Difference between Defiance actions

[TxLite]

Defiance is owned by Mike Goguen...he bought them when he bought PROOF Research. He is a billionaire VC with his roots in Google.
They make a fine action and one of the best ways to compare them is with their action comparator.

https://defiancemachine.com/actions/

I thought Bob Beck bought Defiance a few years ago?

 

[madcalfe]

the anti has guaranteed head spacing.
and shit I just noticed they're making a titanium anti action now.

 

[Article 4]

For me, two reasons. One or both of which aren't as rational as I'd like to say they are.

1. When I think of prefit barrels on a custom action, I instantly think of Impact because they're the ones that popularized prefits on custom R700 actions. They have by far the widest selection of prefits and, even though it's not that relevant, by far the most people in the PRS using prefits with their actions.

2. It's still in my brain that Defiance actions just aren't as reliable in adverse conditions compared to other actions. Years ago that was probably more true, especially with their Deviant line of actions which was famous for being unable to handle grit. These days, especially if the anTi/Classic are hunting oriented actions, I assume they've changed their tolerances for better reliability. But those early years really make my brain exclude them from any consideration for basically any purpose. As irrational as it probably is.

There is probably something to point 2 for sure.
They were famous for super tight tolerances for many years and they still hold true however the raceways should not be built to benchrest tolerances for a hunting action. Grit and field conditions demand that there be "room to move" for the lugs on the raceways and when the action is in full battery. This may only be another thou or 5/10,000 but it should be there - especially if you are going to coat your action

 

[BBob]

I thought Bob Beck bought Defiance a few years ago?

 

[Article 4]

I thought Bob Beck bought Defiance a few years ago?

He did, that should have been owned and not owns. Mike bought 4 companies at the time:

• Defiance Machine
• Lawrence Barrels
• ABS Barrel Systems
• Wolf Stocks

All of these became PROOF in about 2010 along with a top secret resin company out of Ohio who is making the barrel resins for their carbon barrels in 2014 or so.

 

[Badseed]

There is probably something to point 2 for sure.
They were famous for super tight tolerances for many years and they still hold true however the raceways should not be built to benchrest tolerances for a hunting action. Grit and field conditions demand that there be "room to move" for the lugs on the raceways and when the action is in full battery. This may only be another thou or 5/10,000 but it should be there - especially if you are going to coat your action

I have heard that Defiance made some changes to action clearances to resolve the grit issues. Originally a customer would have to request the additional clearances but now it is supposed to be common to the actions. Perhaps someone that knows better will have more detail than that.


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[BBob]

When did Goguen buy Defiance? Glen Harrison Defiance’s founder was still listed as the owner up until the sale to Extreme/Beck.

 

[JohnJohnson]

I have heard that Defiance made some changes to action clearances to resolve the grit issues. Originally a customer would have to request the additional clearances but now it is supposed to be common to the actions. Perhaps someone that knows better will have more detail than that.


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From Defiance's FAQ. So if you want to err on the side of caution look for a 0.697" bolt I suppose.

 

[Article 4]

When did Goguen buy Defiance? Glen Harrison Defiance’s founder was still listed as the owner up until the sale to Extreme/Beck.

Beck is very smart, hope he does some great things with Defiance

Negative, to my personal knowledge....Glen was listed as founder and other titles however Mike bought the company in the same fashion as he did the others. He remained silent in the background letting them all run as founders and owners however Mike owned controlling interest in them all
Over time, he 'laid off" many of the founding partners when he deemed them to be out of use...including Jeff Lawrence, Mike Degerness, and others but Glen and others stayed on.