Is Western hunting over promoted?

[Poeschel]

I think one reason the west is getting more out of staters is people in my generation (mid 30s) have chosen that instead of maintaining the “deer camp” traditions, They would rather spend their money making annual trips out west. It makes sense. No cabin and land to do maintenance on etc....Not me, I could care less about going out west and would rather hunt my own land in the east for big nasty white tails. That and I don’t have a flat brim hat, YouTube channel or size small mountain ops shirt

 

[bigdesert10]

Everybody paints things as though we're losing hunters. In reality, we're losing stand/private land hunters while western public land hunting is booming - equating to a net loss in participation when you pool it together. Media types and the like preach hunter recruitment - mostly directed at western hunting - even though it's already booming. I get that private land hunters further east are in a tough spot because hunting leases are astronomically expensive and access is much more exclusive than it used to be. I think it's great to see good media organizations like Meateater start to promote that style of hunting more, along with their usual offerings, as it hypes a style of hunting that has lost its luster for many in the era of the flat brim mountain warrior bullcrap.

 

[Poser]

I wonder if the counter movement to flat brims will be some kind of steampunk hunter movement: guys dressing like Teddy Roosevelt with a monocle, a cane and a wool suit to go hunting

 

[cmahoney]

I wonder if the counter movement to flat brims will be some kind of steampunk hunter movement: guys dressing like Teddy Roosevelt with a monocle, a cane and a wool suit to go hunting

Those guys already exist, modern huntsman.


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[RazzleDazzle]

All I can say is that as resident of "western states" we all better be careful for what we wish for as far as reduction of NRs. House rules begin to lose their effectiveness if we're the only ones left in the house. And that applies to much more than just the natural resources.

 

[Poser]

Those guys already exist, modern huntsman.


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Well damn, I haven’t seen one of these yet. What happens when a modern huntsman encounters a flat brim in the woods? Is there a duel?

 

[Dustin the wind]

I wonder if the counter movement to flat brims will be some kind of steampunk hunter movement: guys dressing like Teddy Roosevelt with a monocle, a cane and a wool suit to go hunting

Nope, the people who dress like that only hang out in Portland and Seattle, they will never hunt.

 

[Pacific_Fork]

Yes I think western hunting is getting over promoted. I am getting really disappointed lately of the bigger names on youtube/netflix giving out specifics, a newer youtube video gave the exact town they were hunting out of and number of points to draw the unit. Its very easy these days with services like GoHunt to figure out the unit from that information. I just want to know why they feel its necessary to give this information out. Why cant there just be good content online without even naming the state?

 

[Ursus1975]

Everybody paints things as though we're losing hunters. In reality, we're losing stand/private land hunters while western public land hunting is booming - equating to a net loss in participation when you pool it together. Media types and the like preach hunter recruitment - mostly directed at western hunting - even though it's already booming. I get that private land hunters further east are in a tough spot because hunting leases are astronomically expensive and access is much more exclusive than it used to be. I think it's great to see good media organizations like Meateater start to promote that style of hunting more, along with their usual offerings, as it hypes a style of hunting that has lost its luster for many in the era of the flat brim mountain warrior bullcrap.

good point this makes a lot of sense, I hadn't looked at it that way.

 

[mtwarden]

yeah it's probably overhyped

but there is the simple fact that (in Montana) NR license sales account for ~ 70% of the revenue that runs Fish, Wildlife & Parks.

Montana has a long history of bemoaning any license increase for residents, maybe that could change in the future???

as long as there is demand, I don't see Montana lowering NR license prices anytime soon

increasing the cost of resident licenses? for some reason I don't see that happening anytime soon either

 

[fatlander]

I don’t think it’s over promoted.

I don’t think we can possibly over promote hunting, period. The more people that find enjoyment out of hunting, the longer we will be afforded the opportunity. Things change, that’s a fact of life. If you don’t adapt to the change, you get left behind. If you like to hunt enough, you’ll figure out a way to hunt every year and enjoy yourself.

I introduce as many people as I possibly can to hunting. I don’t care if they end up being “competition”. I look at hunting much like running. I don’t compete with others. I compete with myself and my quarry. Stop making excuses for being lazy because your spot got blown up. There is opportunity. Go get after it. If you want it bad enough, you’ll figure it out.


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[cmahoney]

Well damn, I haven’t seen one of these yet. What happens when a modern huntsman encounters a flat brim in the woods? Is there a duel?

No, I think they trade stuff, like a growler of micro brew for some mountain ops.


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[bigdesert10]

I don’t think it’s over promoted.

I don’t think we can possibly over promote hunting, period. The more people that find enjoyment out of hunting, the longer we will be afforded the opportunity. Things change, that’s a fact of life. If you don’t adapt to the change, you get left behind. If you like to hunt enough, you’ll figure out a way to hunt every year and enjoy yourself.

I introduce as many people as I possibly can to hunting. I don’t care if they end up being “competition”. I look at hunting much like running. I don’t compete with others. I compete with myself and my quarry. Stop making excuses for being lazy because your spot got blown up. There is opportunity. Go get after it. If you want it bad enough, you’ll figure it out.


