Deer cartridges with minimal recoil

[nubbin]

The issue is he has a specific criteria he wants to meet, low recoiling round, wood stock bolt action, with lots of factory offerings, and everyone is suggesting wild cat cartridges that have minimal factory offerings. He wants a plane Jane wood stocked low recoiling hunting set up that he can find on the shelf with plenty of availability. The easy button on this is .243. Doesn’t matter how deep into the data you want to put under the microscope, the .243 has been a popular deer cartridge for almost 70 years. Go buy a wood stocked rifle that you like in .243 with a 3-9x40 scope and go shoot deer in the vitals and enjoy your time outside.

 

[bnsafe]

Like already stated go buy whatever you like and enjoy it. All the the calibers mentioned will work fine.
Fwiw, I have cervical issues also and my 308 hurts my neck. I bought a very cheap 6 arc upper, threw it on a lower I had around, bought some 108 eldm, and went hunting. The doe I shot left the largest blood trail Ive had in years maybe ever for about 50 yds and died. The recoil didnt bother my neck at all, zero. Hopefully this year I will get it suppressed dropping the felt recoil down even more even tho its already fine. My shots are 150 max, gun shoots minute of deer all day long, and was extremely cheap. Its just a joy to shoot.

 

[Deere_Man]

Good to know about the wood Tikkas. Thank you. The price on that one is $1,179, which is a good bit over my budget. I do really like the Winchester Supergrades, but also over budget. I believe the Ruger Mark II was replaced by the Hawkeye...also really nice guns.

Any thoughts on these Howas with the premium walnut, or the 1500/Vanguards in general?

View attachment 829113

The non stainless Tikka Hunter with walnut is cheaper. I really like the Howa rifles that I own, especially the mini action 6.5 Grendel with the aftermarket Jefferson Outdoors hinged floor plate. That rifle comes in Walnut as well as 6mm ARC, which is a little better choice for your intended use, I think.

 

[KyleR1985]

He wants a plane Jane wood stocked low recoiling hunting set up that he can find on the shelf with plenty of availability.

I generally agree that a .243 meets the need.

And we could all jump to the conclusion you did.


Only problem is there’s literally a rifle designed to fill this literal niche. With minimum force necessary. And factory ammo. In the brand of rifle he’s considering. It suits small shooters, folks with disabilities and impairments, recoil sensitive shooters, shooters in a tree stand or box blind.

That he isn’t considering the 6ARC in Howa mini wood stock, which literally checks every box, with zero meat left on the bone, tells the story.

I don’t think he wants a rifle. I think he wants a campfire debate with his buddies about the good ole days and knockdown.

 

[S-3 ranch]

One of my most memorable accurate rifle I have had was a Remington BDL .243win , consistent .6 moa with just about any 100gr ammunition
Only gun I could consistently shoot that good because the light recoil
0-300 yards it was a point and shoot death machine,
Remington
Sako or tikka
Can’t go wrong on accuracy imo

 

[bbell]

Ok I have a fairly direct comparison for you. I just put together a 6mm arc shooting 108ELDM bullets with no suppressor and a month ago I shot a roe deer with the 243 suppressed shooting 90 grain soft points. Not measured, but perceived recoil was less with a 6mm arc but very little muzzle blast having the suppressor on the 243.

Inside of 300 yards it doesn’t matter which one you pick. Just pick the one you like and go hunt.

 

[nubbin]

I generally agree that a .243 meets the need.

And we could all jump to the conclusion you did.


Only problem is there’s literally a rifle designed to fill this literal niche. With minimum force necessary. And factory ammo. In the brand of rifle he’s considering. It suits small shooters, folks with disabilities and impairments, recoil sensitive shooters, shooters in a tree stand or box blind.

That he isn’t considering the 6ARC in Howa mini wood stock, which literally checks every box, with zero meat left on the bone, tells the story.

I don’t think he wants a rifle. I think he wants a campfire debate with his buddies about the good ole days and knockdown.

