Bivy and Tarp?

[mtwarden]

After using a bivy/tarp combo of various configurations for 15-20 years, I find myself rarely using them anymore (I do have eVent bivy that I still use in snow shelters in the Winter).

With the advent of the very UL dcf shelters, the weight savings are no longer there. They are spendy, no doubt- BUT you have a roughly 16 oz setup that includes a full bathtub floor, fully bug enclosed, room to sit up in, a vestibule to store gear & cook out of the weather if needed and only needs a small footprint to setup.

Too many upsides (except cost) to go back to a bivy/tarp for me.

 

[Loper]

After using a bivy/tarp combo of various configurations for 15-20 years, I find myself rarely using them anymore (I do have eVent bivy that I still use in snow shelters in the Winter).

With the advent of the very UL dcf shelters, the weight savings are no longer there. They are spendy, no doubt- BUT you have a roughly 16 oz setup that includes a full bathtub floor, fully bug enclosed, room to sit up in, a vestibule to store gear & cook out of the weather if needed and only needs a small footprint to setup.

Too many upsides (except cost) to go back to a bivy/tarp for me.

Good point of view. What is your preferred UL def shelter?

 

[Radford]

What is a ul dcf shelter?

 

[mtwarden]

dcf (dyneema composite fabric) is a fabric- it used to be called cuben fiber, several iterations of dcf, but basically it's pretty darn light stuff compared to nylon and has a higher hydrostatic head (waterproofness) and more tear resistance

my solo shelter is a Tarptent Aeon Li, two person is also a Tarptent- the Stratosphere Li- both have done pretty well in rough weather

don't want to talk anyone out of a tarp/bivy, just pointing out another viable option from someone who has spent a lot of time in a bivy and under a tarp

 

[EdP]

Mtwarden covered it. Bivy addresses ticks and flying bugs but has condensation issues. With precip the bivy is not great because you and your stuff are going to get wet during pack-up. The tarp gives cover for pack-up and for cooking/eating. In the east your cover layer (bivy, tarp, tent fly) is going to be wet from dew almost every morning so it isn't just a precip issue. A 1 person tent with nest does the same things as bivy and tarp potentially at lower weight.

 

[Drenalin]

In the mornings I just pop open the plugs on my air pad and then roll up the whole set up (pad, quilt & bivy) into a burrito, then place that into a kifaru stuff sack. Takes seconds.

Have seen you mention this a couple of times - can you share what pad, quilt, and bivy you're using and which size Kifaru sack it's all fitting into?

I use an Exped Ultra 7 and a 15-degree El Coyote quilt in a Borah Bivy - I imagine I'll need Kifaru's large 5-string to make this work.

 

[Phaseolus]

I cannot imagine trying to wait out a long rainstorm in a bivy... I have twice, I’m graduating to a Durston Xmid 2. Same weight as my tarp and bivy and much nicer for those rainy periods.

 

[FlyGuy]

Have seen you mention this a couple of times - can you share what pad, quilt, and bivy you're using and which size Kifaru sack it's all fitting into?

I use an Exped Ultra 7 and a 15-degree El Coyote quilt in a Borah Bivy - I imagine I'll need Kifaru's large 5-string to make this work.

Have seen you mention this a couple of times - can you share what pad, quilt, and bivy you're using and which size Kifaru sack it's all fitting into?
I use an Exped Ultra 7 and a 15-degree El Coyote quilt in a Borah Bivy - I imagine I'll need Kifaru's large 5-string to make this work.

This is my go-to set up:

- Quilt = EE Revelation 20
- Pad = S2S comfort plus large (red, mummy shaped)
- Pillow = S2S Aeros large
- Bivy = OR Stargazer (this one has been discontinued, looks like the Alpine Ascent has replaced it). Side entry bivy and it Has one mini tent pole to elevate the bivy and keep it off your face.

The S2S pad and pillow deflates in seconds. I just pop open the releases and roll up the pad, quilt, pillow and bivy all together. I think the Kifaru stuff sack is the large one? I know I purchased the stuff sack about 7 years ago to fit their 20° mummy bag, so it whichever one goes to that bag.

I also use a Kifaru sheep tarp, most nights. I just keep that in its own stuff-sack with pegs. Super versatile tarp for almost any conditions. I pitch it using a trekking pole and a mtn stick. The mtn stick is a life saver when it comes to leveling out the ground, I sleep much better since I’ve acquired it.

 

[NDF]

Got me thinking about this setup now. Seems to check a lot of boxes. Only downside is not having the hot tent. Anyone got a solution to that?

