Debt and the Hunter

[FlyGuy]

Good job OP. My wife and I have worked hard to stay out of debit. No CC debt, her car is paid for (mine is company vehicle), no loans, just the house note (and at a good rate. I have a good paying oilfield job, but I know it could end any day. So, we live below our means and keep putting it in the bank. All hunting gear (and I do buy a lot) is all paid for cash (or on credit cards for points that are immediately paid off).




You can’t cheat the mountain

 

[Don Qui Puncher]

This is an excellent thread, I know a lot of guys in their mid 20’s and 30‘s that have put zero thought into Their future, seems like Rokslide has a lot of like minded individuals. We bought a multi family after my daughter was born and it’s always paid our mortgage, we are going through the refinance process now and our new payment is going to be 620 less after losing PMI and interest going down. We live in one of the apartments and now with two kids were rapidly outgrowing our space and it’s time for a new one, with the 620 were saving and what we can get for our apartment it will pay the entire mortgage for a new house, and hopefully get another multi within a few years. I just recently got my first credit card and don’t carry anything on it we just have mortgage and vehicle debt. My wife has a good 401k I have a really good pension and we max our IRA every year, whole life and dabble in other stuff too. I’m 33 and I’ve seen so many people working till their 70 because they didn’t plan well, I want a plan a,b,c and d so I can go at 60 or maybe before. My old man is 67 and just can’t pull off retiring, he keeps saying another year or two. He would have been all set had he planned outside of company offered retirement programs.

 

[Carpenterant]

No debt except mortgage, index fund guy here. I enjoy Dave Ramsey, but, don’t agree with him on everything. I don’t hate someone because I disagree with them. I have been contemplating leveraging into real estate. I like gear almost as much as hunting but I pay for it all upfront and look for deals

 

[TheGDog]

As the old saying goes, “why is divorce so expensive? Because it’s worth it.”

I’ll say this, at this point in life, I am content with being a bachelor. Dating women with kids, X husbands, alimony check fights etc makes the cost not worth the reward. You end up being about #5 on their list of priorities and most are just looking for a guy to provide additional provisions to support their lifestyle and kids anyway. There’s always the option to date women 10-15 years younger, and that’s fine when it comes along. Still, best to just stay a bachelor, make your own money, spend it how you want, do what you want to do when you want to do it. if your are living life well enough, women will fall in your lap with enough occasional regularity that there’s no reason to put effort into impressing or pursuing them. If anything, women have put themselves in a overall social position where they should be ones doing the Pursuing, not men. Let them chase after you, and otherwise stay focused living an excellent life and doing things that make you happy. Unless you want kids or meet the most impressive woman imaginable, marriage is pretty much a raw deal for men.

Brother right here is preachin' F' Sho'!

Definitely need to learn the value and the worth YOU bring to the table in a relationship. In order to know for sure you're not "settling", and squeezing the most outta this life you can~!

 

[Where's Bruce?]

50-30-20

Spend 50% on needs
Spend 30% on wants
Put 20% into savings

Don't pay interest on credit cards, use em to develop credit but pay em off every month. Finance real estate and vehicles but not toys. One daY when the SHTF (like COVID) you will be glad you saved.

 

[TheGDog]

Move and join us, get free lol.


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It's a hard call man... I love all these outdoorsy activities. But... I live in a spot where there are just tons of beautiful ladies all around. I seldom have to run the heater in the house. And don't really hardly ever run the portable A/C units we have just in case. We get great breezes from the ocean that reach us at about 2pm every day. And honestly... Mama's Asian Pacific Islander, so she's not really gonna be down for those away from the coast climates I don't think. Although, she does have a life long friend that recently moved to AZ so perhaps that could be the IN to initially making it happen perhaps.

But I only live like 4 or 5mi from the Pacific Ocean on the border between LA and OC. It's a very cool centralized location. We'll see. Depends on what my boy decides he wants to do when he grows up.

But yes... I'd LOVE to get my RIGHTS back!

