Fletching with the spine of the arrow

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fulldraw71
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Buy Easton USA made arrows and you don't have to worry about where the spine is.
I have Easton 6.5 match grades and when I was picking up my new bow this weekend, the guy was shooting through paper at the shop. He tried several of his arrows along with mine and mine was not getting as good a tear. He rotated the nock to lineup the word Easton at the top and he got a good tear and he told me that was the spine on the Easton arrows.
 
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fulldraw71
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I believe the video is on his FB page, Hammer Archery.
Basically, he took the time to shoot 2 dozen bareshaft arrows through paper and nock tuned all of them to make the same tear. Marked them and then fletched. When they were all fletched, he shot them all through paper again. He got all kinds of different tears from them again after they were fletched.

I did the same thing on my last set of 3d arrows and got the same result. I shot them all as bareshafts through paper and nock tuned, marked them, and then fletched. Afterwards I shot them all through paper again. I did have half of them make the same tear as each other after fletching, but the other 6 were making different tears and needed the nocks rotated to another vane to get them to be the same as the others.
I built these arrows very meticulously, trimmed them to length from both ends, squared ends, and even weighed out and sorted all nocks, vanes, and tips to match up finished arrow weights. When complete they were all within 1 grain of each other.

After the above result, I decided I will always just fletch arrows with all the same color vanes and then just nock tune them afterwards.
The problem might be is when you’re nock tuning if where the arrow would tear the best you’ve got a vane sticking straight at 9 o’clock towards your cables. On my new Hoyt, it doesn’t have the clearance that some of these other bows do and that would probably cause fletching contact. Other than that possible issue I see where you’re going with this.
 

Zac

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The problem might be is when you’re nock tuning if where the arrow would tear the best you’ve got a vane sticking straight at 9 o’clock towards your cables. On my new Hoyt, it doesn’t have the clearance that some of these other bows do and that would probably cause fletching contact. Other than that possible issue I see where you’re going with this.
You are way overthinking this. The stickers that go on the shaft are randomly rolled on. Those shafts will almost always produce an acceptable tear on one of the three positions. I would nock tune 2 shafts until you get acceptable tears. Then put a broadhead on one of them. Broadhead tune those 2 shafts. Once they are hitting together move your sight so that the impact is in the dot. Take the broadhead off that shaft and run it on every shaft you have. If you don’t hit the dot with broadhead then rotate through the vane positions until you do. Once you hit the middle with a broadhead that shaft is done. Take the broadhead off and move it to the next shaft.
 

Ho5tile1

WKR
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I only nock tune my hunting arrows my 3d arrows I just match em up with what victory says is the spine and shoot them and so far they all hit where I’m aiming,. if I have one that is a flyer I will turn the nock, sometimes it helps sometimes it don’t and it’s just a practice arrow after that. I used to be crazy with paper tuning nock tuning but now I just get it close with my top hats slap a broadhead on it and go from there. Why waist all that time paper tuning just to get it perfect then when a broadhead goes on your moving the rest or cams to get them to hit together with FPs not everytime but most times. I just don’t understand getting perfect paper tares just to move it all again for broadheads. So was the bow tuned before or after broadheads. Or was it bareshaft tuned? As far as I know no one is shooting bareshafts hunting or in target shooting. To each there own I guess


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ddowning

Lil-Rokslider
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In my experience, most of the supertuning techniques are not noticeable by 99.9% of archers. I will not say 100% because there might be someone that did see a difference. I am not the 0.01%.

I will say, I can shoot. In my experience, you can group tune arrows, but unless your bow is very out of tune, you should be able to set it to spec with the intended cam lean and center shot position and shoot it with field points. The difference in accuracy in field points between a super tuned setup and a well eyeballed setup for me is so minimal that I have to be analytical to see it. Just shooting and anecdotally observing, they are the same. That means a lot of time and energy for a very small gain. If you are in the camp where 1/64" could make the difference between winning and losing a substantial sum of money, it MIGHT be worth it. For casual shooting and hunting, it is not worth it for me personally. For my hunting bows, I get a decent tear and then broadhead tune. For 3d and indoor, I set up the bow to measurements and shoot. If it seems like there is a problem then I will paper tune and maybe bareshaft tune to flush it out. I don't shoot fita, but I would think that is the "benchrest shooting" of the archery world.

The harsh reality, for most, better technique from more practice will shoot better than the little bit that can be gained from endless super tuning every time.
 
