How do you set your rifle down in the field?

[Formidilosus]

I’m super confused - I had you all wrong? Instead of throwing rifles down hills, freezing them in lakes, and using them as a handyman jack handle, you hunt with a cute little tent for the scope and action - even when it’s not snowing or raining.

Even I’ve never used one of those, but I like it. Just don’t go too soft on us.

Why didn’t you answer the questions in that post?

As for a scope cover, yes. I couldn’t care less about the action, however lenses are the most fragile part of a good rifle system relatively speaking.


So now I’m confused- is it not abuse because the lenses are covered, or is it still abuse because they are touching the ground?

 

[Formidilosus]

Me, once it was moisture and I blew a primer. Another, fine sand and grit got in a bolt caused misfire after a long day at a windy match on top of not cleaning it enough after the two or three prior dusty matches. That would have been equal to one hunt in some situations for me.

For learning, what rifles were those?

 

[eric1115]

The OP was literally asking about what people do to not lay a rifle down on the ground when at a glassing spot. Not throw, toss, beat, or any other straw-man exaggeration that people have brought up to act like letting a rifle touch the ground is abuse- literally set a rifle beside him to glass.


So this is a serious question for people on this thread. Since laying a rifle on the ground is “abuse” and you don’t abuse your equipment or gear which is why you don’t let your rifle touch the ground- how do you set your pack down when hunting? Is your pack not equipment or a tool? You’ve already stated that a rifle is a tool and you should take care of your tools and not abuse them, and letting a rifle touch dirt, snow, rocks is abuse; so does that not follow that letting a pack touch dirt, snow, or rocks is also abusing that equipment? Do carry a stand that you assemble before you take your pack off so it never touches the ground? Or maybe a tarp in your pocket that you can lay down to set the pack on. But then, isn’t the tarp itself “equipment”?
Cary that farther- clothing is “gear”, and since you don’t want to abuse “gear” do you not ever sit on the ground wearing your pants? What about taking a knee while kneeling? This can be carried logically to everything- what about your boots, they are gear correct? Do we not let the sole touch the ground? If touching dirt is abuse, then how do you justify that?


Read the OP’s post, then read the comments. It’s about setting a rifle beside you while glassing. Here’s me abusing a brand new rifle yesterday while glassing. I wonder how much I reduced its lifespan?
View attachment 624883

I set my rifle on the ground all the time, usually try to lay it on a rock or sagebrush to keep dirt and dust to a minimum if I'm in an area with very fine/loose dirt. I didn't mean to imply that setting it on the ground was abuse, if that's what was communicated. I don't think any of what you posted constitutes abuse.

I have zero issues laying a skil saw on the ground, but if it gets set down rough and the corner of the plate hits first, or the blade goes in the gravel, I'm going to get pretty direct about how I want my stuff treated.

The point I was trying to make with my reply is that there are upper and lower limits to the care we ought to take with our stuff. It's going to get scratched and dirty from being used as it was intended to, but there's no reason to be unnecessarily careless. It takes zero extra time and only a little extra engagement of the give-a-shit muscle to set a saw down right. Similarly, I'll try to put a rifle down in such a way that it won't go sliding off the rock pile or bolt-side down in the mud or in the dirt with lens caps open.

I do think a lot of the "drop it from hip height" responses are jokes (I sure laughed at that one) but I've seen guys do stuff like that and I don't think it's smart when there's literally no reason not to take a little more care.

 

[TaperPin]

I'm going to be picking one of those up for my next western hunt honestly. I came back from AZ with a layer of dirt coating the inside of my action and some scratches on my new scope. It would have helped if my dumb ass hadn't unintentionally dragged the scope/action through the dirt and rocks while moving the pack it was strapped to the side of.

In the past the neoprene scope covers were about the only good practical protection against unintentional wrecks and bumps - I really like something like these covers that not only pads the scope, but helps keep excess water and dirt out of the action.

Just walking across shale slides, or rocky ledges with loose gravel, and it‘s not if you’ll fall over, but when.

 

[TaperPin]

Why didn’t you answer the questions in that post?

