. Maybe one day the manufacturers of higher end gear will take note. With the 6arc around they'd be smart to have traditional stock and AR mag fed chassis rigs for prc etc. in developments! Fingers crossed, I'm set for life though, took awhile, my wallet can finally relax.

 

[4090Sharps]

I'll just get a carbon fiber barrel for it too. Carbon Six Featherweight, 16" long in .223 Rem. Screw it.

CarbonSix gave me a rough estimate of 1.5 lb for this setup. If I add a Salmon River Solutions ARCA rail (strongly considering it) but have the action and bolt lightened up, that might get me sub-6lb scoped and suppressed.

 

[4090Sharps]

I swapped some scopes between rifles and stuck a Leupold VX-3HD 2.5-8x36 on the Grendel, added the original Limb Saver pad back on for now. Hopefully have time to shoot it this weekend.