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fulldraw71
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In my experience, most of the supertuning techniques are not noticeable by 99.9% of archers. I will not say 100% because there might be someone that did see a difference. I am not the 0.01%.

I will say, I can shoot. In my experience, you can group tune arrows, but unless your bow is very out of tune, you should be able to set it to spec with the intended cam lean and center shot position and shoot it with field points. The difference in accuracy in field points between a super tuned setup and a well eyeballed setup for me is so minimal that I have to be analytical to see it. Just shooting and anecdotally observing, they are the same. That means a lot of time and energy for a very small gain. If you are in the camp where 1/64" could make the difference between winning and losing a substantial sum of money, it MIGHT be worth it. For casual shooting and hunting, it is not worth it for me personally. For my hunting bows, I get a decent tear and then broadhead tune. For 3d and indoor, I set up the bow to measurements and shoot. If it seems like there is a problem then I will paper tune and maybe bareshaft tune to flush it out. I don't shoot fita, but I would think that is the "benchrest shooting" of the archery world.

The harsh reality, for most, better technique from more practice will shoot better than the little bit that can be gained from endless super tuning every time.
I wouldn’t have even started this thread if the tech at the shop Saturday hadn’t brought it up when he was tuning my new bow. I brought in new arrows built myself, 300 spine Easton 6.5 match grade with 4 fletch on a wrap. The issue was I am left-handed and like most archers he was right. But this guy is a veteran and he’s been at it for a while. He did admit to me that he is right handed, but he has technically never had an issue paper tuning a left-handed bow for a customer. That doesn’t mean that switching hands may not have been affecting something. But he was able to get a perfect bullet hole with one of his random shafts and mine it was close. Then he looked at me and said I bet I know why. he claimed the Eastern logo needed to be at the top that was where Easton‘s spine was on the shaft. He asked me when I built those arrows if I spine matched them with the fletching and I replied no I just threw them in my jig and fletched them up. Then he rotated the nock so that the Easton logo was at the top, and it started tearing better. He had me nock align the remaining arrows and a couple of them can’t be without a vane sticking straight inward, which would probably make contact with my cables. But at home all my shafts seem to fly good whether they are oriented this way or not. I guess we will find out when I screw on some fixed blade Broadhead this summer and see how they shoot.
 
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I wouldn’t have even started this thread if the tech at the shop Saturday hadn’t brought it up when he was tuning my new bow. I brought in new arrows built myself, 300 spine Easton 6.5 match grade with 4 fletch on a wrap. The issue was I am left-handed and like most archers he was right. But this guy is a veteran and he’s been at it for a while. He did admit to me that he is right handed, but he has technically never had an issue paper tuning a left-handed bow for a customer. That doesn’t mean that switching hands may not have been affecting something. But he was able to get a perfect bullet hole with one of his random shafts and mine it was close. Then he looked at me and said I bet I know why. he claimed the Eastern logo needed to be at the top that was where Easton‘s spine was on the shaft. He asked me when I built those arrows if I spine matched them with the fletching and I replied no I just threw them in my jig and fletched them up. Then he rotated the nock so that the Easton logo was at the top, and it started tearing better. He had me nock align the remaining arrows and a couple of them can’t be without a vane sticking straight inward, which would probably make contact with my cables. But at home all my shafts seem to fly good whether they are oriented this way or not. I guess we will find out when I screw on some fixed blade Broadhead this summer and see how they shoot.
What bow?

You shouldn't be having cable clearance issues if the rest is set at center shot...

What's your center shot?

I've tested spine aligning with fletching and it does not prevent you from having to nock tune for fixed heads.
 

wapitibob

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How the arrow comes out of the bow is what makes the difference. Shoot bareshafts thru paper and rotate nocks till they all tear the same, then fletch; you're checking and orienting dynamic spine.
 
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he claimed the Eastern logo needed to be at the top that was where Easton‘s spine was on the shaft.

I dont know if there is any truth to this whatsoever.

Spine is a measurement of stiffness of an arrow shaft, more or less. Easton arrows, with acucarbon, do not have what youre thinking of...a seam. Other arrows have the seam, like Victory where they mark the seam to "spine align".

Since Easton use pulltrusion and weaves the carbon so theres no seam, I HIGHLY doubt they measure arrows and apply the label that way. You could still need to nock tune, and there could potentially still be some variances - much less than arrows with a seam - I just cant see Easton marketing their 'acucarbon' process, and then going through the trouble to find minor variances to the point where they mark every arrows with their logo as the indicator.
 