 

[Blackcats06]

Agree with the smart debt and dumb debt comment. Investing in a house or a business, or taking a 0% loan on a vehicle you could have paid cash for (and, assuming you're not rationalizing it and paying more) - I'll chalk that up as good debt, but it's still a responsibility, not without some risk, and still ties you down. While we could pay our mortgage off today, we make more on our investments than we pay on our mortgage.

Credit card debt, debt for toys and things like hunting gear - F' that...

imagine how much you could invest if you didn’t have a house payment. And how rich you would be!

 

[Brendan]

imagine how much you could invest if you didn’t have a house payment. And how rich you would be!

A properly purchased house is an investment. I've done the math on two properties I've owned, and sold, and return was better than the market looking at the whole picture.

We could pay off our current house tomorrow. It would be worse for us and cost us money from our bottom line every year.

Most people don't look at (or understand) the whole picture.

 

[FLS]

Debt is slavery. Avoid it at all cost.
Also realize you don’t need 10k worth of high tech gear to kill game. I had probable killed close to 100 deer and god only knows how many ducks and doves before I ever owned a new rifle, scope or shotgun. I hunted in BDUs, Carhartts, or Dickey’s.
A pair of Danner boots was as good as it got. We wore Alice packs ate Beenie weenies and bologna sandwiches, and we didn’t die if your legs got wet from dew.
All of these sites, podcasts, blogs etc, are marketing tools first and foremost.
You don’t need a bunch expensive shit, to be successful. You just need to go. The more you go the more you will learn and the more successful you will be. Spend your money going.

 

[browning2480]

A properly purchased house is an investment. I've done the math on two properties I've owned, and sold, and return was better than the market looking at the whole picture.

We could pay off our current house tomorrow. It would be worse for us and cost us money from our bottom line every year.

Most people don't look at (or understand) the whole picture.

Carrying a Mortgage for tax purposes only really works for a small percentage of people. The majority don’t make enough to see the tax benefit because they take the standard deduction. For the Majority of people, paying off the house and investing that money is better. May not be the case for you, but in general it isn’t the best strategy.

 

[unclericco]

I'm kind of on the fence with this. If you're playing the credit game, you need to have a few credit cards, mortgage, etc. Some credit cards, as was earlier noted will give you money back just for using the card. Some offer 1 year same as cash so you don't get hurt with interest. The key is to stay disciplined and pay off the balance of your credit card PRIOR to the payment due date each month.

 

[Sportsman]

Carrying a Mortgage for tax purposes only really works for a small percentage of people. The majority don’t make enough to see the tax benefit because they take the standard deduction. For the Majority of people, paying off the house and investing that money is better. May not be the case for you, but in general it isn’t the best strategy.

I've itemized for decades and still do but the recent tax changes made it even less valuable for the mortgage deduction for the average american. Taking away personal exemptions and raising standard deduction was a losing proposition for many folks who itemized.

 

[Brendan]

Carrying a Mortgage for tax purposes only really works for a small percentage of people. The majority don’t make enough to see the tax benefit because they take the standard deduction. For the Majority of people, paying off the house and investing that money is better. May not be the case for you, but in general it isn’t the best strategy.

It's not solely for tax benefit, I've had years I took the standard deduction. Invest principal, principal grows over time and gives you a return similar to investing in the stock market (Not always, but that's true with any investment). Compare that with needing a place to live and paying rent as an alternative without building any equity, plus as diversification with other assets in stocks, bonds, funds. And, I'm paying close to 3% on a mortgage and make more than that long term in the market, significantly more. It would cost me money to get rid of that (very cheap) debt. And, I'm not even talking about rental / investment properties which I've done in the past too.

Now, if you have crappy credit and are paying 6% on a mortgage, that's a completely different story...

Just saying "Debt is bad" across the board is a pretty broad brushed and not necessarily correct statement. Yes, all debt is a responsibility, but there's good and bad...

 

[browning2480]

I've itemized for decades and still do but the recent tax changes made it even less valuable for the mortgage deduction for the average american. Taking away personal exemptions and raising standard deduction was a losing proposition for many folks who itemized.

