Backcountry radio use

[TheCougar]

So this friend of mine is thinking about ditching the crappy midland radios for a real radio that transmits on VHF. The GMRS radios get terrible performance in the mountains. Technically, the radios he is looking at require a HAM license, but this guy is a rebel and doesn't really care about that since they will be used in the mountains. I know... "This guy I know" is a bad person for ignoring FCC regs. Am I going to get hunted down by someone in the mountains when we are on the radios? Is the performance of these radios that much better? Without self-incriminating, anyone here have a "friend" who does something similar?

 

[KJH]

As long as you're wearing a foil hat, you'll be fine. They won't be able to find your location.

No idea about the performance, but IMO it would have to be a very large usage/interference problem over a long period before anyone would look into it.

 

[TheCougar]

I only planned on using a foil hat when I turned up the wattage and transmitted on 243.0 and 121.5.

 

[jm1607]

Just stay off the emergency channels and I don't thing SWAT will parachute in

Yes, the performance is 100x better

This message will self destruct in 3... 2... 1...

 

[muddydogs]

For the old gray haired Ham guy setting around his shack there is nothing funner then a day of adventure tracking down unauthorized users and these boys can triangulate your position down to a few feet given enough signal to work with. I would stay off the HAM frequency's if it was me.

I have used some very good government radio's in my time and while there better then the low watt cheap bubble pack Walmart radio's there still line of site in the mountains. Radio waves don't go up the side of one hill and down the side of the next so depending on the terrain sometime expensive high powered radio's are no better then cheap ones.

 

[Owenst7]

The utility of a 2m/70cm handheld radio on simplex is mostly limited to line of sight. They are more effective than a blister pack radio. The utility of these radios is tremendously increased through the use of a repeater. In the Eastern Sierras where repeaters are all over, I can frequently communicate over a hundred miles with a repeater/repeater system. Some areas have an internet connection to the repeater (you can build one with your cell phone also), and you can literally talk anywhere the internet can go, and then some.

As a licensed operator, if I happen by someone using amateur frequencies without identifying with their call sign, I'm probably going to record them and submit a complaint to the FCC (and a game warden if I determine you're hunting). If I'm out in the mountains with my radio on scan and pick up someone on simplex, I'm going to be able to figure out who it is pretty easily just by looking around. Even easier if you're discussing your position with someone else. If you're using a repeater illegally, my experience is one of the repeater operators will shut the repeater down pretty quickly to prevent illegal use of their station. There's plenty of radio space that an unlicensed operator can stick to without interrupting my use of radio space that has formalities and licensure that I took the time to learn and acquire legally.

I'm not sure about other states, but Alaska was very clear that the use of a radio in the pursuit of game was against the law. I would go out of my way to gather evidence and report a crime should I be witness to one of that nature.

A radio license is $15 and the questions and answers they give you are everywhere on the internet to study. It is so stupidly easy to get your license and be legal that I don't understand why anyone would risk getting a fine or pissing off other users. Hamexam.org is my favorite study tool.



That said, a radio like a Baofeng being operated illegally on FRS, GMRS, or MURS frequencies (that is what the OTC bubble-pack radios operate on) would be nearly impossible to identify as an unlicensed radio without actually seeing the guy key up on the radio. Further, the only people that would care are most likely licensed operators, which typically have zero interest in listening to the zoo of clueless traffic on those frequencies. I suppose if I were a game warden or some sort of law enforcement, I'd probably pay attention to those frequencies though, along with CB. I suspect most LEOs are less privy to radio technologies than the average ham though. Also, GMRS is illegal to use without a license. I have never heard of someone being cited for that though.

I'm under 30 years old, so it's not just bored old guys that use this technology and care about the law.

 

[kicker338]

My experience with radios, ham or regular I don't know but it belonged to my neighbor and was bleeding all over my TV. Finally had enough and called the FCC. The reply was very interesting, the lady I talked to said they didn't have near enough man power to look into complaints unless they were very, very serious. She said they would send a letter to the neighbor informing him of the problem which they did. The neighbor came over, apologized, shielded his antenna better and the problem went away. Do I think after that experience that the FCC is going out in the mountains to catch someone with an unlicensed radio operator???? NOPE.

