I gots the Covid.

MattB

WKR
Joined
Sep 29, 2012
Messages
5,743
What's the data that specifically says the vaccine protects against severe disease? In other words, what's to say that case in a healthy individual would have been severe had they been unvax'd?

Peer reviewed proof or just media conjecture and a sales pitch from Dr. Fauci?
Aren’t you the “Google it for yourself” guy when other people ask you to support your claims? Guess that only works one way.

Here is one study of 780k people, I can find 20 others if you forgot how to use Google. But I suppose all these unvaccinated people are only getting COViD because they are otherwise unhealthy…

 

MattB

WKR
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Sep 29, 2012
Messages
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Their FOIA response said they "do not have that data".
I believe that, but that is very different than your claim that “According to a FOIA request, the CDC has published that ZERO people have been confirmed to have had covid twice. ZERO.” I can only assume you don’t understand the difference between not having data and the CDC claiming the number is 0, which explains your confusion.
 

inyago

FNG
Joined
Sep 1, 2019
Messages
60
So google is the be all and end all of factual information now????
It is another fake propaganda organization..
Want something to support your argument google it, they are on both sides so long as it
turns people against each other..
 

fwafwow

WKR
Joined
Apr 8, 2018
Messages
5,646
So google is the be all and end all of factual information now????
It is another fake propaganda organization..
Want something to support your argument google it, they are on both sides so long as it
turns people against each other..
I am not a fan of Google as a company either. Serious question - is there a search function or method you trust?
 

MattB

WKR
Joined
Sep 29, 2012
Messages
5,743
So google is the be all and end all of factual information now????
It is another fake propaganda organization..
Want something to support your argument google it, they are on both sides so long as it
turns people against each other..
I don’t know if you are aware (apparently not), but the reference to Google relates to it as a search engine. With that, the information searchable through Google isn’t put forth by Google. One can find actual medical studies and articles summarizing medical studies written by 3rd parties (like the one I posted that I found through Google).
 

BobbyMac

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Aug 26, 2015
Messages
203
Location
Willamette Valley, Oregon
I'm not getting it because..

1. I've had covid.
2. I know 2 people who've had coincidental strokes within 18 hours of their shot.
3. I trust the medical community when it comes to this about as day old gas station sushi. Logic is dead in this discussion.
Good points WRO...I can play this too....sadly.
1. I've had covid too...wife and I had it over Thanksgiving...cough was the worst symptom.
2. Had 2 good friends die EXACTLY one week after getting their 2nd shots last March...two weeks apart...wedged in there was a good friend that had a stroke right after his 2nd shot. Both friends in great shape and 50 years old died of massive blood clots to the heart! Stroke victim was 35! We all worked together...tragic!
3. I trust it even less....no logic whatsoever.
 
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ODB

WKR
Joined
Mar 24, 2016
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4,037
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N.F.D.
Good points WRO...I can play this too....sadly.
1. I've had covid too...wife and I had it over Thanksgiving...cough was the worst symptom.
2. Had 2 good friends die EXACTLY one week after getting their 2nd shots last March...two weeks apart...wedged in there was a good friend that had a stroke right after his 2nd shot. Both friends in great shape and 50 years old died of massive blood clots to the heart! Stroke victim was 35! We all worked together...tragic!
3. I trust it even less....no logic whatsoever.

It is weird stuff. A friend of a friend in Botswana died 20 days after his second shot.
 

fwafwow

WKR
Joined
Apr 8, 2018
Messages
5,646
Easy way to avoid this is simply speak with your doctor, and if unsure then get a 2nd opinion. Pretty standard approach.
Great advice - I follow it as a general rule. But doctors have been wrong before, even on a consensus basis in which a second opinion may not matter.
 

cod007

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Feb 1, 2017
Messages
259
You may want to expand your universe of news sources because I read articles on the fentanyl issue on a weekly basis.
Expand my universe genius, and explain to us why they are letting millions of illegals into our country with no worries about them spreading the deadly Covid and killing fellow Americans they pretend to care so much about.
 