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OP
fulldraw71
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What bow?

You shouldn't be having cable clearance issues if the rest is set at center shot...

What's your center shot?

I've tested spine aligning with fletching and it does not prevent you from having to nock tune for fixed heads.
Hoyt alpha x. He told me they had tight cable clearances compared to some other bows. In fact one of the arrows of his own he was testing out if it to compare was fletched with blazers and at first he thought he might have been getting contact but then he ruled out that he didn’t think so. I’m pretty sure if you took a blazer fletched arrow and had the cock feather straight in at 9 o clock it would hit. I believe he’s got the center shot at 13/16. I can tell by eyeballing it that it is tighter than my old Martin Onza. So he must be right
 
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fulldraw71
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I dont know if there is any truth to this whatsoever.

Spine is a measurement of stiffness of an arrow shaft, more or less. Easton arrows, with acucarbon, do not have what youre thinking of...a seam. Other arrows have the seam, like Victory where they mark the seam to "spine aline".

Since Easton use pulltrusion and weaves the carbon so theres no seam, I HIGHLY doubt they measure arrows and apply the label that way. There could potentially still be some variances - much less than arrows with a seam - I just cant see Easton marketing their 'acucarbon' process, and then going through the trouble to find minor variances to the point where they mark every arrows with their logo as the indicator.
Thanks for clarifying this. I knew gold tips and other brands had that mark but didn’t realize Easton had something proprietary to their process. This is interesting
 
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Hoyt alpha x. He told me they had tight cable clearances compared to some other bows. In fact one of the arrows of his own he was testing out if it to compare was fletched with blazers and at first he thought he might have been getting contact but then he ruled out that he didn’t think so. I’m pretty sure if you took a blazer fletched arrow and had the cock feather straight in at 9 o clock it would hit. I believe he’s got the center shot at 13/16. I can tell by eyeballing it that it is tighter than my old Martin Onza. So he must be right
You need to measure your center shot. Will take you 1 min. Think your giving the bow tech too much credit in general. If the cams are shimmed correctly and you have good repeatable form you should be very close to center shot and should not have clearance issues.
 
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fulldraw71
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You need to measure your center shot. Will take you 1 min. Think you’re giving the bow tech too much credit in general. If the cams are shimmed correctly and you have good repeatable form you should be very close to center shot and should not have clearance issues.
Well, here’s the thing I’m not having clearance issues. All of my arrows are shooting great. I was asking about spine aligning when I get ready to fletch up some more shafts down the road. I wasn’t trying to get into an I’m having issues with my new bow thread. It just kind of migrated there when people start talking about nock tuning and I started wondering about where that nock might end up in relation to fletching orientation. I’ll go home and measure cause I’m curious, but the thing’s shooting great.
 

5MilesBack

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It just kind of migrated there when people start talking about nock tuning and I started wondering about where that nock might end up in relation to fletching orientation.
I have always used the same color fletching on every arrow I've ever owned. My old Bowtech Commander has the cables in full view in my sight guard......they are really close to the arrows. So my tall vanes have to sit with the cock vane turned to somewhere around 11 o'clock for the bottom left vane to clear the cables (LH bow). That still gives me two other nock tuning spots to try and still keep my fletching where it needs to be in relation to the cables. Or with 4-fletch of lower profile vanes, it really doesn't matter, they'll clear. And you have several nock tuning spots to try.
 
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I wouldn’t have even started this thread if the tech at the shop Saturday hadn’t brought it up when he was tuning my new bow. I brought in new arrows built myself, 300 spine Easton 6.5 match grade with 4 fletch on a wrap. The issue was I am left-handed and like most archers he was right. But this guy is a veteran and he’s been at it for a while. He did admit to me that he is right handed, but he has technically never had an issue paper tuning a left-handed bow for a customer. That doesn’t mean that switching hands may not have been affecting something. But he was able to get a perfect bullet hole with one of his random shafts and mine it was close. Then he looked at me and said I bet I know why. he claimed the Eastern logo needed to be at the top that was where Easton‘s spine was on the shaft. He asked me when I built those arrows if I spine matched them with the fletching and I replied no I just threw them in my jig and fletched them up. Then he rotated the nock so that the Easton logo was at the top, and it started tearing better. He had me nock align the remaining arrows and a couple of them can’t be without a vane sticking straight inward, which would probably make contact with my cables. But at home all my shafts seem to fly good whether they are oriented this way or not. I guess we will find out when I screw on some fixed blade Broadhead this summer and see how they shoot.
I wouldn't put much stock in what kind of paper tears you were seeing with someone else (wrong-handedly) shooting your bow with his arrows. What matters is what the bow does in your hand with your arrows. Someone else might be able to get you in the ballpark, but final tuning should be done with you shooting.

