Larger 30 Cal For Elk Rifle and Target Shooting. PH2 300 winmag?

citizenfour

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Jun 15, 2022
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15
Short time reader first time poster. Thanks for the abundance of information on this site. Wealth of information really appreciate the shared experience. Please consider the following is where I am coming from.

I've been considering a larger 30 caliber primarily for elk but would like to shoot it at the target range as well. I load for a 308 savage lightweight hunter barnes 168gr ttsx about 1 moa groups and have a 270 rem 783 that shoots .5 moa with 130 gr barnes tsx.

Never thought i would shoot past 400 yards. Visited some western states and thought I might not get shots less in some cases.

In terms of caliber Ive considered 300 wsm and 300 winmag. 300 prc is likely out for me. But maybe Im missing something there (never seen a box of 300 prc ammo and I ve been looking a while). I seem to only find 300 winmag in most places but not any of the either 2. Im behind enemy lines in the PRK (Peoples Republik of Kommiefornie) cannot send away for ammunition without going through an ffl.

I'd like less recoil vs more of course but I would like to be able to shoot farther than 400-500 (which is likely my upper limit with the 308) maybe 600 / 700 on elk. I wouldnt aim to shoot this far of course I just want to make sure that I could someday grow into this if I was on the end of a 5 day hunt and that is the only shot I get Id like to know I had the ballistics to take it if i have practiced. I shoot on a range out to past this now. I understand the questionable ethics of shooting this far and it would not be my first choice but Im also trying to come up with a reason to justify the expense ( yeah I kind of have to come up with a reason to get a new gun this expensive).

Concerns with the 300 wsm is the availability of brass and factory ammo and staying power. if I was going the 300 wsm route I would likely lean towards a tikka with and add an ag composite stock.

It's hard for me not go to the 300 winmag based on the ammo availability after what we have all just lived through. I also would like my son some day who gets these to be able to find commonly available ubiquitous ammo. Perhaps he may not like to reload like myself. I also would like a domestic firearm if possible which the tikka / sako route.

I nearly purchased a CA but was talked out of it by some friends with concerns over those with accuracy issues. Again I have no direct experience.

Considered the Weatherby Mark V Hunter in 300 wm wouldnt get a Weatherby specific caliber personally due to ammo ubiquity being a priority. The S20 also is appealing although i would imagine not as packable as the seekins due to weight.

I am currently considering my front runner to be the Seekins Precision PH2 in 300 winmag. Questions here are what is the freebore in this gun. I know the mag box goes to 3.9 plus but what is the freebore. Seekins says they chamber to saami specs but I cant for all my research find the saami freebore maybe I just dont know how to read these saami specs.

Are there other guns you would tell me you definitely should consider here.

In the bigger 30 what bullets should I be considering? I was thinking of shooting a barnes 190 or 200 ttsx/lrx or I hear alot about the 210 vld or 215 berger. If you have experience with this I would like to know which bullets you like and why. What shoots well for you in this gun likes. The reloading coal how far out you are loading them. What your maximum overall length is measured with the hornady lock n load / stony point/ other method? I get they are all different Im looking for a ballpark. Will it handle rounds loaded beyond saami max like 3.600 bergers? How long can it go since the mag length is 3.9 plus I assume for the 300 prc in the same rig not for a 300 wm chamber that is that long that would be like .650 of bullet jump wouldnt it?
What brass? What powders? If you want to share. 300 winmag brass in Lapua seems a plus vs 300 wsm for me as well.

TLDR version
Considerations/Questions
* past 500 maybe to 700 yards on Elk big 30 caliber
* Ammunition Availability, Cost and Ubiquity. I will likely reload. Maybe someday I cant get components.
* Component availability and preferences Bullets/ Brass/ Powder?
* Would like to shoot targets too out to 800m now maybe some day farther, I need to practice and wont be just hunting with this
* May hunt some day in an area where there are large bear
* Does 300 wm make sense here or have I missed something about 300 wsm? Should I really consider 300 prc
* Are there any 300 wm reloading gotchas or massive pains I should be aware or consider, never loaded a belted magnum
* Is there something besides the Seekins PH2 given these considerations I should really look at? Preferably domestic if we can keep the $ stateside but if foreign value is just so amazing wanting to know
* What bullets does this gun like. Maximum OAL for this gun

Thank you in advance for any and all feedback,
citizenfour
 

LightFoot

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Feb 21, 2016
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1,232
Location
Texas
Welcome to Rokslide.

