Lead contamination in meat.

[Fatcamp]

I guess it could be an issue for people but I don’t think lead fragments in meat is all that big an issue for us. Food passes thru our gut fast and has limited time to Be absorbed and affect a human.

However, go back to a gut pile a day after you kill a deer and see what is eating it. In addition to buzzards, quite a few hawks and even eagles will be on it. Lead fragments don’t pass thru them, they get stuck in their gizzard and let lead be released slowly. I don’t like killing those birds.

Where we hunt the coyotes don't give those birds a chance.

 

[txhunter581]

For those that say: lots more birds die from wind turbines...

Come on guys. That’s like saying everyone else is doing something harmful, so that makes it ok for me to do it.

Lots of trash along the highway. That make it ok for me to toss some out?

I personally love to see birds of prey and don’t want to be personally responsible for killing one.

I try to shoot at the range with lead, but hunt with monolithic. However, a nosler partition has been known to slip in there occasionally. . Moderation in all things

 

[WRO]

Millions of pounds of lead are on the sides of our roads from wheel weights. I always wonder if they get injested by birds getting gravel for their craws..

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[Desk Jockey]

For those that say: lots more birds die from wind turbines...

Come on guys. That’s like saying everyone else is doing something harmful, so that makes it ok for me to do it.

Lots of trash along the highway. That make it ok for me to toss some out?

I personally love to see birds of prey and don’t want to be personally responsible for killing one.

neither do I but I can’t find alignment with you on this. Lead poisoning is way down the list on Man-caused raptor mortality but anti gun folks seize on the issue because it fits their cause.

 

[jfs82]

Barnes LRX for me, they shoot great so why take the added risk with no real downside. Sure it may be insignificant (it may not) but I'm glad to throw less lead into birds. If it were an inferior product I would have a harder time.

 

[Elkslayer67]

This issue was just talked about on the vortex podcast. Studies show a very slight increase in lead levels in hunters. Funny thing is it showed the same increase in hunters that didn’t eat their game. The hypothesis is the increase is from lead vapors from shooting. So it is not the shot you take at game but the shots you take at paper that cause the increase. It was a very interesting podcast.

 

[jfs82]

This issue was just talked about on the vortex podcast. Studies show a very slight increase in lead levels in hunters. Funny thing is it showed the same increase in hunters that didn’t eat their game. The hypothesis is the increase is from lead vapors from shooting. So it is not the shot you take at game but the shots you take at paper that cause the increase. It was a very interesting podcast.

This is indeed interesting, thanks for posting.

 

[Upstate SC]

Paper about bioavailability of lead in deer shot with lead ammo:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2669501/?report=reader

I think you will ingest some lead when eating big game shot with lead ammo. Like many have said, if I had small kids, I would not use lead.

I don’t know how much it will affect a full grown adult, but I figure if nonlead works well, why not use it.

 

[El Gavilan]

I am a scientist, wildlife biologist, retired, so is my wife and we recently switched it all copper Barnes bullets that I reload. What’s not to like? Very accurate, good for us in the game meat we eat and good for no secondary poisoning and no lead pollution in the environment. As a federal LE firearms instructor I used to get tested for lead annually and it was never very high, but we took precautions to keep it from being a problem. If you’ve ever seen an animal die of lead poisoning you would have a whole new appreciation for lead free ammo!


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[Rich M]

For those that say: lots more birds die from wind turbines...

Come on guys. That’s like saying everyone else is doing something harmful, so that makes it ok for me to do it.

Lots of trash along the highway. That make it ok for me to toss some out?

I personally love to see birds of prey and don’t want to be personally responsible for killing one.

I try to shoot at the range with lead, but hunt with monolithic. However, a nosler partition has been known to slip in there occasionally. . Moderation in all things

Desk Jockey hit the nail on the head.

We switched to steel shot for waterfowl back in the 80s. Still using it.

When my Sierra and nosler bullets are illegal I'll consider using something else. I think there'll be bigger fish to fry if it gets that far.

 

[txhunter581]

neither do I but I can’t find alignment with you on this. Lead poisoning is way down the list on Man-caused raptor mortality but anti gun folks seize on the issue because it fits their cause.

I don’t think we are that far apart on this issue.
Are antis using this issue: Yes
Do I think lead as a hunting bullet should be legal : Yes
Will I use lead bullets sometimes for hunting: absolutely. Especially with my muzzleloader!

But to say something is ok because someone else is doing something worse, doesn’t fly well with me. And I also think we should realize that we can make a positive difference with little effort or cost sometimes. So when it doesn’t affect me greatly, I will use lead free.

This 300 lb eastern Colorado buck was taken with a 270 with a 130 gr copper bullet. It did a great job!