Joined
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Messages
719
Some who have refused the COVID vax have contrived a straw man argument to justify their decision by comparing themselves to those who have become fat and developed heart disease. Clever tactic…

The primary differentiator: it isn’t people with heart disease who are causing health care to be rationed.
That's because their impact on the system has been built in to the system over decades.
However, if you snapped your finger and wiped out obesity, heart disease and all the related medical issues; you'd definitely notice it in the medical field. I'm not saying it would ever get there, but to act like that's no big impact on the medical field is pure illusion.
We also could've had two years of the govt reminding us and reinforcing the priority of healthy living, but alas all we got was "two weeks to slow the spread" "stay inside and stay safe"... It's a dangerous world out there...
 

MattB

WKR
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Sep 29, 2012
Messages
5,743
That's because their impact on the system has been built in to the system over decades.
However, if you snapped your finger and wiped out obesity, heart disease and all the related medical issues; you'd definitely notice it in the medical field. I'm not saying it would ever get there, but to act like that's no big impact on the medical field is pure illusion.
We also could've had two years of the govt reminding us and reinforcing the priority of healthy living, but alas all we got was "two weeks to slow the spread" "stay inside and stay safe"... It's a dangerous world out there...
I don’t disagree, but I think your post misses the point. When was the last time our healthcare system was forced to ration care because of a spike in heart disease hospitalizations? I don’t recall one, but that has happened and is likely to happen again in the very near future due to the lack of COVID vaccination.
 

MattB

WKR
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Sep 29, 2012
Messages
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Expand my universe genius, and explain to us why they are letting millions of illegals into our country with no worries about them spreading the deadly Covid and killing fellow Americans they pretend to care so much about.
Haha, why would our government care about the vaccination status of illegals when almost 30% of US citizens (mostly those who are bringing up this angle) are already here and present the same risk? Illegal immigration is a drop in the bucket by comparison to the almost 100M unvaccinated Americans - some of whom are unwilling to protect themselves but are crying for the government to protect them.
 

fwafwow

WKR
Joined
Apr 8, 2018
Messages
5,646
I don’t disagree, but I think your post misses the point. When was the last time our healthcare system was forced to ration care because of a spike in heart disease hospitalizations? I don’t recall one, but that has happened and is likely to happen again in the very near future due to the lack of COVID vaccination.
What rate of vaccination do you think will prevent your prediction, and does it vary by age group?

Edit - the CDC (!) estimates that 72.7% of the total population has at least one vax dose, but perhaps more importantly for a concern about healthcare rationing, that those percentages increase to 82.9%, 84.9% and 95% (the cap) for ages 12 and over, 18 and over and 65 and over, respectively. (Corresponding fully vaccinated percentages are 61.7%, 70.9%, 72.6% and 87.5%.) It looks like those stubborn kids are comprising most of the holdouts.
 
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fwafwow

WKR
Joined
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Messages
5,646
Haha, why would our government care about the vaccination status of illegals when almost 30% of US citizens (mostly those who are bringing up this angle) are already here and present the same risk? Illegal immigration is a drop in the bucket by comparison to the almost 100M unvaccinated Americans - some of whom are unwilling to protect themselves but are crying for the government to protect them.
It might have gone out of favor in some circles, but I believe there is a difference in US citizens and those who are not. I think the former have some rights which the latter do not. Putting aside the differences in numbers in each category who are not vacccinated, and whether people should be admitted entry, it would seem intellectually consistent for the government to at least strongly encourage, if not mandate, that non-citizens be vaccinated if they want to enter here with the intention of remaining. Even if a mandate, they would still have a choice.
 

MattB

WKR
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Sep 29, 2012
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What rate of vaccination do you think will prevent your prediction, and does it vary by age group?

