Barnes 300 Blk 120 Gr TAC-TX for Elk

[cgasner1]

After this year’s hunt I upgraded to the same rifle in 450 Bushmaster per the shared thread. I also rounded up a compact stock to start my son with the 300 BLK and youth cow tags now that I know it will get the job done on elk with good shot presentation/placement.

But why? You could put him behind so many other guns that kids are more than comfortable with that would work so much better. Your setting a kid up for a very bad experience that could ruin hunting for them.


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[TracksWapiti]

Dude trolls a bunch of people for a couple years talking about all these elk he has killed and how this will kill anything at that range. Few years later kills a bull only to then say that it’s his first bull and they are much bigger beast than a cow. And somewhere in the middle trash talks archery hunters about how inefficient a arrow kills elk.


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That's not true re the timeframe or "trolling." My initial post didn't ask for anyone's opinion on the subject. Simply informed that community that I was going to collect some real-world data and share it with post-hunt results since there seemed to be a dearth of it online re the 300 blk on elk. I started the shared thread in October several weeks before this year's hunt.

Previous three elk before this bull were all cows. And I regret making the archery comment since I'm not a bowhunter and have no business opining on its effectiveness or lack thereof.

Are you this way to all newbies? Why??

 

[cgasner1]

No I’m not but after realizing it’s not a ideal choice for a bull given that cows are a smaller animal it’s still a elk you now want to put a youth behind that gun and see it happen again. Not trying to be a dick but you may be living up to your name of trackingwapati


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[TracksWapiti]

No I’m not but after realizing it’s not a ideal choice for a bull given that cows are a smaller animal it’s still a elk you now want to put a youth behind that gun and see it happen again. Not trying to be a dick but you may be living up to your name of trackingwapati


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My 16" 300 blk with compact stock makes more sense to me for my son than the adult-sized 22" 30-06 that I toted around on my first elk hunt. A cow won't know the difference inside 100 yards with the 120gr Barnes. My bull didn't.

 

[cgasner1]

In a perfect world you are correct. In a world where your kids bullet hits a rib on that cow and bounces at a goofy angle and only hits a lung and you maybe find her 2 miles away the next day. I get not buying your boy a 300 rum but our elk deserves to not be hunted on a this has to be perfect or they suffer situation.


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[TracksWapiti]

In a perfect world you are correct. In a world where your kids bullet hits a rib on that cow and bounces at a goofy angle and only hits a lung and you maybe find her 2 miles away the next day. I get not buying your boy a 300 rum but our elk deserves to not be hunted on a this has to be perfect or they suffer situation.


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Elk get wounded all the time by "elk cartridges" due to poor shot placement, improper bullet selection, deflection by vegetation, etc. Shot placement is paramount, followed by bullet construction. Headstamp and velocity don't have much to do with killing elk in my experience. Bullet penetration and expansion/wide meplat does. My 45 ACP with 255 hard cast that I carry for bear protection would easily kill an elk within its effective range (just wouldn't be legal in CO, of course).

I watched my friend shoot a cow at 80 yards on private land with my 300 Win pushing a 178 Amax @ 3k fps. An aquaintance of mine successfully killed a bull at 500 yards with the same load, so I assumed it would work on a cow no problem. My friend hit her perfectly with a broadside shot and the bullet barely penetrated the near lung after exploding on the entry rib. We recovered the cow but the bullet failure left an impression.

Every time a trigger is pulled while hunting there is a risk of wounding/losing a game animal. Anyone who hunts long enough experiences this and it sucks for the hunter emotionally. And the animal suffers like all prey animals do in the wild eventually. And their carcass doesn't go to waste. Any nearby predators/scavengers put it to good use.

My son will learn all this by hunting like the rest of us did. And shot placement, which is #1, will be ensured with a rifle he enjoys practicing with and can shoot accurately. Cows have far less shoulder mass than bulls, of course, which should stack the odds in his favor if shot placement is further forward than intended.

Most folks who truly care about what elk deserve are anti-hunting conservationists. And most elk who die in the wild die slowly and cruelly from either apex predators hunting them or coyotes taking advantage of a downed elk that is sick/injured/old. Let's not kid ourselves about the circle of life and how our sport hunting interfaces with it.

 

[t_carlson]

Most folks who truly care about what elk deserve are anti-hunting conservationists.

Huh?

 

[willy]

Thats a perfect oxymoron if I've ever seen one. Wow

 

[cgasner1]

You ever hope your wrong. This is one of those situations where I hope I am wrong andyou never have a issue for the elk or your kids sake.


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[TracksWapiti]

Huh?

Think about it. The bull I “harvested” this year didn’t deserve to be jumped out of his bed in the middle of the day and shot to death. What he deserved had nothing to do with it. What motivates many of us to hunt these magnificent animals did: my own prey drive, the challenge, meat, social status, etc if I’m honest with myself.

That bull would’ve been happier continuing to chew his cud on a beautiful sunny day and do it again thousands of times until he died of old age. But the only way that would happen is if elk hunting wasn’t allowed and all his natural predators were hunted instead.

“Hunting ethics” is an oxymoron IMO. I personally hate wounding animals and losing them or having to finish them off with follow up shots because I find it emotionally disturbing. But that doesn’t mean a clean kill is “ethical” or what the game animal “deserves.” We kill them because we’re at the top of the food chain and we can. Plain and simple.

 

[Fogalo]

I’m not arguing shot placement is the most important part of taking game. It is and if shooting a larger caliber makes you incapable of executing a good shot then by all means know your range and shoot a legal firearm than you’re comfortable with.

I’d just like to add some outside perspective for these comments.

That bull would’ve been happier continuing to chew his cud on a beautiful sunny day and do it again thousands of times until he died of old age. But the only way that would happen is if elk hunting wasn’t allowed and all his natural predators were hunted instead.

Animals die of old age? Even without predators that’s far fetched. Starvation and hypothermia are more likely.

“Hunting ethics” is an oxymoron IMO. I personally hate wounding animals and losing them or having to finish them off with follow up shots because I find it emotionally disturbing. But that doesn’t mean a clean kill is “ethical” or what the game animal “deserves.” We kill them because we’re at the top of the food chain and we can. Plain and simple.

This is naive as well because you’re completely discounting human’s affect on elk habit. You could make that claim for what’s left of the wild parts of the world where animals never interact with humans but there isn’t an elk in Colorado that hasn’t been affected by humans regardless of hunting. Because humans are living along side wildlife in most all of the continental US it is our duty to wildlife - in all forms. That’s part of the responsibility of building highways and towns in wintering grounds, running trails that disturb animals during calving season, and every other human elk interaction that happens outside of hunting.

The ethics question isn’t one of hunting the ethics question is more because humans alter wildlife habitat do we need to manage those animals? I personally think that is our duty and I think hunting is the most effective tool to do so.

 

[dfwpist2020]

Probably any bullet can take down any game, but are you good enough to do it?


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