 

[Huntindog45]

As a hunter and a scientist, who has read ALL the published literature out there on the topic, I see plenty of evidence against using lead if you don't need to. Both from a wildlife and cautious human health perspective.

same boat. the science is solid. There are so many reasons to switch and just not many reasons to not switch. someone else mentioned hammer bullets. they are a serious badass bullet. Plus the rest of the factory loads especially Barnes, coming out now are just so good. the amount of damage lead does to the random wildlife that stumbles onto a carcass is just flat out indisputable and there just does not seem to be a good enough reason to even risk the slightest chance of lead exposure to myself and my family or friends I offer game meat. I know there are some older guns with long twist rates that struggle to shoot copper bullets well...but those are few and far between.

 

[Huntindog45]

If you’ve ever seen an animal die of lead poisoning you would have a whole new appreciation for lead free ammo!


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You nailed it. as ethical hunters we try our best to make sure we have clean kills. lead poisoning is an ugly prolonged death, not pleasant to watch and so many eagles and other raptors die from lead poisoning, and you can usually find the lead shot or fragments in them via xray.

 

[Trackselk]

Good read, thanks! I have been using barnes for about 6 years in my .308, and now I'm switching to 6.5cm to get out to 500 yards (if everything is perfect). Its also because I'm dropping the rifles weight from about 6lb, to just over 5lb, as I don't want to shoot a 5lb .308; out of fear of developing a flinch. Anyhow, so now this thread has me wondering if there's a mono that is a solid bet at 500 yards on elk in the creedmoor, as I was going to run eldx. I'll probably end up reloading...
I guess barnes lrx is the obvious answer, off to search the forum for lrx elk kills, it never ends, thankfully!
Lastly, gotta say, "I know, i know, its takes a 300 win mag..." but I've taken 3 elk with a 30-30, and man did those pointy hornady rounds do a good job! 2 DRT, and the one amped up bull did a 100 yard death march practically crawling. Shot placement...
Please ignore this post, I've obviously spent too much time in the backcountry alone!

*correction. The 500 yards is for muleys in a wide open area. I don't need to shoot that far for elk, too easy to get closer.

 

[dieselchessy]

Good read, thanks! I have been using barnes for about 6 years in my .308, and now I'm switching to 6.5cm to get out to 500 yards (if everything is perfect). Its also because I'm dropping the rifles weight from about 6lb, to just over 5lb, as I don't want to shoot a 5lb .308; out of fear of developing a flinch. Anyhow, so now this thread has me wondering if there's a mono that is a solid bet at 500 yards on elk in the creedmoor, as I was going to run eldx. I'll probably end up reloading...
I guess barnes lrx is the obvious answer, off to search the forum for lrx elk kills, it never ends, thankfully!
Lastly, gotta say, "I know, i know, its takes a 300 win mag..." but I've taken 3 elk with a 30-30, and man did those pointy hornady rounds do a good job! 2 DRT, and the one amped up bull did a 100 yard death march practically crawling. Shot placement...
Please ignore this post, I've obviously spent too much time in the backcountry alone!

What is your 6lb 308, and what will your sub 6lb 6.5 creedmoor be?

A 308 will kill fine at 500 yards, a 6.5 creedmoor offers little to no difference inside 500.

 

[roadrunner]

Not an issue.

 

[Trackselk]

What is your 6lb 308, and what will your sub 6lb 6.5 creedmoor be?

A 308 will kill fine at 500 yards, a 6.5 creedmoor offers little to no difference inside 500.

Thanks for the insight. My .308 is. Kimber MA. And with the ultralight loopy 3x9 I'm not comfortable with that much hold over for 500 yards (24"+). A foot hold over is easy as I'm on the spine.
The 6.5 is a copy of the ultralight kimber hunter threads. Hunter+fluting+MPI stock+24campfire ti handle/carbon knob, etc. Looks like it will be about 5lbs 3oz with a bigger loopy scope (13.5oz) for the B&C reticle (for easier 400+ yard shots).

 

[FLATHEAD]

I view the lead bullet push the same way I did the Covid vaccine mandate.
No thanks,,,now go away and leave me alone.

 

[ODB]

As a hunter and a scientist, who has read ALL the published literature out there on the topic, I see plenty of evidence against using lead if you don't need to. Both from a wildlife and cautious human health perspective.

Curious. What conclusions has any of the research youve read come to regarding bonded core bullets versus simple non-bonded lead bullets.

For example a solid shank/bonded lead front bullet like a North Fork retains 95% of weight, an A-frame similar.

Seems the info i can find does not include bullet construction in considerations of risk. The images most often shown are of what has to be a non-bonded bullet because it’s fragmented all to hell.

 

[dieselchessy]

Thanks for the insight. My .308 is. Kimber MA. And with the ultralight loopy 3x9 I'm not comfortable with that much hold over for 500 yards (24"+). A foot hold over is easy as I'm on the spine.
The 6.5 is a copy of the ultralight kimber hunter threads. Hunter+fluting+MPI stock+24campfire ti handle/carbon knob, etc. Looks like it will be about 5lbs 3oz with a bigger loopy scope (13.5oz) for the B&C reticle (for easier 400+ yard shots).

Interesting. I read those threads and have added some of the aluminum and titanium parts to my Montana’s, but haven’t chopped anything or had any metal milled off.