Edit - the CDC (!) estimates that 72.7% of the total population has at least one vax dose, but perhaps more importantly for a concern about healthcare rationing, that those percentages increase to 82.9%, 84.9% and 95% (the cap) for ages 12 and over, 18 and over and 65 and over, respectively. (Corresponding fully vaccinated percentages are 61.7%, 70.9%, 72.6% and 87.5%.) It looks like those stubborn kids are comprising most of the holdouts.
As you intimated, it is not about a % of the population but rather getting the vaccine into the arms of people in the more susceptible age groups. When you look at hospitalizations, people under 18 represent a tiny fraction of the total. It is predominantly the adult holdouts who are taking up beds. Those are predominantly the unvaccinated even though they are the minority.

 
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MattB

WKR
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It might have gone out of favor in some circles, but I believe there is a difference in US citizens and those who are not. I think the former have some rights which the latter do not. Putting aside the differences in numbers in each category who are not vacccinated, and whether people should be admitted entry, it would seem intellectually consistent for the government to at least strongly encourage, if not mandate, that non-citizens be vaccinated if they want to enter here with the intention of remaining. Even if a mandate, they would still have a choice.
Is this a discussion of COVID or legal status? Some are conflating the two in an attempt to take the crosshairs off themselves, but I think any reasonable and informed person should see right through that.

Is the COVID that illegals carry more transmissible or more deadly than that which is endemic to the US?

Are you more worried about the healthcare implications of 1M or 2M of them versus 100M of us?

Are you really that concerned about people coming from a country that is 56% fully vaccinated to one that is 62% fully vaccinated?

Just because someone posts something on the internet does not mean it is valid.
 

cod007

Lil-Rokslider
Joined
Feb 1, 2017
Messages
259
Is this a discussion of COVID or legal status? Some are conflating the two in an attempt to take the crosshairs off themselves, but I think any reasonable and informed person should see right through that.
ANSWER: This is a discussion that can all aspects of the covid that our govt wants its citizens to bow to all sorts of infringement on liberties based on this ‘deadly’ virus and anyone with an ounce of common sense would see that if the govt really believed they were looking after its citizens safety, they would IMMEDIATELY take the very easy, legal, and necessary step of closing off the border from those coming in from all parts of the world without hesitation.
Is the COVID that illegals carry more transmissible or more deadly than that which is endemic to the US?
ANSWER: According to our govt its so deadly we citizens have to wear masks, institute 6’ spacing, not comfort dying family members, work from home, lose jobs, take vax jabs, take booster jabs, carry vax cards and other mandates. Further, it’s not just covid we’re talking here. It’s the addition of other unknown diseases and the question of terrorists infiltrating. So again, it really shows that the govt doesn’t really care about your health. Never did. It’s about control. Surely u an see that, right?
Are you more worried about the healthcare implications of 1M or 2M of them versus 100M of us?
ANSWER: Once again, it’s tangible proof that govt ISN'T worried about anyone’s health. It’s about control and turning America into a third world existence.
Are you really that concerned about people coming from a country that is 56% fully vaccinated to one that is 62% fully vaccinated?
ANSWER: Govt doesn’t know where they come/came from. And they certainly don’t care. Proof is in their inaction.
Just because someone posts something on the internet does not mean it is valid.
 

WRO

WKR
Joined
Nov 6, 2013
Messages
3,440
Location
Idaho
Good points WRO...I can play this too....sadly.
1. I've had covid too...wife and I had it over Thanksgiving...cough was the worst symptom.
2. Had 2 good friends die EXACTLY one week after getting their 2nd shots last March...two weeks apart...wedged in there was a good friend that had a stroke right after his 2nd shot. Both friends in great shape and 50 years old died of massive blood clots to the heart! Stroke victim was 35! We all worked together...tragic!
3. I trust it even less....no logic whatsoever.
It's sad and alarming the cover up with side effects including death on this one.

On the Joe Rogan Podcast with Jimmy Dore, Jimmy mentioned his side effects and the back lash he got. (He's a leftist in case your wondering)..

It's no longer science and now it's a religion when it comes to vaccines..

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