CPW officially recommends fully limiting NR Archery- OTC Resident

[Poser]

This makes good sense to me and will result in a much better experience for residents during the archery season (if they cut the tag numbers to a reasonable number). Can someone explain to me why they wouldn't make the same move at the same time for the rifle season? Do they not experience the same overcrowding during rifle season? Are NRs not largely responsible for the increases in overcrowding that I assume are happening during rifle season? Don't way more elk get killed during the rifle season than the archery season? Why focus on archery when I assume the same issue happens during rifle season, but with bigger ramifications on the elk herd. I don't get it...

As I understand, one of the biggest issues with OTC tags is that they are either sex and CPW can't control how many cows are killed. For whatever reason, creating an entire new category of OTC sex specific tag allocations was more complex than just going to a draw system where there are allotted tags for each sex. Since OTC rifle seasons were already bull only, the same problem doesn't apply as it did for archery.

I realize that seems needlessly complex, but that is what I gathered from attending annual CPW meeting on elk. I also don't necessarily disagree with a bit more control over rifle seasons, but, after first rifle, the cows have been bred and there is less impact on the herd.

 

[svivian]

This makes good sense to me and will result in a much better experience for residents during the archery season (if they cut the tag numbers to a reasonable number). Can someone explain to me why they wouldn't make the same move at the same time for the rifle season? Do they not experience the same overcrowding during rifle season? Are NRs not largely responsible for the increases in overcrowding that I assume are happening during rifle season? Don't way more elk get killed during the rifle season than the archery season? Why focus on archery when I assume the same issue happens during rifle season, but with bigger ramifications on the elk herd. I don't get it...

Colorado elk numbers are shown to be at or above target numbers for CPW statewide. I dont think they are concerned about too many elk being killed.

 

[Will_m]

Thought this is what you were hinting at. Another nonresident veiled complaint.

Limiting tags isn’t good for the resource? Thats laughable.

Just tell the truth. You’re angry non residents don’t have unlimited otc.

No, I think they should have limited across the board like originally planned. I assume they came up with that idea because they felt it was best for the resource, but then retracted and increased opportunity when they ran into resistance. I don’t think unlimited OTC is going to work anywhere anymore just due to how popular everything has gotten.

 

[sodaksooner]

In the past, the switch from OTC units to draw units has mostly resulted in more tag availability than previous licenses sold for those same units. What I've learned from attending various CPW meetings is that there is a not-so-insignificant contingency of NR hunters who just refuse to participate in the draw process even if it is 100% draw and CPW was hesitant to disenfranchise that group of hunters entirely by offering them OTC opportunities. Given that there are many units in CO that will remain 100% draw, one just has to apply, folks are going to have to get with the times.... or take to various Facebook groups and rage about how Colorado took their hunting rights away.

They are doing that for sure!!! I made the same argument as you with one group. Will see how that ages.

 

[sodaksooner]

Its a good question. Colorado is still the most NR friendly Western state for an elk tag. How married are archery hunters to hunting with a bow that they will participate in a draw and be limited to one unit vs. taking up a later season just for the sake of OTC?

I guarantee most of those guys were hunting the same spots year after year. Now they just have to apply there, and will most likely get a tag too!

 

[Ucsdryder]

No, I think they should have limited across the board like originally planned. I assume they came up with that idea because they felt it was best for the resource, but then retracted and increased opportunity when they ran into resistance. I don’t think unlimited OTC is going to work anywhere anymore just due to how popular everything has gotten.

Lots of states have it for residents. I don’t understand why everyone always gets so mad at Colorado when they do the same thing, in a more friendly NR way, than other western states.

The one thing you could have said, and I would have agreed with, is the fact that they left rifle the same. That’s a definite example of doing the wrong thing for the resource for the wrong reasons (money).

 

[H2PVon]

I would guess they will go off of resident participation following the limited tag quota guidelines they can only issue 25 percent of the tags to nr of a limited tag.

So they will take the resident numbers from previous years and take 25 percent of that and issue that number of licenses to nr I hope anyways....

How do they track resident OTC tags and who goes to what unit? (Please pardon my ignorance if this is well known. Also, speaking as a NR that is in favor of limiting "us".)

 

[Ucsdryder]

How do they track OTC tags and who goes to what unit? (Please pardon my ignorance if this is well known. Also, speaking as a NR that is in favor of limiting "us".)

You can’t. Only way is the voluntary harvest reporting, but guys that are successful are likely to not disclose which otc unit they were successful.

 

[Bearsears]

This makes good sense to me and will result in a much better experience for residents during the archery season (if they cut the tag numbers to a reasonable number). Can someone explain to me why they wouldn't make the same move at the same time for the rifle season? Do they not experience the same overcrowding during rifle season? Are NRs not largely responsible for the increases in overcrowding that I assume are happening during rifle season? Don't way more elk get killed during the rifle season than the archery season? Why focus on archery when I assume the same issue happens during rifle season, but with bigger ramifications on the elk herd. I don't get it...

CPW staff recommended keeping OTC rifle the same because they are really concerned about the budget shortfall coming from the limitation of NR. They said this to the commission multiple times over the last few months of meetings. From what they said they want to phase in the elimination of OTC and see what happens with the budget. For the most part the complaining about overcrowding has come from the archery season so they went after it first. In the beginning, staff recommended going full draw for residents and non for archery. The resident bowhunters (including me), Colorado Resident Hunters Association, and the Colorado Bowhunters Association pushed back hard and saved OTC opportunity for residents. My hats off to all the hunters that made a difference for residents.

