Differences in Dall, Stone, RM Bighorn, D Bighorn hunts

[HornPorn]

I would try and find stone outfit in the Yukon or NWT. they appeal the most to me for some reason. That part of Canada seems the most remote too

There are no stones in the NWT. A Fannin yes

Yukon does have some stones

Quintessential stone sheep hunt would be northern British Columbia

 

[WVELK]

As to the preferred sheep hunt it definitely depends on your goals- Do you want the hunt to be successful? or is the adventure the most important part? Is the trophy itself the most important?


Personally I would say a September Stone sheep may be the best! The most beautiful sheep, longer hair in Sept and great country and the leaves changing. Every sheep has individual coloration. The hunts are usually horseback or backpack. On average the horns are a bit heavier than Dalls. Be careful who you go with, not a slam dunk or guaranteed hunt…

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Second I would go for Dall’s sheep. A full curl Dalls is amazing, a great trophy. The far north and the rugged country they live in to me is the iconic “sheep hunt” it is often the first and only sheep hunt most go on. Historically it was the cheapest and relatively successful option. Unfortunately Dall’s population have plummeted raising prices and killing success rates - especially in Alaska. IMO the best Dall’s hunts are in NWT where numbers are still good and Helicopter access is an absolute game changer- success rates are very high. Very different than my first successful Dall's hunt in AK which was walk-in Solo!

Rocky Mt bighorn has become very expensive and difficult to get a tag. I was lucky to draw a Colorado archery tag and kill one. I like the mountains the Rockies live in better than the country most Cali bighorns are found. Rockies are bigger on average as well. Hunting in the area I lived was nice to scout etc, but wasn’t quite the trip or remoteness the far north sheep provide.

Desert Bighorn- I have not hunted yet, (will soon) I guess I am not drawn to the desert- have been many times and even lived on the northern border of desert sheep (Colorado monument) the spectrum of hunts is wide- easy to super tough. Mexico is a mixed bag but the game ranching (and subsequent releases to the wild to supplement the free range populations) has kept the prices in check. Has also increased the horn size and accessibility to the sheep- depending on where you hunt.

This is excellent as are other responses. Thanks to all. I have been doing some research and reached out to some contacts. To answer your first question, harvesting a ram is the most important to me. I am not proud of that response, but it is an honest one. I have had many adventures in my life, but never sheep hunted.

I am meeting with someone regarding a Dall sheep next week. It would be in BC in September. That is certainly an option. However, I am really starting to lean toward a Stone as being my preferred choice only because I don’t think there are a lot of California or Rocky Big Horn options. I have someone close checking on those for me currently. If that chip fell into place that would be my preferred choice, but honestly I am blessed to even be in a position to consider any sheep hunt. So any of those three should be taken if it is the right opportunity.

Couple questions for all: 1. I am having a hard time understanding why Dall’s in NWT are preferred over BC, so why the preference for NWT? 2. What area is preferred for Stone? BC????

 

[HornPorn]

This is excellent as are other responses. Thanks to all. I have been doing some research and reached out to some contacts. To answer your first question, harvesting a ram is the most important to me. I am not proud of that response, but it is an honest one. I have had many adventures in my life, but never sheep hunted.

I am meeting with someone regarding a Dall sheep next week. It would be in BC in September. That is certainly an option. However, I am really starting to lean toward a Stone as being my preferred choice only because I don’t think there are a lot of California or Rocky Big Horn options. I have someone close checking on those for me currently. If that chip fell into place that would be my preferred choice, but honestly I am blessed to even be in a position to consider any sheep hunt. So any of those three should be taken if it is the right opportunity.

Couple questions for all: 1. I am having a hard time understanding why Dall’s in NWT are preferred over BC, so why the preference for NWT? 2. What area is preferred for Stone? BC????

The most sure thing for a North American sheep hunt north of the US is probably the Cali bighorn hunts. You usually take your ram in 2-3 days, but they cost $150K.

After that the desert hunts in New Mexico seem to be a layup

After that dall sheep. If you are in shape and can shoot, you will get a dall in the NWT

Stones are lower success rate than dalls, but much better than Rocky bighorns

Rocky bighorns are a 10% or less prospect in Alberta, but if you can a tag in BC those are higher success rate

 

[Steve O]

This is excellent as are other responses. Thanks to all. I have been doing some research and reached out to some contacts. To answer your first question, harvesting a ram is the most important to me. I am not proud of that response, but it is an honest one. I have had many adventures in my life, but never sheep hunted.