I will answer all your questions like this...

Don't overthink it.

No matter what you decide, you are compromising on something. You will find times that a different choice would have been better.

FWIW when I was looking for a 300 recently, I chose a Tikka T3X Wideland 300 Win and it shoots very well with 150 Soft Points for deer, 190 BTHP for paper, and 200 ELD-X if it gets the nod for anything larger than deer.

Good luck.



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XLR

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The fact that you are up at 1 am posting this tells me you are ready to get yourself a rifle haha! As far as calibers go, it is sad that we have come to this but I would choose what you can find available for ammo/brass. A lot of guys get strung up on caliber selection but being a hand loader is going to give you plenty of options to make 300 PRC and 300 win mag pretty darn similar! The part that makes me favor 300 PRC is factory ammo options that are offered with heavy bullets. I prefer to run heavier bullets since they carry their energy out further but if you hand load you have the ability to load those for 300 WM.

Other then caliber though I think you are on the right track. Personally, I would stay away from the Tikka if I was doing a 300 Win Mag because I do not want to be limited by coal in the shorter actions. If you want to run the 300 WSM though, the tikka is probably going to shoot just as well as the Seekins for a little cheaper. I have also thrown a link below for the Bergara MG lite which is kind of the next step up in price but is a super smooth and accurate rifle (also has a badass chassis😉)! But in all seriousness get the components and then find a rifle! The rifles seem to be more readily available at this point in time!

One more consideration is don't be afraid to bump down to the 6.5s or 7s. If you want to practice a lot, they are a lot easier on barrels and shoulders! I have shot a few elk with my 6mm creed and they killed them just as fast as my 7mm rem mag!


 

Formidilosus

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Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
4,578
TLDR version
Considerations/Questions
* past 500 maybe to 700 yards on Elk big 30 caliber

How are you planning on shooting enough 30cal magnum to be competent past 500 yards? How often do you practice past 500 yards?


* Would like to shoot targets too out to 800m now maybe some day farther, I need to practice and wont be just hunting with this

30cal magnums suck for shooting.
 

wytx

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Joined
Feb 2, 2017
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Location
Wyoming
300wsm here. I reload and have all the components I need for the rest of my life, I think.
Love the caliber. Recoil is nice, shoots pretty flat and I have taken out o 452 yds with it
Everything from pronghorn to cow bison.
I load 65-168 gr bonded bullets.

Not sure how well components are available now .
The short action is also lighter weight, I shoot a Sako A7 tecomate with a Leupold 4.5-14 x 40mm with B&C reticle.
 
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citizenfour

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Joined
Jun 15, 2022
Messages
15
How are you planning on shooting enough 30cal magnum to be competent past 500 yards? How often do you practice past 500 yards?
I go as much as the reloading bench and gas tank will let me. Granted I need more practice. If I didnt need to go past 500 I would likely just stick with the savage lightweight in 308 168 gr. ttsx at 2710 fps Ive still got more than 1800 fps out to about 5.
30cal magnums suck for shooting.
Good point i plan on getting one that is either braked or has a brake installed to make this more reasonable. Perhaps hunt with the ear plugs or remove the brake to hunt.
 
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citizenfour

Junior Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2022
Messages
15
Welcome to Rokslide.

I will answer all your questions like this...

Don't overthink it.

No matter what you decide, you are compromising on something. You will find times that a different choice would have been better.

FWIW when I was looking for a 300 recently, I chose a Tikka T3X Wideland 300 Win and it shoots very well with 150 Soft Points for deer, 190 BTHP for paper, and 200 ELD-X if it gets the nod for anything larger than deer.

Good luck.



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I do get into analysis paralysis. Thanks for the suggestions. Caliber and rifle selection ends up being a long term commitment. At this price point ~2k for the gun I want to make sure Ive considered what I need to. I get what you are saying about compromise thats a really good point.
 

