Future of Muzzleloader hunting

[Kurts86]

I think iron sight only does a pretty good job at limiting the intent for primitive muzzleloader seasons. With the same muzzleloader scoped I’ve killed a deer at 250 yards during last shooting light but my range limit is more like 100-125 yards with iron sights and good lighting in the open. In timber with iron sights it goes well under 100 yards with iron sights.

I really enjoy the Colorado muzzleloader season, it’s my favorite season to hunt elk and I’m good with their equipment rules. I’ve tweaked my muzzleloading setup to the legal limit of 4 different states and scopes matter the most of any change. It also means most setups can be made legal with little to no costs with 1/2 the effective range.

 

[OKHunter84]

I think iron sight only does a pretty good job at limiting the intent for primitive muzzleloader seasons. With the same muzzleloader scoped I’ve killed a deer at 250 yards during last shooting light but my range limit is more like 100-125 yards with iron sights and good lighting in the open. In timber with iron sights it goes well under 100 yards with iron sights.

I really enjoy the Colorado muzzleloader season, it’s my favorite season to hunt elk and I’m good with their equipment rules. I’ve tweaked my muzzleloading setup to the legal limit of 4 different states and scopes matter the most of any change. It also means most setups can be made legal with little to no costs with 1/2 the effective range.

That's very true. I've killed a deer at 256 with my inline CVA, but 100 or a little over is my limit with my open sight percussion.

 

[WBrim]

Checking Utah and the unit that I primarily hunt, the success rates on the muzzleloader season haven't really changed a ton in the last 7 years. The surprising thing to me is that they have largely kept up with rifle success rates and drastically out paced archery.

Scopes went on muzzleloaders in 18 or 19 in Utah?

Also have to remember that in Utah across this time span, tag allocation has largely decreased and success rates and tag allocation are not linear in relation. Generally as less tags are allocated, success rates drop more than the tag decrease. So, as tags decrease and success rates stay the same, we as hunters are being more effective.

	A	M	R
15​	16.7​	30.4​	32.9​
16​	11.4​	29.7​	35.2​
17​	6.7​	19.6​	20.2​
18​	16​	26.1​	27.6​
19​	7.9​	16.4​	18.5​
20​	12.9​	21.6​	21.6​
21​	10.3​	30.7​	40.9​
22​	12.7​	35.4​	35.4​
Average	11.825​	26.2375​	29.0375​
Median	12.05​	27.9​	30.25​

I always thought scopes were ok’d for 2016. But, I’ve been wrong before.

 

[WBrim]

I wonder if it makes a difference to split (I know, stop adding more seasons!) But how many people want a “traditional” MZ season and who wants it as a muzzle loader (meaning as long as it is a front stuffer, it’s good to go)?
Not saying this is an answer at all, just curious thoughts…

 

[Stalker69]

I feel as though they should have a trad. black powder season, flint locks and side locks, open sights( what black powder was) and only allow inlines and scopes and such ( modern muzzle loaders, and yes i own a knight) to be used in firearm season.

 

[Yoder]

PA has two different seasons. Muzzle loader, which is only a couple days and does only. You can use any muzzle loader you want with whatever optic. The second is the primitive season. That is flintlock or archery. Open sights, no optics. That is a couple weeks and you can shoot bucks or does. You only get one buck tag for the entire deer season. They don't have an extra flintlock tag.

 

[ENCORE]

Never could figure out why hunters bitck about modern inlines, then talk about how there should be a separate season for traditionalists. If there's a season open, why can't you just use your traditional equipment, buckskins and all???
What's wrong with you hunting with what you like, me hunting with what I like and we let it go at that? If I see a hunter carrying a flint during the REGULAR FIREARM season, should I bitck at him/her about it?
This ..... 'my way' ... stuff has to stop.
I hunt all firearm seasons with only a muzzleloader and have for decades. Rifle season, muzzleloader season, late doe season, what ever. Never bothered me what another hunter may be using. Figured as a man, it was none of my business.