I am meeting with someone regarding a Dall sheep next week. It would be in BC in September. That is certainly an option. However, I am really starting to lean toward a Stone as being my preferred choice only because I don’t think there are a lot of California or Rocky Big Horn options. I have someone close checking on those for me currently. If that chip fell into place that would be my preferred choice, but honestly I am blessed to even be in a position to consider any sheep hunt. So any of those three should be taken if it is the right opportunity.

Couple questions for all: 1. I am having a hard time understanding why Dall’s in NWT are preferred over BC, so why the preference for NWT? 2. What area is preferred for Stone? BC????

All NWT has is Dalls. There are very limited options for Dall in BC.

BC is the heart of Stone sheep territory. They are pure in BC.

 

[WVELK]

The most sure thing for a North American sheep hunt north of the US is probably the Cali bighorn hunts. You usually take your ram in 2-3 days, but they cost $150K.

After that the desert hunts in New Mexico seem to be a layup

After that dall sheep. If you are in shape and can shoot, you will get a dall in the NWT

Stones are lower success rate than dalls, but much better than Rocky bighorns

Rocky bighorns are a 10% or less prospect in Alberta, but if you can a tag in BC those are higher success rate

Interesting. Why are the Cali bighorns more likely to be taken.

My one contact is checking on a BC Rocky Mtn Bighorn tag for BC. Your statement makes me feel great if that tag comes through.

I know elk, but not sheep. I can tell you all have spent time and time again educating yourself on sheep.

 

[cuerro viejo]

Spending my money is exactly what I want the members to do. Why would you pick Stone?

It’s the one that will continue to jump the most price wise as it’s the smallest number of tags a year

 

[cuerro viejo]

Interesting. Why are the Cali bighorns more likely to be taken.

My one contact is checking on a BC Rocky Mtn Bighorn tag for BC. Your statement makes me feel great if that tag comes through.

I know elk, but not sheep. I can tell you all have spent time and time again educating yourself on sheep.

Take Idaho for example the cali’s are southern part in the lower country. Compared to the RMBH that are at or above tree line.

Cali is like a mid mountain sheep.

You can find BH tags from 100-120k in CO and some of the NM Reservations.

 

[Sully_44]

I’m very interested in getting a slam someday, but realize that’s going to take making an ungodly amount of money. If I was in your situation and I didn’t necessarily care about what species I killed, I think I’d choose Dalls. Simply because that’s the type of country I think about when I think of sheep hunting. AND, if you can afford to do a stone hunt, then you can afford to do 2-3 dall hunts. I’d pick my top 3 dall destinations and spread them out every 3-5 years. Go hunt 3 times in the north country for the same price as a stone hunt and end your sheep career with ~40+ days of sheep hunting, and potentially 3 rams vs. ~20 days and potentially 1 ram.

 

[Sandbrew]

I love spending other peoples money - But be forewarned I have found this quote and pearl of wisdom from Jack O'Conner to be true for me.

"There is no half way. After his first exposure, a man is either a sheep hunter or he isn’t. He either falls under the spell of sheep hunting and sheep country or he won’t be caught dead on another sheep mountain."

”The Bighorn,” March 1960

I am always searching for a way to go on my next sheep hunt since my first archery ram hunt in 2000. After I harvested my first ram I was hooked. Since then I have been on 3 more Rocky Mountain Bighorn hunts a Dall hunt and 2 Stone hunts of my own. I have tagged along or helped family and friends on at least 15 more sheep hunts. I have probably spent a sheep hunt worth of dollars on raffle tickets chasing my next adventure and my Grand Slam/FNAWS. If it was me and I could only go on one more sheep hunt I would chose a British Columbia or Yukon multispecies hunt with a stone sheep as a primary target and a pocketful of tags for everything else incase we filled early.

 

[Scottf270]

I would do a Dall hunt in the NWT and a for sure free range hunt in Mexico for desert big horn. No way I'd drop $100,000 with worse odds on a stone.

