I’m not much into politics, but man this burns my a**

[Billinsd]

You really need to study more, do you know why both Apple and Google have any debt? Just think on it, I get your on a no debt plan but debt can be good, if your smart about it. Really think hard as to why they have debt and how it is good. And don’t just reply no debt is good.

I thought he was talking about Fed debt? Corporate debt is not bad by definition. It could be if it's excessive, and definitely if we are talking government bail outs. Carry on...

 

[tdhanses]

I thought he was talking about Fed debt? Corporate debt is not bad by definition. It could be if it's excessive, and definitely if we are talking government bail outs. Carry on...

He’s kind of all over the board, my take is he is anti debt period, gov, business and people shouldn’t have any. Pretty much banks shouldn’t exist and put your money in a mattress.

Yup excessive debt isn’t good and I don’t think Apple ever took a bailout

 

[*zap*]

The US government has the debt thing cornered.....

 

[Poser]

Snartwool was acquired by Vanity Fair this year and their offices are moving from Steamboat Springs to the VF hq in Denver which has caused a good bit of backlash in Steamboat. Obviously, this is a different situation as the town itself will continue to thrive off of tourism, but, as anybody who has ever lived in a mountain town knows, a real, full time job with benefits is a bit of a unicorn. Removing 116 full time jobs from a ski town will certainly have an impact.

Every so often, towns and cities are forced to reinvent themselves. This town will potentially be sitting on a 800,000 sq foot warehouse. Some of the other surrounding towns will potentially be sitting on large call centers. I’d say that makes things ripe for reinvention.

 

[T28w]

man this has some good back and forth. read the whole thing and wasn’t going to comment but thought I’d share my 2 cents on a few of the topics.

Healthcare- there is no way to have the best possible care and have it for free. It’s just not possible. It’s akin to the people pushing world peace and green everything, it sounds wonderful unfortunately it just not possible, but it sounds amazing. Does anyone have any idea how much it cost to bring a drug from r and d to fda approval and to the market? How many researched that don’t work out, and the time, money , energy, and technology wasted on something. When I was in school I believe it was in the hundreds of millions of dollars to go from concept to approval. Prob more now. Then if it is approved, the patent will expire in what 20 years from applying, so you have have a limited window to recoup that investment and make up for all the other failed endevours.
When u go to hospital it cost a lot to have to have anything and everything ready or on call if needed, whether its needed right now or not, it takes a lot of time and $$$ to educate and train doctors and as technology and new techniques are always evolving, it’s not going to get cheaper to train them.

Which leads to the gov taking over the student loans- schools have increased tuition more simply because they can. It’s guaranteed money for the school. They can raise tuition every year if they want and they will get paid. If the gov wasn’t backing these loans, there is no way the free market could support the cost associated with a lot of these degrees, undergraduate and post graduate.
People tell me dentist make a lot of money, and I tell them if they are a dentist, they better make a lot of money. Look at what it cost to become a dentist. There are very few places left u can get the 8 years of school and get out for less then 300k in debt. Most places are close to the 250k mark for just dental school. So take that 300k, the inability to have a sustainable job for the most part of those years, and then the cost of buying or building a practice....... you can be easily 1 mill behind someone like my brother who has no college degree and works at a paper mill and able to bring home 75k his first year (yes it’s shift work and he’s he works a fair amount of overtime but still easily doable for him). It’s getting to the point that the return on investment of a dental education is not worth it. Tuition keeps going up and our reimbursements from ins are going down, not up. This is creating a WHOLE set of problems that is too much for this post.
I’m pretty sure medical schools were seeing the same problem also a few years ago when the quality of applicants were starting to decrease and fewer quality applicants applying.

 

[*zap*]

It is all out of control and I believe it is all doomed to crash at some point.

 

[Trial153]

Beholden to no one but share holders as a business model has an inherent problem when most of the shares are going to less and holders everyday.
Anyone regardless of your ideological leanings that feels this model that has evolved is sustainable needs a reality check and some serious historical analysis.
When less than 1% of the population owns more than half of all the liquid stock, bond and mutual fund holding by all investors. Who really are the share holders?