DakotaBPNW

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Dec 5, 2019
Messages
434
I go as much as the reloading bench and gas tank will let me. Granted I need more practice. If I didnt need to go past 500 I would likely just stick with the savage lightweight in 308 168 gr. ttsx at 2710 fps Ive still got more than 1800 fps out to about 5.

Good point i plan on getting one that is either braked or has a brake installed to make this more reasonable. Perhaps hunt with the ear plugs or remove the brake to hunt.
I wouldn’t be afraid of shooting a .30 cal. A good brake and a rifle with a decent amount of weight is no big deal to shoot. A 300 win mag pushing 210 Bergers around 2900fps is a great combo
 

hereinaz

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Don’t overthink it. There is a debate over everything. 6.5mm guys fight with 30 cal guys. You know what, both bullets will kill animals dead if you can shoot it accurate. You are the weakest part of the shooting system. A 6.5 creedmoor is capable with the right bullet out to 700.

Form makes a good point I tell people too. You gotta practice and shooting a 30 magnum is hard to master and has more recoil than you need.

I recommend getting a 6.5 or 7mm or even the new 6.8 western to hunt to 700.

Manufacturing has improved so lots of rifles are typically capable out of the box with factory ammo to 600 yards, if you get a good scope mounted correctly. If you can shoot it to 1 moa, then it’s good enough.

A basic Savage ultralight 280 AI killed two bull elk it’s first year for a buddy at 300 and 600 ish. It also had a good scope and I took the time to dial it in and help him and his son learn to shoot.
 
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citizenfour

Junior Member
Joined
Jun 15, 2022
Messages
15
The fact that you are up at 1 am posting this tells me you are ready to get yourself a rifle haha! As far as calibers go, it is sad that we have come to this but I would choose what you can find available for ammo/brass. A lot of guys get strung up on caliber selection but being a hand loader is going to give you plenty of options to make 300 PRC and 300 win mag pretty darn similar! The part that makes me favor 300 PRC is factory ammo options that are offered with heavy bullets. I prefer to run heavier bullets since they carry their energy out further but if you hand load you have the ability to load those for 300 WM.

Other then caliber though I think you are on the right track. Personally, I would stay away from the Tikka if I was doing a 300 Win Mag because I do not want to be limited by coal in the shorter actions. If you want to run the 300 WSM though, the tikka is probably going to shoot just as well as the Seekins for a little cheaper. I have also thrown a link below for the Bergara MG lite which is kind of the next step up in price but is a super smooth and accurate rifle (also has a badass chassis😉)! But in all seriousness get the components and then find a rifle! The rifles seem to be more readily available at this point in time!

One more consideration is don't be afraid to bump down to the 6.5s or 7s. If you want to practice a lot, they are a lot easier on barrels and shoulders! I have shot a few elk with my 6mm creed and they killed them just as fast as my 7mm rem mag!



Facts on the up late trying to make a decision.

Appreciate the feedback on being able to load the heavys for 300 winmag and that better factory 300 prc in the heavys is available.

I have read the same about the tikka 300 winmag shortbox and the twist rate being 1 in 11. I picked up the superlite with a scope at a gunshow I couldnt believe how light it was. Ive shot the 270 wsm in the same platform and it was lighter than my girlfriends in my 20s :)

The other smaller caliber under consideration would likely be the 6.5 prc. No 6.5 in the stable. I think this caliber has the staying power but I just dont see any factory ammo available and I cant send away for anything other than components being in CA.

My concern is also is 6.5 prc too small for Elk and not what I would want to take a big bear with if I had to. I know many do it. Im already into the 30 caliber in bullets in other rigs so thats why I was thinking the larger 30 caliber. Also if I go hunting in big bear country I would feel better with a big 30 than the 6.5 prc. I figure if the 300 winmag is braked and that reduces recoil by 40% that drops the recoil to 308 non braked range based on the data here https://backfire.tv/recoil/ 30 lbs X .6 = 18 lbs same as 308.

That mglite is nice with the carbon fiber barrel, folding stock magnesium chassis and lightweight. At $3200 though likely out of my range for one rig no optic. If it was manufactured domestic and a bit less my wallet might move. I like the waypoint as well but not available in the big 30. Thank you for the considerations.
 
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