 

[WVELK]

I’m very interested in getting a slam someday, but realize that’s going to take making an ungodly amount of money. If I was in your situation and I didn’t necessarily care about what species I killed, I think I’d choose Dalls. Simply because that’s the type of country I think about when I think of sheep hunting. AND, if you can afford to do a stone hunt, then you can afford to do 2-3 dall hunts. I’d pick my top 3 dall destinations and spread them out every 3-5 years. Go hunt 3 times in the north country for the same price as a stone hunt and end your sheep career with ~40+ days of sheep hunting, and potentially 3 rams vs. ~20 days and potentially 1 ram.

That is not bad logic and I do hate to waste money even though I could afford to do all 4 in two years if the tags were available. Once can’t forget where he or she started. I think this forum is the best on the net by far, and this sheep subclass of the forum may be the best out there. Thanks again and again for the input. It is all valuable.

 

[WVELK]

Let me ask the group this question. Many of you talk about the odds of getting a stone, or odds of getting a Dall, or some other odds. Where, generally, are you pulling your data from on the net? Or, some other source. Odds are very important to me. I have never backed away from a challenge. Heck they told my mother there was not need to get a sports physical for me in college I would not live to graduate. 38 years later I am still here. However, I am not stupid either and I have no interest in trying to beat impossible odds. The glaring example is where folks write about outfitters selling more hunts than are legal rams in the unit or their concession. That is a no for me.

 

[wyosteve]

Since you mentioned Dall in BC, just be aware there is only a very small area in NW BC that has Dalls.

 

[wildwilderness]

Probably too late for this year but anyone not familiar or experienced with sheep hunting would benefit from going to Sheep Show in Reno. Can talk to outfitter and other hunters. See what sheep fever does to people! Starts in a couple days Jan 16-18

 

[Sandbrew]

Let me ask the group this question. Many of you talk about the odds of getting a stone, or odds of getting a Dall, or some other odds. Where, generally, are you pulling your data from on the net? Or, some other source. Odds are very important to me. I have never backed away from a challenge. Heck they told my mother there was not need to get a sports physical for me in college I would not live to graduate. 38 years later I am still here. However, I am not stupid either and I have no interest in trying to beat impossible odds. The glaring example is where folks write about outfitters selling more hunts than are legal rams in the unit or their concession. That is a no for me.

Odds on success vary greatly on many of these Stone and Dall hunts. It took me 2 Stone hunts to kill my ram. My first hunt was a last minute cancellation that took me from a phone call in Colorado to Toad River BC on horse in 4 days. I endured 12 days of some of the worst rain in flooding Northern BC had seen on decades. I had 2 close calls with rams at under 200 yards but the guide could not confirm age. I ended up in a precarious shooting position with the green light to shoot once the ram turned broadside at 254 yards and missed the shot on day 11 of 12 on the only legal ram we saw. I had booked a return flight 4 days post hunt so I would not be rushed and even tried to get a guide to take me on a quick one or 2 day overnight backpack trip for a final chance at a ram and that didn't work out. I staying in touch with the outfitter and he called me a couple years later with another cancelation hunt knowing I could handle the terrain and would be a good client to invite back I killed my ram on day 5 of that hunt. I know another very experienced mountain hunter that took 3 Dall hunts and 3 Stone hunts to kill his rams and he and I talk about these factors often. Control what you can and keep a positive mental attitude no matter what. This is the hardest thing to train for unless you can put yourself in stressful & uncomfortable situations and learn for them.

The key factors depending on the year are overall conditions - Weather plays a huge part in not only your success but the chances of find a suitable mature ram to attempt to harvest. Rain, fog, smoke, heat, snow, and cold all factor in...I know it's a sheep hunt you can except all or none of those conditions in a given year and sometimes on a given hunt. Your guide or outfitter has ZERO control over the weather so be prepared and stay long enough to give the weather a chance to clear. Don't quit because of bad weather - deal with it and tough it out.

The outfitter also has NO control over population fluctuations and animal movement. They should have a decent idea of what the long term conditions in a given area are and a good question to ask is- What is the long term average population in your area and are are the sheep doing good or bad compared to other years? Are mature rams on the increase or decrease? Choose wisely a long term outfitter will know where to go and where the animal have gone or have a large enough area to move you to a better location if needed.

The things you do have control over you need to commit to making this the best hunt of your life. Be in top shape and be honest what that means for you. Don't tell them you can hike 10 miles with 70 pounds if you've never done it before. Don't tell them you can climb mountain if you are afraid of heights. BE HONEST and don't quit! Have a good attitude no matter what the mountains throw at you and the guide and outfitter should do the same to get you a trophy.