Mark Cussion does a decent job laying out some realities without the typical partisan spinning.

What Is the Average Net Worth of the Top 1%?

An American household would have to be worth a minimum of $13.7 million to get into the 1% club. They would need a household income of $591,550. Income disparity is increasing.

www.investopedia.com

 

[tdhanses]

It is all out of control and I believe it is all doomed to crash at some point.

If any of the current Dems somehow are elected I’ll be selling all my stock ASAP.

 

[Billinsd]

When less than 1% of the population owns more than half of all the liquid stock, bond and mutual fund holding by all investors. Who really are the share holders?

According to you half are the top wealthiest 1%, the rest, I don't know? This seems to really bother many, but why? In fact some politicians base their entire platform against the 1 percenters. I call it class warfare. I personally know and have met several people that are in top 1%. They've all been extremely obsessively hard working and successful. Should people be concerned about 1percenters getting wealthier and more powerful? I'm not. I'm aware of it, sure. I'm not envious, because I don't want do what it would take to get there. No, guarantee either. However, I'm focused on my own situation, my family and me. Skyrocketing educational costs for the kids, a Leviathan Federal government with debt that's threatening my kids and grandkids future, out of control regulations, and evaporating freedom and liberty. Yes, that's my fear.

 

[Billinsd]

If any of the current Dems somehow are elected I’ll be selling all my stock ASAP.

I will already have sold my stock, BEFORE Bernie or Pocahontas get elected. I'll be watching and prepping to sell if either one of those crazies gets the nomination. Very, very scary that there's the slightest chance of them getting elected. Bill

 

[tdhanses]

I will already have sold my stock, BEFORE Bernie or Pocahontas get elected. I'll be watching and prepping to sell if either one of those crazies gets the nomination. Very, very scary that there's the slightest chance of them getting elected. Bill

Yeah, the middle class will suffer the most when the market crashes. And they will crash it.

 

[5MilesBack]

When less than 1% of the population owns more than half of all the liquid stock, bond and mutual fund holding by all investors. Who really are the share holders?

So less than 1% of the population have IRA's, 401k's, pension plans, mutual funds, and/or individual stock accounts?????? I seriously doubt that. In fact I know that this isn't true. Institutional investors (IRA's, 401k's, pension plans, mutual funds, etc) own the very high majority of the corporate stock and bonds in America. Every one of those regular American workers with these plans are shareholders. But it's easier to just scowl and complain about the 1%'ers. Those same 1%'ers also pay over 60% of the tax bill in America every year too. Think about that for a moment........1% are paying 60% of our nation's tax bill! Might as well complain about that too.........."why are they paying the majority of the tax bill......I want some of that". LOL.

The best part of all this.........just about every one of us on this board are part of the 1%..........from a world wide perspective. All it takes is an annual income of $32,400 to be in that 1%. Let's keep hating on the 1%'ers. That should put it into perspective.

 

[wind gypsy]

Was an interesting conversation for a while. Funny how people look at markets like they have to be absolutely free or everything is government run. There is a middle ground. Sounds like Cabelas was doing just fine financially without Singer owning a portion and forcing a buyout. I agree nobody is owed anything in this world. That said, do we really feel that the good of Singer's hedge fund growth exceeds that of rural middle class economy in Sidney? Not advocating legislation preventing it but it doesn't mean we cant look at Singer negatively.

Edit: From my selfish corner, politics and town of Sidney aside, to hell with that asshole because Cabelas has gone downhill since!

 

[ODB]

so you want the govt to run health care. My dad got let go after 28 years and working his way from factory floor to head of sales he didn’t have a college degree. He didn’t whine got a new job and is happier than ever.