As for a scope cover, yes. I couldn’t care less about the action, however lenses are the most fragile part of a good rifle system relatively speaking.


So now I’m confused- is it not abuse because the lenses are covered, or is it still abuse because they are touching the ground?
View attachment 624905

I have to admit something - a friend reminded me a couple of my favorite rifles were bought well worn, almost battle worn - they were special because they not only shot well, but all the scrapes and scratches showed the history of a lot of hunts and time spent outdoors. It’s kind of like your wood stock - it‘s cool.

I agree with you on the importance of protecting optics - the finish on a stock is pretty inexpensive to refinish - time should be spent where it matters, not where it doesn’t.

 

[Reburn]

Man.

Some of yall would have had a melt down if yall saw me using my Benelli super vinci as a paddle in cold bay AK. Or rinsing off the salt water with a garden hose.

Ive also used it as a yard stick to see how deep water is before. Or a reaching stick to get a duck out of too deep water.

 

[TaperPin]

Man.

Some of yall would have had a melt down if yall saw me using my Benelli super vinci as a paddle in cold bay AK. Or rinsing off the salt water with a garden hose.

Ive also used it as a yard stick to see how deep water is before. Or a reaching stick to get a duck out of too deep water.

That did make me chuckle out loud. I don’t know much about shotguns, but I imagined the face of a certain anal-retentive friend who does. Lol

 

[Formidilosus]

I set my rifle on the ground all the time, usually try to lay it on a rock or sagebrush to keep dirt and dust to a minimum if I'm in an area with very fine/loose dirt. I didn't mean to imply that setting it on the ground was abuse, if that's what was communicated. I don't think any of what you posted constitutes abuse.

I have zero issues laying a skil saw on the ground, but if it gets set down rough and the corner of the plate hits first, or the blade goes in the gravel, I'm going to get pretty direct about how I want my stuff treated.

The point I was trying to make with my reply is that there are upper and lower limits to the care we ought to take with our stuff. It's going to get scratched and dirty from being used as it was intended to, but there's no reason to be unnecessarily careless. It takes zero extra time and only a little extra engagement of the give-a-shit muscle to set a saw down right. Similarly, I'll try to put a rifle down in such a way that it won't go sliding off the rock pile or bolt-side down in the mud or in the dirt with lens caps open.

I do think a lot of the "drop it from hip height" responses are jokes (I sure laughed at that one) but I've seen guys do stuff like that and I don't think it's smart when there's literally no reason not to take a little more care.

Not to you at all. Your posts are spot on.

 

[Formidilosus]

I have to admit something - a friend reminded me a couple of my favorite rifles were bought well worn, almost battle worn - they were special because they not only shot well, but all the scrapes and scratches showed the history of a lot of hunts and time spent outdoors. It’s kind of like your wood stock - it‘s cool.

Haha. I’m with you there.

 

[TheGDog]

Bend at knees

Doesn't matter if you bend at knees when you've got bulging discs man.

 

[hereinaz]

Writing this, I recognize that my experience is specific, and maybe experienced shooters know things I didn't know when it happened. I also tend to be rough on tools and my truck, cause they are meant to be used. I took it too far with my rifle, not that I was abusing it. But, you don't know what you don't know.

When I see these threads, I just don't assume everyone knows the nuance or has the experience to know why a rifle is OK to be dunked in water--but water in the chamber can sometimes cause a high pressure spike. I didn't really get that or if I heard it I ignored it because I had shot my rifle in wet conditions before.

I could have asked the question the OP did years ago. I got almost all my learning by trying hard to find good reliable sources online because I didn't have anyone I knew that really shot rifles or that hunted. Everyone knows the pros and cons of trying to find trustworthy stuff on the internet. Its why I try to talk about "the exceptions" of stuff that a newbie might not realize. A little knowledge can be dangerous. There are important exceptions to almost every rule.

The blown primer was 100% user error, I should have been more careful. It was a rainy, snowy day on an elk hunt. At the time, my rifle didn't look much different than some of the pics with rifles in the snow. The snow and water had no direct effect on my rifle. It wasn't going to rust and it wasn't going to ruin the synthetic stock. I didn't care that my rifle was wet or snowy.