Shoot multiple arrows multiple times through paper and look for a consistent pattern to the tears. Once you're seeing consistent tears, adjust your cams, d-loop location, and/or rest as needed to get the rear of the arrow aligned with the front.

If there's no consistent tear pattern, either your grip/anchor are inconsistent or the arrows are inconsistent. Nock tuning might help if it's the latter problem. Choose one arrow at a time and shoot it through paper in each of the 4 possible nock positions. Stick with whatever nock position produces a tear most similar to your other arrows. Once you have all the arrows producing similar tears, adjust the cams, d-loop, and/or rest as needed to fix the tear.

Also keep in mind that paper tuning is just the first step to get you in the ballpark. Don't get too obsessed with achieving a perfect "bullet hole." Get it close then move on to broadhead tuning. You can also use bareshaft tuning as an intermediate step if you like, but broadheads hitting alongside field points is the ultimate goal (for a hunter).
 
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fulldraw71
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I wouldn't put much stock in what kind of paper tears you were seeing with someone else (wrong-handedly) shooting your bow with his arrows. What matters is what the bow does in your hand with your arrows. Someone else might be able to get you in the ballpark, but final tuning should be done with you shooting.

Shoot multiple arrows multiple times through paper and look for a consistent pattern to the tears. Once you're seeing consistent tears, adjust your cams, d-loop location, and/or rest as needed to get the rear of the arrow aligned with the front.

If there's no consistent tear pattern, either your grip/anchor are inconsistent or the arrows are inconsistent. Nock tuning might help if it's the latter problem. Choose one arrow at a time and shoot it through paper in each of the 4 possible nock positions. Stick with whatever nock position produces a tear most similar to your other arrows. Once you have all the arrows producing similar tears, adjust the cams, d-loop, and/or rest as needed to fix the tear.

Also keep in mind that paper tuning is just the first step to get you in the ballpark. Don't get too obsessed with achieving a perfect "bullet hole." Get it close then move on to broadhead tuning. You can also use bareshaft tuning as an intermediate step if you like, but broadheads hitting alongside field points is the ultimate goal (for a hunter).
Thank you. I’ve fletched plenty of arrows through the years but this whole spine alignment is something I just started hearing about in the last year. I’ve chosen to ignore it although I’ve fletched about 4 dozen shafts in the last 12 months. I was just curious. That’s why I posted.
 

Zac

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Thank you. I’ve fletched plenty of arrows through the years but this whole spine alignment is something I just started hearing about in the last year. I’ve chosen to ignore it although I’ve fletched about 4 dozen shafts in the last 12 months. I was just curious. That’s why I posted.
Just keep ignoring it. You have analysis paralysis. You said your bow shoots great, so just shoot it and stop worrying about it.
 
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I shoot all the arrows I build through paper as bareshafts at 7-10 feet. Rotate each nock until the tear is a perfect circle. Then I fletch according to how the nock on that arrow ended up. Don’t waste your time if the arrows don’t have good consistent spine tolerances.
Good arrows and doing this has taken out the random broadhead arrows that can’t be explained why they hit way out of a group or aim point.
I setup a fair number of friends and family members bows and this has improved each of their results broadheads and field points.
I won’t be changing regardless of what anyone else says because my experiences have shown me it’s worth the effort.
 

ddowning

Lil-Rokslider
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I shoot all the arrows I build through paper as bareshafts at 7-10 feet. Rotate each nock until the tear is a perfect circle. Then I fletch according to how the nock on that arrow ended up. Don’t waste your time if the arrows don’t have good consistent spine tolerances.
Good arrows and doing this has taken out the random broadhead arrows that can’t be explained why they hit way out of a group or aim point.
I setup a fair number of friends and family members bows and this has improved each of their results broadheads and field points.
I won’t be changing regardless of what anyone else says because my experiences have shown me it’s worth the effort.
You can accomplish the same thing with group tuning, and do it while you practice. I'm not saying I never twist a nock. I'm just saying I don't spend 2 afternoons shooting all of my arrows through paper. The arrows that group I leave alone. If something makes me question then I will turn a nock once in awhile to see if that helps.
 
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