I just got the warbonnet 13ft superfly Tarp (plan to use it as ground shelter), and a titanium lightweight stove from Lite outdoors. My plan is to add a stove jack to the tarp. The stove jack covers the hole when not in in use so then I can use the tarp in all seasons and keep the weight down. This is not built yet but in the works.
https://www.liteoutdoors.com/product/stove-jack/

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[BigDuckHunter]

To those of you who do the tarp thing, how do you deal with the “raining sideways” type blowing rain? I’d like to try the tarp+borah bivy, but thinking about the nights I’ve spent in windy rainstorms always keeps me from doing it.

I suppose if it’s always blowing from one direction then just orient the low side into the wind there, but I feel like the wind often switches directions at least once during the night.

 

[mtwarden]

I've been forced to repitch my tarp a few times with a major wind shift w/ moisture, but generally that's the biggest reason you bring a water resistant bivy when using a tarp.

BUT it's also one reason (among others) why I've gone to away from a bivy/tarp into a very light full shelter

 

[Dave0317]

To those of you who do the tarp thing, how do you deal with the “raining sideways” type blowing rain? I’d like to try the tarp+borah bivy, but thinking about the nights I’ve spent in windy rainstorms always keeps me from doing it.

I suppose if it’s always blowing from one direction then just orient the low side into the wind there, but I feel like the wind often switches directions at least once during the night.

If you at least know the general direction that wind and storms tend to come in, you can somewhat plan for that. Of course mountain wind can be a bit different as it flows and funnels between hills and valleys.

The first couple pics in this link are what some hikers call “storm mode”.

Virgaoutdoors Wraith (.51 Cuben Fiber 9x7 Tarp) first pitch and impressions.... - Backpacking Light

Worked with Josh to modify his 9 x 7 CF Wraith design based off this thread: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=52389 - I'm not a fan of bivies and wanted a tarp big enough...

backpackinglight.com

Tie up a mid-point on one side and experiment with different heights to see how that affects ventilation. The 4 corners can all be staked to the ground if needed for best coverage, or elevate the front corners with some cordage for more headroom and more ventilation.

Like others have pointed out, the tarp vs tent thing is almost a wash these days with lightweight tents out now. Especially if you use trekking poles. I don’t usually hike with them, so I like the versatility of a tarp. If I pitch it in the “storm mode” described in that thread, trekking poles are not needed, and that saves about a pound by leaving them out. If you carry trekking poles already, those Argali tents may be pretty tempting. Pretty light and not crazy expensive.

 

[Wrongside]

I've been forced to repitch my tarp a few times with a major wind shift w/ moisture, but generally that's the biggest reason you bring a water resistant bivy when using a tarp.

BUT it's also one reason (among others) why I've gone to away from a bivy/tarp into a very light full shelter

Same here. I used an ID SilTarp2 and various bivies almost exclusively for quite a few years. With the shelters available today I can’t see ever going back to a tarp as primary shelter. (Still pack a tarp for glassing/emerg shelter most of the time.)

 

[canyoncritter]

I always have a light weight tarp. It can get you out of a bind, you can bed down under in a bad situation, use it to guard you from the sun, snow, rain, etc. A tarp is an essential piece of my kit.

Going into the backcountry without some kind of tarp just demonstrates poor judgment (even if used for another party that's in trouble). Bring a light tarp.

 

[Koda_]

Am I missing something? If the conditions don’t call for precipitation, does a person really need the tarp? If conditions do call for rain and I bring the tarp, should I also bring the bivy? In what situation would a person need both? I know wind might be a consideration, but how big of a consideration is it?

If conditions dont call for rain you might still have dew. If conditions call for rain, and the wind shifts and blows the rain into the tarp entrances then you'll want the bivy too, its a big consideration because a wet sleeping bag will end any trip right there.
By the time you bring both, you could have just brought a tent shelter. What your missing is tent technology has improved so much you can get a fully enclosed tent for the same weight as a bivy and tarp combo. It makes no sense to bivy or tarp anymore.

 

[Dave0317]

If conditions dont call for rain you might still have dew. If conditions call for rain, and the wind shifts and blows the rain into the tarp entrances then you'll want the bivy too, its a big consideration because a wet sleeping bag will end any trip right there.
By the time you bring both, you could have just brought a tent shelter. What your missing is tent technology has improved so much you can get a fully enclosed tent for the same weight as a bivy and tarp combo. It makes no sense to bivy or tarp anymore.

Cost savings, but still getting a pretty light weight is one reason I can still see a tarp and bivy being advantageous.

A cheaper tarp and bivy could probably get you a sub 1 pound shelter system for under $200.
And, you can pitch it with trees instead of poles, allowing you to leave more weight at home, if you don’t use poles for hiking.

But, if you hike with poles, and your budget is not capped at $200, yep, the lighter tents that exist now are probably the better option. Of course then there is the simple personal preference aspect of maybe wanting to see out of your shelter, liking a bit more air flow, changing shelter shape for different situations, etc.