 

[Stalker69]

I would have to say you use an inline, with a scope, possibly Smokeless powder ? So in your way of thinking there should just be one " season" use what you want ? Seems like that would be easier for the game departments. But talk about crowded, unless you have private property.

 

[OKHunter84]

Never could figure out why hunters bitck about modern inlines, then talk about how there should be a separate season for traditionalists. If there's a season open, why can't you just use your traditional equipment, buckskins and all???
What's wrong with you hunting with what you like, me hunting with what I like and we let it go at that? If I see a hunter carrying a flint during the REGULAR FIREARM season, should I bitck at him/her about it?
This ..... 'my way' ... stuff has to stop.
I hunt all firearm seasons with only a muzzleloader and have for decades. Rifle season, muzzleloader season, late doe season, what ever. Never bothered me what another hunter may be using. Figured as a man, it was none of my business.

So how do you feel about archery seasons? You think it should just be rifle season all the time and nobody care what other guys use, use a bow or whatever?

What the fear is and what state game agencies will look at with any technology that increases efficacy or drastically improves the range of the weapons being used, will be increased harvest rates. If they have 100 tags allocated hoping to harvest 30 bucks, 30ish guys tag out most generally. A new technology comes along then all the sudden that starts jumping to 45 or 50, then the 100 tags turns into 65. That's my only concern is that the opportunities that are already becoming increasingly harder to come by, will get even harder.

 

[ENCORE]

So how do you feel about archery seasons? You think it should just be rifle season all the time and nobody care what other guys use, use a bow or whatever?..............................

How do I feel about archery seasons? Same way, period. If you want to use a long bow, recurve, compound or a crossbow, who cares which one you use? I could care less myself about what another hunter uses. I've used them all over time.

Rifle season all the time??? Where the heck did that come from??? These post ALWAYS and WITHOUT FAIL, always turn into nothing more than a bitcking match.
Read again my post above. It says nothing about it being rifle season all the time.

 

[OKHunter84]

How do I feel about archery seasons? Same way, period. If you want to use a long bow, recurve, compound or a crossbow, who cares which one you use? I could care less myself about what another hunter uses. I've used them all over time.

Rifle season all the time??? Where the heck did that come from??? These post ALWAYS and WITHOUT FAIL, always turn into nothing more than a bitcking match.
Read again my post above. It says nothing about it being rifle season all the time.

I started the post cause I was curious if other hunters thought that states should/will regulate muzzleloader technology the more advanced it gets. Whether or not a person prefers to do it one way or the other isn't what I was curious about. Wasn't intended to be griping match. Calm down there fella.

 

[OXN939]

I'd personally like to see seasons that mimick the restricted muzzleloader in New Mexico. Has to be loaded from the muzzle, no sabots, open sights and only caplock or flintlock.

Ditto, almost. I'd go with NV rules- irons only, 209 ignition and sabots both good to go. Keeps ranges short, but effectiveness ethically high within that range.

No need to make dudes octuple the rate of hangfires they have. They key to seasons is how close you have to get.

 

[Rich M]

How do I feel about archery seasons? Same way, period. If you want to use a long bow, recurve, compound or a crossbow, who cares which one you use? I could care less myself about what another hunter uses. I've used them all over time.

Rifle season all the time??? Where the heck did that come from??? These post ALWAYS and WITHOUT FAIL, always turn into nothing more than a bitcking match.
Read again my post above. It says nothing about it being rifle season all the time.

I'm deaf, make unknown to me noises when drawing a bow and usually spook or at least put the animal on alert - then they jump the string. State won't let me use a x-bow. Also have to wait about 3 yrs between getting quota permits just to hunt so can't say no to archery. Bunch of crap cause some guys feel that this or that is "cheating". Wish they'd just live and let live.