The issue only came during the operation of my rifle. I should have cared about my chamber/ammo getting even a little wet. I knew that water could cause issues, but I was treating my rifle like a tool and just hunting. And, I had proven my rifle in wet weather. My first hunting trip with that rifle was a 9 day very wet trip to Kodiak in September. My hunting partner and I shot all our animals with it in wet conditions without problems. He ended up choosing to leave his rifle at camp because of the types of shots and opportunities we were getting. And, I think he was OK with my rifle getting wet, lol. It was strapped to the back of my rifle, got wet and messy pushing through brush and climbing through alders. If it was raining I did occasionally put it in a sleeve when it was on my pack.

Back to the Colorado hunt, I blew a primer in my Nucleus, running a decent but not visibly hot load in my 7 sherman short mag 180 VLD at 3050 with H1000. At that time, I just had a scope cover and didn't worry about the moisture on the rifle. I shouldn't have shot it as "moist" as it was without checking the chamber and ammo. After that, made my cover. I also went to a slower powder to reduce the peak pressure and didn't chase the extra velocity it could get me. My rifle was probably drier at that time than times during my AK hunt.

I am 100% on board with the "rifles are tools" idea. I actually chose the Nuke based on the internet reputation of the Mausinfield being a crappy "range action" not feeling all smooth and buttery in the store, but being a performer in the field. Not sure the whole truth, but I read lots of buzz about a really rainy/messy match where "all the other actions went down but someone running the new Mausingfield ran like a champ. I got to talk with shooters who new Ted personally and had run the Mausingfield. I liked the idea that it had the "battle proven" ejector and extractor. (I was also switching from Savage actions so my prefits would fit.) My Nuke is single digit off the initial release. I know Ted makes a generous bolt "tolerance" and I have felt it comparing actions with tighter bolt/race specs at a couple dust bowl matches.

It was a Savage that got the moon dust treatment. It was a rifle match with lots of people are walking and the dust is easily blown and lifted. One compounding factor is that I suppose matches require the bolt open with chamber flag--I don't hunt with my bolt open. It was years ago, but it was one of my first rifles, it was a Savage but I can't remember if it was a new 12 FV or if it was a different model. Hunting and other matches, I got that rifle and others really dusty without failure. That day, the extra dirt pushed it over the edge.

 

[TaperPin]

Writing this, I recognize that my experience is specific, and maybe experienced shooters know things I didn't know when it happened. I also tend to be rough on tools and my truck, cause they are meant to be used. I took it too far with my rifle, not that I was abusing it. But, you don't know what you don't know.

When I see these threads, I just don't assume everyone knows the nuance or has the experience to know why a rifle is OK to be dunked in water--but water in the chamber can sometimes cause a high pressure spike. I didn't really get that or if I heard it I ignored it because I had shot my rifle in wet conditions before.

I could have asked the question the OP did years ago. I got almost all my learning by trying hard to find good reliable sources online because I didn't have anyone I knew that really shot rifles or that hunted. Everyone knows the pros and cons of trying to find trustworthy stuff on the internet. Its why I try to talk about "the exceptions" of stuff that a newbie might not realize. A little knowledge can be dangerous. There are important exceptions to almost every rule.

The blown primer was 100% user error, I should have been more careful. It was a rainy, snowy day on an elk hunt. At the time, my rifle didn't look much different than some of the pics with rifles in the snow. The snow and water had no direct effect on my rifle. It wasn't going to rust and it wasn't going to ruin the synthetic stock. I didn't care that my rifle was wet or snowy.

The issue only came during the operation of my rifle. I should have cared about my chamber/ammo getting even a little wet. I knew that water could cause issues, but I was treating my rifle like a tool and just hunting. And, I had proven my rifle in wet weather. My first hunting trip with that rifle was a 9 day very wet trip to Kodiak in September. My hunting partner and I shot all our animals with it in wet conditions without problems. He ended up choosing to leave his rifle at camp because of the types of shots and opportunities we were getting. And, I think he was OK with my rifle getting wet, lol. It was strapped to the back of my rifle, got wet and messy pushing through brush and climbing through alders. If it was raining I did occasionally put it in a sleeve when it was on my pack.