And the many that think it helps, are probably paying way to much in interest. The numbers rarely ever work out to support it.

 

[Marbles]

It's not solely for tax benefit, I've had years I took the standard deduction. Invest principal, principal grows over time and gives you a return similar to investing in the stock market (Not always, but that's true with any investment). Compare that with needing a place to live and paying rent as an alternative without building any equity, plus as diversification with other assets in stocks, bonds, funds. And, I'm paying close to 3% on a mortgage and make more than that long term in the market, significantly more. It would cost me money to get rid of that (very cheap) debt. And, I'm not even talking about rental / investment properties which I've done in the past too.

Now, if you have crappy credit and are paying 6% on a mortgage, that's a completely different story...

Just saying "Debt is bad" across the board is a pretty broad brushed and not necessarily correct statement. Yes, all debt is a responsibility, but there's good and bad...

I will agree that debt it a tool, and not all debt is bad. However, markets do go down. Owning a house is not a guarantee, but it brings more security than stocks. People have different levels of risk tolerance, some times peace of mind is worth more than opportunity.

There is also a lot of money to be lost, both in the market and in buying a house, for those who don't play their cards right.

 

[rayporter]

like anything else you have to want it. i considered debt free a need not a want. my parents set a good example and when dad retired mom was parked outside with the airstream and they hit the road without looking back. the thing was dad had a heart attack in Iowa, he pulled through and they went to alaska twice.
i knew i wanted to get out early and enjoy as much as i could after that. also watched a few guys work their selves to death. i never regretted going early.

i had lots of toys, fast horses and new guns when i was youg but i had that carrot in view and always drove a used truck and paid cash. and to be honest the horses paid their way, i built a new house and paid it off early and heck i paid cash for the house i live in now. that raised an eyebrow or two.
and i hunted elk in carharts and jeans - so what, we each killed elk our first trip and to back it we each killed our second trip. my pard was one of the guys that did not get to enjoy his retirement. he retired and we made 2 trips and he had a stroke and then a heart attack. it crushed me.

it is all in what you have your sights set on. are you looooooking at that carrot or not?

 

[Coho]

debt for toys, always bad. Noticed you said rent, l would save and buy a house. Only really smart consumer debt. I do often use 6 mo or 1 year 0% deals, but not for things I can't otherwise afford.

 

[beforethehunt]

Brother right here is preachin' F' Sho'!

Definitely need to learn the value and the worth YOU bring to the table in a relationship. In order to know for sure you're not "settling", and squeezing the most outta this life you can~!

If u find the right woman it will rock your world and change your mind. We have 5 kids together. I support her dreams and she supports mine. Relationship with God, then wife, then kids in that order. Hunting should be 4th i usually screw their order up


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[AKBorn]

My 2010 Alaska Caribou....note the clothes...

My 2015 Alaska Caribou....check out those clothes...

My 2019 Alaska Caribou (apologize for the poor muzzle discipline on my rifle, no round in the chamber but no excuse)...clothes look familiar?

I bought the shirt back in 2001 for about $45; the cargo pants I got somewhere around 2005, and paid about $30 for them. They have held up on many remote Alaska hunts, and I also use them when I am hunting whitetail deer in Maryland.

If you were to post on an open forum that you were doing a remote Alaska hunt, can you imagine the gear companies that would try to tell you that you NEED the latest and greatest gear to survive the Alaskan wilderness? I shudder to think how we survived when I was a young boy in Alaska, hunting in jeans and cotton t shirts and sweatshirts!

 

[Nasty Bastage]

There's nothing in this world I want bad enough to take out a loan for. That hasn't always been that way. There was a time years ago I needed a valium just to go to the mail box to see who and how much we owed. My wife and I got on the Dave Ramsey program and we are on baby step seven and let me tell you it is the greatest feeling in the world not owing anyone anything. If you are a young person reading this and are in the fortunate position to have not yet dug yourself a financial hole go buy yourself a copy of the book Millionaire Next Door and live your life with that in mind. If you do, at some point, you may be 40 or even 50 but you will be able to do what you want when you want without having to figure out how to pay for it.