I'd like everyone to get a 1 any deer permit, good for whatever method you want - you want to take 4 months finding the right critter, then do that. You want to just shoot one and get it over with, then do that. I know it is not sustainable but it allows everyone to hunt as they want - make it as easy or as tough as necessary.

 

[ENCORE]

I started the post cause I was curious if other hunters thought that states should/will regulate muzzleloader technology the more advanced it gets. Whether or not a person prefers to do it one way or the other isn't what I was curious about. Wasn't intended to be griping match. Calm down there fella.

Calm down? I am calm and have been. LOL

My reasoning differs from yours is all. Please, don't ask a question if you're not going to like the answer/s you may receive.

Short of just a few of the western states, other states are now starting to allow smokeless muzzleloaders, with more each year. Many states are now allowing most straight walled cartridges to be used during muzzleloader season, such as the 350's, 450's and such, with more states are starting to allow straight walls. Hunters that used to use muzzleloaders are now using straight walls if their states allow. We're actually loosing muzzleloader hunters throughout the States.

The NMLRA is a great example. The average age of members is/was something like 71+, and it was loosing memberships as those passed on. Membership is now increasing, as younger members, shooting modern inline rifles with all kinds of different scopes, now have different matches. Including the Camp Atterbury long range matches at 800, 900 and 1,000yds that will be held June 10-11th.

Take the "modern" out, and it'll end up in the long run like giving a teenager a rotary phone.

 

[30338]

I find the current regulations in CO okay other than the minimum caliber restrictions.

I'd say loose black powder or knockoff black, conical or patched roundball only, minimum caliber 40, iron or peep sights only, sidehammer, percussion cap or flintlock only. Problem we are about to have is the communists want to eliminate lead bullets so its going to be interesting to see what happens with that. Total BS.

The above is just my opinion and it may be the wrong one. But that is what I use and have good success with. I find it falls into the "traditional muzzleloading season" parameters as I see them.

 

[Rich M]

Short of just a few of the western states, other states are now starting to allow smokeless muzzleloaders, with more each year. Many states are now allowing most straight walled cartridges to be used during muzzleloader season, such as the 350's, 450's and such, with more states are starting to allow straight walls. Hunters that used to use muzzleloaders are now using straight walls if their states allow. We're actually loosing muzzleloader hunters throughout the States.

This - most folks don't want to mess around with the idea of ML hunting. It is surprising but true.

Straight walls during ML is something new to me but I'd love it.

Same reason we have such a big push to get kids involved and have special Vet seasons - they also have a strong market to women, trying to get as many folks as possible to continue hunting traditions and start new ones. Too many folks moving to the cities and losing their roots.

 

[Stalker69]

How do I feel about archery seasons? Same way, period. If you want to use a long bow, recurve, compound or a crossbow, who cares which one you use? I could care less myself about what another hunter uses. I've used them all over time.

Rifle season all the time??? Where the heck did that come from??? These post ALWAYS and WITHOUT FAIL, always turn into nothing more than a bitcking match.
Read again my post above. It says nothing about it being rifle season all the time.

Yea, but why not. Your for any means you want to hunt with. Not bitchin, it wouldn't matter to me. I use my bows during rifle season now.

 

[rayporter]

25 years ago i would have been OK with open sights only, now , not so much. it would eliminate me.

when i moved to arkansas the law for ML was one power max on scopes. red dots were popular.
now any power scopes.

 

[Bluefish]

I like the Colorado regs. Imho part of muzzle loaders is they are short range weapons. What I would like is to be able to have one tag for ml and one for gun season. Right now you get one for bow and one for gun or ml. I have no interest in bow hunting so that automatically limits my tags.

 

[HighUintas]

It should be based on potential range and difficulty in getting close.

ML iron sights, no vernier and globe, patched ball or grease groove only, flintlock or exposed cap - august 15-Sept 1

Longbow/recurve Archery - Sept 1-sept20

Compound archery - Sept 20-oct5

Rifle - oct 5-nov1

Archery and flintlock patched ball nov1-dec1 for the struggles