Back to the Colorado hunt, I blew a primer in my Nucleus, running a decent but not visibly hot load in my 7 sherman short mag 180 VLD at 3050 with H1000. At that time, I just had a scope cover and didn't worry about the moisture on the rifle. I shouldn't have shot it as "moist" as it was without checking the chamber and ammo. After that, made my cover. I also went to a slower powder to reduce the peak pressure and didn't chase the extra velocity it could get me. My rifle was probably drier at that time than times during my AK hunt.

I am 100% on board with the "rifles are tools" idea. I actually chose the Nuke based on the internet reputation of the Mausinfield being a crappy "range action" not feeling all smooth and buttery in the store, but being a performer in the field. Not sure the whole truth, but I read lots of buzz about a really rainy/messy match where "all the other actions went down but someone running the new Mausingfield ran like a champ. I got to talk with shooters who new Ted personally and had run the Mausingfield. I liked the idea that it had the "battle proven" ejector and extractor. (I was also switching from Savage actions so my prefits would fit.) My Nuke is single digit off the initial release. I know Ted makes a generous bolt "tolerance" and I have felt it comparing actions with tighter bolt/race specs at a couple dust bowl matches.

It was a Savage that got the moon dust treatment. It was a rifle match with lots of people are walking and the dust is easily blown and lifted. One compounding factor is that I suppose matches require the bolt open with chamber flag--I don't hunt with my bolt open. It was years ago, but it was one of my first rifles, it was a Savage but I can't remember if it was a new 12 FV or if it was a different model. Hunting and other matches, I got that rifle and others really dusty without failure. That day, the extra dirt pushed it over the edge.

Your comment about a wet chamber is important. In the rain I’ve always taped the muzzle and kept the barrel level or up and felt good about it, but if cartridges in the magazine are wet, it’s no different from a wet chamber. I’m not entirely sure what to do about it, other than a cover of some kind around the scope and ejection port that’s removed as rain stops, and wiping free water off the cartridges as needed.

 

[Moultrie]

I typically prop it against a tree or just lay it down on the ground.

 

[Sandstrom]

Man.

Some of yall would have had a melt down if yall saw me using my Benelli super vinci as a paddle in cold bay AK. Or rinsing off the salt water with a garden hose.

Ive also used it as a yard stick to see how deep water is before. Or a reaching stick to get a duck out of too deep water.

That’s funny!! I was just using my Benelli UL today to push down barbed wire fences to make easier for my dad to step over

 

[Choupique]

not entirely sure what to do about it,

Full length size and safe pressures are all you can do. You can keep the barrel from plugging up with crap, but you aren't keeping the water out of it if it's raining.

 

[Kimber7man]

Stopping by to say this is one of the best looking rifles I’ve seen. What pattern is that? A take on GAP?

Thanks, it is a GAP in their GAP camo.

 

[hereinaz]

That’s funny!! I was just using my Benelli UL today to push down barbed wire fences to make easier for my dad to step over

I think shotgun manuals come with instructions on all the various uses, hahaha.

 

[Formidilosus]

Writing this, I recognize that my experience is specific, and maybe experienced shooters know things I didn't know when it happened. I also tend to be rough on tools and my truck, cause they are meant to be used. I took it too far with my rifle, not that I was abusing it. But, you don't know what you don't know.

Thank you for responding.

The blown primer was 100% user error, I should have been more careful. It was a rainy, snowy day on an elk hunt. At the time, my rifle didn't look much different than some of the pics with rifles in the snow. The snow and water had no direct effect on my rifle. It wasn't going to rust and it wasn't going to ruin the synthetic stock. I didn't care that my rifle was wet or snowy.

The issue only came during the operation of my rifle. I should have cared about my chamber/ammo getting even a little wet. I knew that water could cause issues, but I was treating my rifle like a tool and just hunting. And, I had proven my rifle in wet weather.

