Fence post installation? Concrete vs packed gravel

[Wetwork]

I have railroad ties I put in as a kid when I was thirteen that are still standing and still holding cattle in working corrals. I put them in, alone, in 1983. Just dirt, no rock, no clay, just sank them about three and a half feet down and tamped in good from the bottom up. Doom on anyone who has to replace a post set in concrete, or with rocks. The person who has to replace your concrete poured posts will hate, hate, hate you if its gettting replaced by hand. Rock, crete, or gravel is for town folk who can't build fence.-WW

 

[Azone]

How heavy is your gate going to be?

 

[*zap*]

You cannot stop what frost does unless the very bottom is below the frost line....if your going 3+ feet I would not worry about it to much. I believe the main enemies of fence posts are water and not being set deep enough. good luck with the project.

 

[Elite]

I have railroad ties I put in as a kid when I was thirteen that are still standing and still holding cattle in working corrals. I put them in, alone, in 1983. Just dirt, no rock, no clay, just sank them about three and a half feet down and tamped in good from the bottom up. Doom on anyone who has to replace a post set in concrete, or with rocks. The person who has to replace your concrete poured posts will hate, hate, hate you if its gettting replaced by hand. Rock, crete, or gravel is for town folk who can't build fence.-WW

Curious how concrete is for town folks who can’t build fences? It’s more expensive then just reusing the dirt?


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[*zap*]

Not that difficult to jack out a post set in concrete if you have the proper equipment and there is a big difference between field fence and privacy fence....

 

[wnelson14]

If you are really concerned just set metal posts deeper and more concrete where the gates will hang,

 

[Wetwork]

Curious how concrete is for town folks who can’t build fences? It’s more expensive then just reusing the dirt?


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When my GF was selling her house to move in with me on the ranch I had some privacy fence issues to fix up for her. The HOA wouldn't let me roll in heavy equipment and she was surrounded on all sides by neighbors. Pox on whoever needed to set the posts in crete. I had to build a mini derrick to pull the damn things out, then bust up the blocks. The posts had only been in the gound eight years and were rotting out. They were pressure treated. When the day comes you have to pull the posts for whatever reason you'll hate yourself spending that extra money for the crete. I consider fence posts as expendables that will have to be replaced at some point on your watch. I'd rather have a easy pulll in my later years than having to pay some guy to fix my fence. If its a quick fix and you arent going to live there long go with crete...WW

There's pros and cons for everything and I"m just pointing out possible long term cons. And yes dirt is free.

 

[Pony Soldier]

Actually one of the methods to keep mine timbers from rotting is to keep the wet . Especially shaft timbers.

I think that there is a lack of bacteria at this elevation. The hillsides are covered with stumps of pine trees that were cut in the 1890s. Wood crumbles but rarely rots.

Those 70 year old posts were treated (probably with motor oil) and show no degradation. The top tends to crumble. My biggest problem comes with steel posts. The moose tend to break them off at ground level when it is -40 or -50.

Ties for corner posts are for eternity. Nobody uses either gravel or concrete for posts. Would a cement pedistal with a steel appliance to attach a treated post might be an option in caustic soil to wood.

 

[jayhawk]

I think Zap is right. go only 2-3ft down, add shallow bed of gravel, set the post in concrete, then backfill.

I don't think I'd worry about "heaving" with the frostline. Most homes I've seen in the mountains sat on a floating foundation. i.e. posts in concrete. This allowed movement, whereas a foundation or footer would've cracked and fallen apart.

 

[Randle]

WW, did you put fully treated ugly ole railroad ties in for the GF fence?
Theres a big difference. in his fencing needs and your ranch
OP I have done both gravel in the bottom for drainage and then concrete only aroung the outside of the post
or just gravel in the hole after setting the post level as you go .
City folks use a tire and chain and truck to pull posts as needed

 

[Aluminum Rain]

Many folks use regular treated limber for post instead of ground contact treated. They are not the same and the regular treated will eventually rot. Im in the camp of never using concrete. Just unneeded and expensive.

 

[Wetwork]

WW, did you put fully treated ugly ole railroad ties in for the GF fence?
Theres a big difference. in his fencing needs and your ranch
OP I have done both gravel in the bottom for drainage and then concrete only aroung the outside of the post
or just gravel in the hole after setting the post level as you go .
City folks use a tire and chain and truck to pull posts as needed

No RR ties in the HOA...to ugly. It was a privacy fence in the back yard of the GF's and really narrow on the edges of the house. So I couldn't come in from behind or on the sides to work on stuff. Her 850 Sportman couldn't pull them either and I did a straight up pull using a 4x4 post with the chain draped over the top as I tried to pull forward. This was after watering the ground for a week. Just bad luck, I'm a big fan of heavy equipment. Her place was the first one built and soon she had neighbors all around her and a HOA.....luckily she found me and got to move back to the mountains. If I was a SB I would have dug down and cut off the posts and buried the holes but then everything would have been off and stuff like that makes me cringe.-WW

 

[Pony Soldier]

I have heard of pulling posts by putting a chain at ground level but then running it over a wheel rim before attaching it to the truck.

I have also seen them jacked out of the ground using a high lift jack.

Although I understand frost heaving, half of my house has a foundation of 6 inches with one cinder block between that and the logs. The other half of the house has a 4 ft frost wall foundation. I don't see movement between the two. That is likely from the fact that the ground is freeze dried before snowed in. I have pumps under the house that keep the ground water under control in the spring but by July its bone dry. It's a radical environment.

 

[grfox92]

Concrete the hing post on doors and tamp everything else.

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[rojocop]

Concrete will last years and years.. upwards of 25 to 30 years in good condition. And reasonable condition for up to 35 or 40 years probably.

The issue is probably if for whatever reason you need to move a fence post. That's a pain for concrete and you going to need help/professionals to do it cleanly.

Wood or gravel etc looks good for 10 years but then it's going to start falling apart without serious maintenance.