Does it check every box though? One of his criteria is a good amount of factory offerings with accessibility. You can walk into any store that sells ammunition (bass pro, academy, Walmart, pawn shops, etc) and find .243 ammo. But that won’t be the case for 6mm ARC

 

[Skydog]

Let's do a "check box" analysis for my stated purposes and platform:

1) Ballistics: Tie. Either cartridge will effectively kill deer out to 300 yards. (But the .243 does have a slight advantage).
2) Factory ammo options/availability: .243 wins this category hands down.
3) Off the shelf factory rifle options/availability: .243 easily wins this category as well. Case in point...the Howa Super Deluxe Walnut, Weatherby Vanguard Walnut Sporter, Browning X-bolt Hunter, etc. don't even offer the 6ARC.
4) Track record: .243 easily wins this category as well. It's been around for 70 years. Sure, the 6ARC is cool and trendy now...but will it still be around in 5 years, 10, 15? The .243 is not going anywhere.
5) Recoil: This one goes to the 6ARC by around 25% which equates to about 1.5 to 2 ft-lbs of recoil difference.

So, the .243 is the clear winner in every category except recoil, where the 6ARC has about a 2 ft-lb. advantage.

The question then becomes...is it really worth giving up all the benefits/advantages of the .243 for a couple ft-lbs difference in recoil? I'm not convinced that it is.

It's odd that I've been accused of splitting hairs, but the whole argument for the 6ARC hangs on a mere difference of 2 ft-lbs. or less difference in recoil.

 

[Skydog]

That he isn’t considering the 6ARC in Howa mini wood stock, which literally checks every box, with zero meat left on the bone, tells the story.

I don’t think he wants a rifle. I think he wants a campfire debate with his buddies about the good ole days and knockdown.

LOL...the folks I share campfires with have never even heard of the 6ARC. But the .243 would easily win that campfire debate. See post above.

 

[KyleR1985]

6mm arc is as available, and in many cases cheaper, than .243.

Can you find .243 if you forgot your ammo at home? Sure, 5 more flavors available for sure. But it’s not a sure thing. Nothing is.

And you’re not randomly choosing bullets to shoot in a Walmart in middle of nowhere. You’re picking a bullet and shooting it.


Maybe I’m a weirdo though, and start at the deer (the bullet I want), work backwards from there to brass, or factory Ammo, THEN the gun to shoot it.

I’m buying enough ammo to support me being in weird places with my gun to kill deer.

I’ve never not had ammo because I forgot it or because a store sold out and I couldn’t go hunting.

Like you said - campfire .243 is the answer. And why the thread isn’t about buying a rifle.

 

[czgunner]

6.8SPC, any of the ARC cartridges, 6.5 Grendel


Sent from my Pixel 3 using Tapatalk

 

[Southernfried]

I may have missed it, but what is OP's inherited Tikka chambered in? If ya like wood, just drop it into a Boyds stock from 190 to 290 till ya figure it out? Boyds

 

[Skydog]

the thread isn’t about buying a rifle

You keep assuming this...but the fact is that the thread is about buying a rifle...I just haven't found the arguments in favor of the 6ARC to be convincing.

 

[Skydog]

I may have missed it, but what is OP's inherited Tikka chambered in? If ya like wood, just drop it into a Boyds stock from 190 to 290 till ya figure it out? Boyds

300 Win Mag...not exactly a low recoil option.

 

[Skydog]

Maybe I’m a weirdo though, and start at the deer (the bullet I want), work backwards from there to brass, or factory Ammo, THEN the gun to shoot it.

So...you start with a specific bullet, work backwards, and use that one specific bullet as the foundation for your entire setup?

What happens when you find out that bullet has been discontinued or the best it will do in your gun is 4 inch groups?

I like having lots of options...

 

[Marshfly]

So...you start with a specific bullet, work backwards, and use that one specific bullet as the foundation for your entire setup?

What happens when you find out that bullet has been discontinued or the best it will do in your gun is 4 inch groups?