Back to the Colorado hunt, I blew a primer in my Nucleus, running a decent but not visibly hot load in my 7 sherman short mag 180 VLD at 3050 with H1000. At that time, I just had a scope cover and didn't worry about the moisture on the rifle. I shouldn't have shot it as "moist" as it was without checking the chamber and ammo. After that, made my cover. I also went to a slower powder to reduce the peak pressure and didn't chase the extra velocity it could get me. My rifle was probably drier at that time than times during my AK hunt.

The issue here isn’t some water in a chamber- literally millions of rounds of ammo are shot in total downpours ever year. Rain, water, snow, dirt are all realities of life and the guns must work in those conditions.

It’s a combination of things that starts with people getting cute with chamber specs, loads, and actions. “Tight” chambers “for accuracy”, bullets kissing, touching, or near the lands; neck sizing only, loads too hot just “going by pressure signs”, and reusing brass too many times are all problems. That is gamer, sitting on a bench nonsense.

Field rifles, chambers, and throats need correct tolerances for field use. Loads should not be run “near, but below pressure signs”, bullets need to be nowhere near the lands, and brass shouldn’t be reused 10 times. Doing so- rifles should have zero issues being submerged in water, then having the bolt cracked to drain it and then firing. Do the same with how most load ammo, how people want the chambers cut, and crappy rifles- yes you can have issues.


Field guns aren’t match guns.

I am 100% on board with the "rifles are tools" idea. I actually chose the Nuke based on the internet reputation of the Mausinfield being a crappy "range action" not feeling all smooth and buttery in the store, but being a performer in the field. Not sure the whole truth, but I read lots of buzz about a really rainy/messy match where "all the other actions went down but someone running the new Mausingfield ran like a champ. I got to talk with shooters who new Ted personally and had run the Mausingfield. I liked the idea that it had the "battle proven" ejector and extractor. (I was also switching from Savage actions so my prefits would fit.) My Nuke is single digit off the initial release. I know Ted makes a generous bolt "tolerance" and I have felt it comparing actions with tighter bolt/race specs at a couple dust bowl matches.

The Mausingfield is a very good action that is hampered by a very sub par trigger system. With a different trigger system they would be the action I use for everything.

It was a Savage that got the moon dust treatment. It was a rifle match with lots of people are walking and the dust is easily blown and lifted. One compounding factor is that I suppose matches require the bolt open with chamber flag--I don't hunt with my bolt open. It was years ago, but it was one of my first rifles, it was a Savage but I can't remember if it was a new 12 FV or if it was a different model. Hunting and other matches, I got that rifle and others really dusty without failure. That day, the extra dirt pushed it over the edge.

This is not uncommon at all with Savages, and lots of other action, though Savages are at the top of the list for mechanical failures when used, especially in non sterile conditions. They simply have way less margin for error in reliably feeding and functioning than others.


I’m not trying to harp on you, or anyone else. All equipment pushed hard enough will fail, however if you are going to base your decisions on two objectively compromised systems, then yes you will think every rifle needs a condom to work.
The difference between a R700 based action and trigger, or Savage rifle with loads that are worked up as most do, with compromised chambers and throats- and a robust rifle system from Tikka, Blaser, AI, Sako S20 or TRG, Sauer, etc, or in most cases a M70 with old style triggers and correct ammo- is worlds apart.


There is a demonstrable difference between rifle systems and where each consistently fails.

 

[Choupique]

So form, are you aware of any good reliable model 700 style triggers out there? Tikka uses a cartridge-style trigger assembly from what I remember, and that's ultra reliable. I like the mausingfield the most out of everything from reading but the trigger thing turns me off from trying it.

I like the old mauser 96 original 2 stage trigger. Seems like it has to work no matter what if you can yank on it hard enough.

As far as rounds go, your stuff is full length sized and loaded to factory OAL?

I'm new to reloading. I've been neck sizing my stuff just because it's a .338 win mag and I read myself into concern about case head separation.

I greatly appreciate all the information yall share here. I'd have never gotten a reliable scope and never started reloading if it hadn't been for yall. Us eastern flatland people don't know anything about rifles.

 

[JohnJohnson]

The Mausingfield is a very good action that is hampered by a very sub par trigger system. With a different trigger system they would be the action I use for everything.

Is the trigger system sub par for reliability or just feel?