You need to be careful about putting words in people’s mouths. You may believe there is a only a binary choice (the way it is/ govt run), but of course that is a reductive position. There are better ways of doing things in healthcare and they aren’t being done. Spend enough time in and around healthcare as I have and you’ll get the point.
As far as your dad goes, him making to head of sales is better than a college degree. But not everyone has that ability. And I’m sure when he was tossed you all didn’t go o it for drinks to celebrate.

 

[TJ]

I have nothing to add, my stress level will not let me, however,,,,, this

 

[Beendare]

Well its true.... the rich keep getting richer.
There are many reasons for That^... but for sure its not because they sit and complain,
“Wheres my free health care...(or other freebie)

The challenge is how to equalize that^ without destroying the incentive to invest, as thats what has made our country great.

a couple ideas: 1) close loopholes: eliminate the 1031 exchange rule( and it pains me to say that!)

2) Treat income differently: currently a guy making a million a year from his business with 40 employees is taxed the same as a guy with no employees making a million through arbitrage in the financial markets- thats not right.

one thing is for sure: the whole, ”big business is bad” mantra from the current Dem politicians and their targeting of “The Rich” is akin to what the Germans did to the Jews in the 1930’s-1940’s.

Targeting one class of people- especially high achievers is a really bad idea. In France, they just hammered “millionaires” and they didnt factor in these folks have resources to just move and pay their taxes elsewhere leaving France holding their skinny in their hands.

...

 

[KurtR]

You need to be careful about putting words in people’s mouths. You may believe there is a only a binary choice (the way it is/ govt run), but of course that is a reductive position. There are better ways of doing things in healthcare and they aren’t being done. Spend enough time in and around healthcare as I have and you’ll get the point.
As far as your dad goes, him making to head of sales is better than a college degree. But not everyone has that ability. And I’m sure when he was tossed you all didn’t go o it for drinks to celebrate.

well we had a couple bud lights and went hunting the next morning. He told me he was looking for a job when he found that one and would find another which he did too days later in a completely different field but they new he would work his ass off so they hired and trained him. Every one has the opportunity to work hard and hard work will be rewarded over the long run. Never said the health care could not be better but it wouldn’t be better with govt involvement.

 

[Beendare]

Mark Cussion does a decent job laying out some realities without the typical partisan spinning.

What Is the Average Net Worth of the Top 1%?

An American household would have to be worth a minimum of $13.7 million to get into the 1% club. They would need a household income of $591,550. Income disparity is increasing.

www.investopedia.com

Except he left out the fact that the bulk of total taxes paid by the top 1% and top 10% of wage earners as mentioned by 5 Miles..........................as it should be.
_________

BTW, to your rich get richer comment; Its interesting to look at the IRS tax role stats...

FACT; Asians are the highest wage earning class by race.
So why is that?

Asians as a race generally have;
1) a good work ethic
2) good family structure
3) an emphasis on education.

There is a lesson here;

The rich get richer sure....but the smart hard working educated folks do too!

...

 

[Trial153]

QUOTE="Beendare, post: 1431428, member: 7335"]

BTW, to your rich get richer comment

...[/B][/QUOTE]



Please quote me where I made any comment about the rich getting richer or any one getting richer for that matter.


This entire conversation is about the decision making process of corporations and who they have ultimately have a responsibility to.
There has been a vocal Contingent here implying that the profit of "share holders" supersedes any thought of responsibility to community or the corporations employees. The implication is that the money earned by share holder ultimately has great effect than same money going back into a community through jobs ect.

So I ask again who are the share holders? The fact is that a larger percent of all liquid assets on a global scale as well as in this county are owned by a smaller percentage of individuals then ever in history. I don't care where you fall on the political spectrum because it's being acknowledged on all fronts.

 

[5MilesBack]

So my question is again..

"When less than 1% of the population owns more than half of all the liquid stock, bond and mutual fund holding by all investors. Who really are the share holders? "

You should have asked your question with "IF" instead of "when", and then someone might have taken you up on that. But "when" you start your question with a false premise, there isn't a good or relevant answer for that.