I like having lots of options...

Yes. That is exactly how most people should be designing a killing system.

You don't buy something and hope it shoots an acceptable bullet. That's how you end up with random loads that get discontinued. Like you fear.

Hornady is not discontinuing factory loads of ELDM or ELDX for anything....ever. ESPECIALLY the 6ARC which they themselves designed. And they are available everywhere I shop. Literally every place that carries ammo here in Missoula has 6ARC in 108 ELDM. But I doubt they all carry the same flavor of 243. So the odds of you finding that single bullet your 243 likes because you forgot ammo is low. (Who forgets ammo? People do that? Do those same people forget arrows on bowhunting trips too?)

You want people here to tell you to buy a Howa 1500 243. You are looking for validation, not advice. Ok. Go buy a Howa 1500 243.
Don't consider any of the other recommended options that actually are better for your needs of ultra low recoil with effective deer killing. Just buy what you wanted to in the first place.

 

[KyleR1985]

Reminder that the 6ARC was designed to professionally kill deer sized critters.

Edit: after the .243 had already been around 70 years. Strange right?

 

[Unckebob]

Yes. That is exactly how most people should be designing a killing system.

You don't buy something and hope it shoots an acceptable bullet. That's how you end up with random loads that get discontinued. Like you fear.

Hornady is not discontinuing factory loads of ELDM or ELDX for anything....ever. ESPECIALLY the 6ARC which they themselves designed. And they are available everywhere I shop. Literally every place that carries ammo here in Missoula has 6ARC in 108 ELDM. But I doubt they all carry the same flavor of 243. So the odds of you finding that single bullet your 243 likes because you forgot ammo is low. (Who forgets ammo? People do that? Do those same people forget arrows on bowhunting trips too?)

You want people here to tell you to buy a Howa 1500 243. You are looking for validation, not advice. Ok. Go buy a Howa 1500 243.
Don't consider any of the other recommended options that actually are better for your needs of ultra low recoil with effective deer killing. Just buy what you wanted to in the first place.

The 6ARC is not going away because it is the best hunting cartridge (by a good margin) in an AR15 sized platform at 6 or 6.5 caliber. It is great in a bolt gun as well.

Hornady had a big hit with it and rolled out the 22 ARC and 338 ARC to extend that success.

 

[Skydog]

You want people here to tell you to buy a Howa 1500 243. You are looking for validation, not advice. Ok. Go buy a Howa 1500 243.
Don't consider any of the other recommended options that actually are better for your needs of ultra low recoil with effective deer killing. Just buy what you wanted to in the first place.

You have no clue what you are talking about. I have carefully read every post and all the advice that's been provided. I have spent many, many hours over the last several days researching both the 6ARC and the 6.5 Grendel. I have fully considered the recommended options and weighed them against the .243 and found that the .243 is actually better for my needs. I clearly stated my reasons/conclusions in a previous post.

I'm sure you can understand the difference between: 1) not considering options, and 2) fully considering options but not being convinced to choose one? I'm not sure why you felt the need to assume #1 about me instead of at least considering that it could be #2. Is it really that hard for you to comprehend or accept that someone may fully consider your advice and then reject it, that you might be wrong, that what you have suggested is not best for their needs, etc.? Sorry to bust your bubble.

If you're upset that I wasn't convinced, then just come up with better arguments rather than making assumptions/false accusations about my motivations and the degree to which I have considered the advice.

Would I like to get some thoughts on the Howa 1500? Sure. It's one of the rifles I'm considering, so of course I'd like to hear feedback - good or bad - about it. Does that mean I'm only looking for validation, not advice? Of course not.

 

[Skydog]

Reminder that the 6ARC was designed to professionally kill deer sized critters.

Edit: after the .243 had already been around 70 years. Strange right?

Not really all that strange considering it was specifically designed for an AR15 platform. No one was hunting with ARs 70 years ago. So, what's your point? I've never denied that the 6ARC will kill deer sized critters.