There will be more fights coming and OTC rifle will definitely be on the block during the next BGSS process I think.

 

[Bearsears]

You can’t. Only way is the voluntary harvest reporting, but guys that are successful are likely to not disclose which otc unit they were successful.

There was a lot of discussion about this yesterday too. The commission really wants to institue mandatory harvest reporting. Staff doesn't want to. I believe staff was directed to put together a presentation for the commission on how and why they do things currently.

 

[H2PVon]

You can’t. Only way is the voluntary harvest reporting, but guys that are successful are likely to not disclose which otc unit they were successful.

So how would they determine 25% of tags in a certain unit then?

 

[Lawnboi]

This makes good sense to me and will result in a much better experience for residents during the archery season (if they cut the tag numbers to a reasonable number). Can someone explain to me why they wouldn't make the same move at the same time for the rifle season? Do they not experience the same overcrowding during rifle season? Are NRs not largely responsible for the increases in overcrowding that I assume are happening during rifle season? Don't way more elk get killed during the rifle season than the archery season? Why focus on archery when I assume the same issue happens during rifle season, but with bigger ramifications on the elk herd. I don't get it...

Because we don’t manage for herd goals anymore but we do for votes.

 

[BBob]

There was a lot of discussion about this yesterday too. The commission really wants to institue mandatory harvest reporting. Staff doesn't want to. I believe staff was directed to put together a presentation for the commission on how and why they do things currently.

Same situation awhile back in AZ. AZGFD didn't want to do it because it would upend their statistical modeling method and require a costly change over to the harvest reporting. Our commission told them to do it anyway.

 

[Poser]

I guarantee most of those guys were hunting the same spots year after year. Now they just have to apply there, and will most likely get a tag too!

Difficult to imagine the guys with an arrow for a truck antenna, a rear window decal that says "Bowhunter" and a 2nd decal that is an archer hanging off a Crucifix treestand will forego archery season just to have the OTC experience.

I do suppose, though, if they are that passionate about bowhunting and OTC elk hunting, they can put on orange and get out there with their bow during 2nd and 3rd rifle.

 

[Pro953]

Just curious, what is the argument for any OTC season. Other than the social preference.

It’s very easy to have a “draw” system that still has an abundance of tags to make it essentially OTC while still having the management tools in place to adjust if needed vs the free for all.

I would love to hear what the CPW story is RE: not wanting mandatory reporting. To me not having mandated reporting in 100% of tags/states is just crazy.

We cannot beat the drum of conservation and management, but then not offer the data.


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[cuerro viejo]

Just curious, what is the argument for any OTC season. Other than the social preference.

It’s very easy to have a “draw” system that still has an abundance of tags to make it essentially OTC while still having the management tools in place to adjust if needed vs the free for all.

I would love to hear what the CPW story is RE: not wanting mandatory reporting. To me not having mandated reporting in 100% of tags/states is just crazy.

We cannot beat the drum of conservation and management, but then not offer the data.


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They need to go to electronic tag, then they can collect all the data they need

 

[Poser]

Just curious, what is the argument for any OTC season. Other than the social preference.

It’s very easy to have a “draw” system that still has an abundance of tags to make it essentially OTC while still having the management tools in place to adjust if needed vs the free for all.

I would love to hear what the CPW story is RE: not wanting mandatory reporting. To me not having mandated reporting in 100% of tags/states is just crazy.

We cannot beat the drum of conservation and management, but then not offer the data.


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I believe the most common argument is that a person can continue to build points in CO and hunt OTC units in the meantime without using their points.

The 2nd most common argument, if you can even call it a argument, is that people don't want to be burdened with a complicated application and draw process -they just want to show up in Sept, swing by a CPW office, Walmart while they are stocking up on ice or the local hunting shop, but a tag and be on their way. Some of these same folks will undoubtedly show up in 2025 with their horse trailers and SxSs in tow only to discover they cannot buy a tag. When the Southwest units went from OTC to draw a few years ago, I saw a group from Arkansas who had parked their 40 foot horse trailer in the center turning lane of Main St Durango while they went into the outdoor store to buy OTC tags for unit 74. I just happened to be walking by, saw some angry and animated hand gestures at the checkout and dripped in to see what was going on. These guys had been buying OTC tags for unit 74 for years and were arguing with the cashier about the fact that 74 was now in fact a draw unit. They insisted that the cashier sell them their tag. Some folks don't really pay attention to the ins and outs of hunting and regulation changes, they just pack up their trailers and head out to CO like they've been doing for years.

 

[chanson_roland]

Personally, I still plan to show up to hunt OTC even in units that switch to draw.

If I'm ever stopped, I'll simply tell the CPW officer that "I identify as a wolf"...

That oughta do it...

ETA: CPW, if you're listening, it's a joke. I swear.

 

[ddavis_1313]

Is that all otc or just public otc?

Will there be otc private?


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[ARK_Ginger]

Archery: Elk & Deer seasons remain unchanged. Non Resident Archery OTC licenses were eliminated. Non Residents will have to draw. NR licenses will be capped at 25% of the previous years participation.

I might be a little dense here, but is the allotment 25% of total tags or 25% of NR tags?