 

[FAAFO]

I started sheep hunting at 42. My last sheep hunt I was 59 (and it was by far the toughest hunt of all). Being in shape is definitely a factor that will increase your odds. Just like knowing your rifle, knowing your way around horses, knowing your gear, etc….

That said, there is probably more macho BS spewed about needing to be an uber-Ironman in sheep hunting than in any other type of hunting. I have never been an athlete. I do some physical preparation for my hunts, but nothing like many will say is required. I have seen super fit guys give up the ghost and also seen old men keep it slow and steady without one word of complaint. A positive attitude and the will to keep going when things get tough is way more important than being Cam Hanes IMO.

Of course, on a straight up backpack hunt being in top physical condition does move to the forefront.

Let me guess. Horseback hunts? . Or helicopter?

 

[Folically_Challenged]

The price considerations are 100% valid: it's stupid expensive now, and will only go up from here. Unfortunately, that's just the price of admission these days.

With a Dall and Bighorn to my credit so far, my $.02 is that the outfitter you select will have a major impact on your odds of success. I was fortunate to have hunted with guides & outfitters who were respectful of their territory (didn't overbook), and relentless in the pursuit of a ram.

I lucked-into both outfits, going with my gut & grilling their references: I didn't start with any qualified recommendations. When booking a stone hunt for '25, I started with the recommendations of the outfitter from the '24 Bighorn hunt, and I feel strongly they steered me right.

I've never been to the sheep show or DSC/SCI, but will be going to Nashville next week. It makes sense to get a feeling for as many outfitters as possible. As an earlier poster quoted JO'C, after taking the ram last fall, there's no going back for me now. I'm a sheep hunter.

Good Luck,

FC

 

[Mojave]

If I was blowing $200,000 on hunting in one year. This would be my answer:

Kazakstan maral, ibex and roe deer
Yukon or NWT, caribou, moose, goat hopefully some bears
Kodiak goat
New Zealand tahr, chamois stags with multiples of each
With what was left I would hunt in Slovenia

 

[Shortround]

I’m thinking I wasn’t exactly clear in my earlier post why I’d recommend two dall hunts as opposed to Canada bighorn or stones and just sounded like I was making the recommendation on price, when really it’s about the experience you’ll have on either hunt. I’ll explain.

Pressure on bighorns and stones have increased to the point where most of them are shot the first year they’re legal. At the same time as prices have increased, outfitters are under more pressure to keep their success rates high so they can continue to sell their available hunts at a premium. Under increased pressure situations, sheep spend more time in the timber, only coming out onto open slopes around dawn and dusk to feed. This primarily applies to the mature rams hunters are targeting of course. As well, as prices have increased, the type of hunter on these expensive hunts has changed— they’re mostly much older, wealthier and less fit than say in the 90s.

As a result, to be successful on rarer, smarter rams with hunters who may only have one climb in them on a two week hunt, stone and bighorn outfitters are hunting sheep more like whitetail — they set you up in a spot where sheep are likely to show up sometime, somewhere close to a camp and accessible via horse, and you sit and wait for a sheep to show up, or just pop out of the buckbrush. It works. It especially works for an old guy who can’t ride and climb every day for a 14 day hunt, and it also keeps sheep from being spooked out of the easy hunt areas so you don’t screw up the next month of hunts you’ve got booked. And it works when you’ve got resident hunters running around on every ridge sky lining themselves all day. But it’s boring as hell.

The fun part of the the sheep experience is climbing every day, seeing new country every day, hanging out above treeline and seeing how much country you can get to. But that’s not what the average sheep hunter wants now. He’s rich, he’s old, it’s costing him money each day he doesn’t have email. He wants to tag out quick and get home, and that’s what the outfitters are set up to provide nowadays.

Dalls are different still, though it’s heading that way with heli hunts. Way less resident pressure, less brush and timber and they don’t use it as much, they’re white so easier to spot and there’s enough of them around so there’s less pressure to kill the first legal ram you see. The country is wilder too. So you can still do a 12 day hunt and get to hunt each day, not just ride out to the glassing rock every day for a week until a squeaker pokes his head out above treeline and you go scrambling off to get him. Probably with a second guide on a two way radio walking you in on him. Which to me, is a terrible way to spend $100,000.

 

[adamkolesar]

This is frighteningly on point...