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I get what you're saying but when it comes to hunter recruitment, quality is more important than quantity. We are not now, nor will we ever be, a majority voice in politics. We hunt at the pleasure of the public and we need only to remain in their good graces to continue to hunt. It's more important to be good ambassadors of the sport to the non-hunting public than it is to convert them into being hunters themselves. In that regard, exposure to the sport is a positive thing in most cases, but let's not fool ourselves into thinking that we are going to be able to become a majority voice in America - nor should we think it necessary to our survival to become so.

 

[Poser]

No, I think they trade stuff, like a growler of micro brew for some mountain ops.


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The modern huntsman is intrigued by the notion that compression socks don’t require a garter to hold them up.

 

[fatlander]

I get what you're saying but when it comes to hunter recruitment, quality is more important than quantity. We are not now, nor will we ever be, a majority voice in politics. We hunt at the pleasure of the public and we need only to remain in their good graces to continue to hunt. It's more important to be good ambassadors of the sport to the non-hunting public than it is to convert them into being hunters themselves. In that regard, exposure to the sport is a positive thing in most cases, but let's not fool ourselves into thinking that we are going to be able to become a majority voice in America - nor should we think it necessary to our survival to become so.

Arguing amongst ourselves like a bunch of selfish pricks, instead of introducing people to the joys of hunting is how we’re not going to stay in the good graces of the public.

Some of the most impactful ambassadors of hunting today are adult onset hunters. It does nothing but hurt hunters to not get more people hunting. Quality is relative. Starting people out in an environment that is too target rich will ultimately lead them to lose interest, IME. If you kill something every time you went hunting, it wouldn’t be fun. If you go to the same place over and over and over and don’t kill anything, you need to make some changes. That’s no ones fault but your own. There’s plenty of opportunity out there. You’ve just got to want it bad enough to get it.

Do I think we should post unit numbers, drainages, etc online? Absolutely not.

But I also think we can all do a better job of not letting other people’s enjoyment or even discovery of the outdoors ruin our own experience. Being selfish will be our downfall.


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[SoloTexN]

Some of you sound like a joy to hunt with.
whiny voice "somebody's in my spot, they're gonna scare everything off.. waaa waa I don't want hurt public land anymore."

 

[GSPMich]

I haven’t hunted the west and don’t know if it is over promoted or not, but it seems like the craze right now is DIY type hunting in general, with a focus on going west. 15 years ago the craze was out of state whitetail hunting(at least where I live). I know some states with cheap otc whitetail tags and plenty of space saw a big increase in out of state hunters, magazines like F&S and OL pushed the DIY whitetail hunting in those areas. Guys in Michigan still go out of state looking for whitetail bucks but there is a lot more discussion of guys going after elk and mulies now than there was before.

On a personal note, I‘m really into northern Michigan upland hunting. Those magazines also promote DIY grouse and woodcock and with that I see a lot more out of state guys out in the upland woods.

 

[npm352]

For our sport to continue and for sportsmen to continue to have a voice, we need more hunters. We need more kids toting around .410s after squirrels. We need more adults who have never been afield decide they want to feed their family with healthy, organic meat and start deer hunting. We even need more mtn-ops fueled, flat-brimmed metro-sexuals assaulting the Utah mountains. We need more hunters everywhere, and we shouldn't be picky about where they go.

It gets old when hunters act like they want a voice but are hostile to new hunters because it negatively affects their ability to hunt somewhere without company. Or, they want all the laws and game management skewed against opportunity (that caters to all) and only for trophy management (that caters to limited and specific subgroup of sportsmen). Letting an 11-year-old shoot a doe mule deer is a disgrace to these hunters...they will shun biologists at F&G meetings for suggesting the practice of youth doe harvest continue...but they will preach, "we need more hunters." You want more hunters? Cater laws to allow specific youth opportunities so they can get some blood on their hands.

One of my biggest pet peeves is people who claim public land because they knew about the spot first, and that is all this argument is, except on a larger scale. People do not want anyone moving west period. Selfishly everyone wants to keep people back east home and out of their state. I don't smile when I see a Utah plate parked in a spot I hunt. I do not like seeing my chances of drawing sheep and goat tags seemingly get worse every year despite gaining points...but we need more hunters, we need current hunters hunting more and caring more. Anytime we get more hunters it is good for our sport.

 

[bigdesert10]

This is going to stir the pot, but it's my honest opinion. Sorry if anyone feels personally attacked.

We don't need more western elk and mule deer hunters for the sake of having more hunters or growing positive sentiment. It gains us nothing. These categories don't have a PR problem. They're not going anywhere.

What we need are more predator hunters and more small game hunters. That's were sentiment struggles. That's where participation would actually make a difference. No one is at risk of losing elk hunting or mule deer hunting, but how many states have restricted bear hunting or eliminated it altogether? Look how easy it was to eliminate science-backed hunts for Grizzlies in the GYE and wolf hunts in the Great Lakes region. How many states have booming mountain lion populations and no legal take options for hunters?

I'm not here to argue, but I get so sick of everyone parroting the "hunter recruitment" trope that they hear from people that have something to sell without having any idea as to how recruiting their neighbor's cousin for a week long DIY archery bull elk hunt is saving hunting. But at least they feel noble about their contribution. Maybe you're fighting the right battle, but you're on the wrong front.

And there is definitely a downside to growth in western hunting participation. Tag availability. Herd sustainability. Overall opportunity. The handful of western hunting states can't support an entire nation of hunters. There is a carrying capacity there. Don't recruit yourself out of a hobby.

 

[FLAK]

IMO definitely over priced, for NR's at least.