 

[TheCougar]

Thanks for the inputs. Good to know the radios work better and you can run them on gmrs freqs. I'll try to steer clear of any ham spec ops!

 

[muddydogs]

My experience with radios, ham or regular I don't know but it belonged to my neighbor and was bleeding all over my TV. Finally had enough and called the FCC. The reply was very interesting, the lady I talked to said they didn't have near enough man power to look into complaints unless they were very, very serious. She said they would send a letter to the neighbor informing him of the problem which they did. The neighbor came over, apologized, shielded his antenna better and the problem went away. Do I think after that experience that the FCC is going out in the mountains to catch someone with an unlicensed radio operator???? NOPE.

While any good HAM will try to stop interference with neighborhood electronics the way the law is written if there HAM equipment is setup correctly it's not the HAMs problem but the person with the interference problem. Be happy that the HAM took the time to do extra shielding as it probably wasn't his equipment but yours.

It's not the FCC you have to worry about it's the local HAM's that take offense to guys using the frequencies without a license. There is a large group of retired guys messing around with HAM radio's and if they decide to track you down, get license plates or other identifying information and turn this into the FCC then the FCC will take action. These retired guys like to set in the HAM shacks listening to the radio and chances are they have one in every vehicle, there retired so they have the time to go on a hunt.At least once a year most HAM clubs put on a hidden transmitter hunt so these guys have the equipment and skill to find your location if you broadcast long enough. HAM's really take offense to unauthorized repeater use as these repeaters belong to a HAM club or private individual so not only are you broadcasting illegally when you use there repeaters you are doing so with there equipment.

 

[13bonatter69]

Kinda sounds like SOME HAM operators may have their panties on a little too tight, but I could be wrong. I mean, I paid for my drivers license and took a test to be "LEGAL" but Im certainly not going to take time out of my day to "gather evidence and report someone" if they turn without proper use of a turn signal....lol

 

[GotDraw?]

Kinda sounds like SOME HAM operators may have their panties on a little too tight, but I could be wrong. I mean, I paid for my drivers license and took a test to be "LEGAL" but Im certainly not going to take time out of my day to "gather evidence and report someone" if they turn without proper use of a turn signal....lol

10-4 on that one

 

[paleraider]

My experience with radios, ham or regular I don't know but it belonged to my neighbor and was bleeding all over my TV. Finally had enough and called the FCC. The reply was very interesting, the lady I talked to said they didn't have near enough man power to look into complaints unless they were very, very serious. She said they would send a letter to the neighbor informing him of the problem which they did. The neighbor came over, apologized, shielded his antenna better and the problem went away. Do I think after that experience that the FCC is going out in the mountains to catch someone with an unlicensed radio operator???? NOPE.

It generally isn't the FCC tracking down people, it is other HAM's that do the majority of the leg work. Yes there are many that enjoy doing it. I have my license, if I did see someone doing that I would probably get as much information and would report them. I don't like the whole "I can break the law because it is convenient for me to do so" mentality, this is the same thought that poachers have or anti hunters have when they interfere with hunts.

 

[muddydogs]

Kinda sounds like SOME HAM operators may have their panties on a little too tight, but I could be wrong. I mean, I paid for my drivers license and took a test to be "LEGAL" but Im certainly not going to take time out of my day to "gather evidence and report someone" if they turn without proper use of a turn signal....lol

Well the FCC doesn't have cops in every town listening to the airwaves just waiting on someone to break the law so its kind of left up to the users to police themselves. I for one appreciate there efforts as I would hate to see the HAM frequency turn into anything like the current CB radio mess that's out there on our highways.

If you don't want to get a HAM license or are just to lazy then just don't broadcast on the HAM bands. The little test one has to take to get a general HAM license is nothing at all, there's web sites dedicated to the tests with the current test questions and answers so its not like its a big secret deal. Most HAM clubs have a couple test prep classes a year where they go over the information for each specific test fairly in depth, who knows you might learn something or find a new hobby.

 

[Owenst7]

That sounds exactly like a poacher to me.

"I want to use this private citizen's repeater that he built and maintains on his funds, and no law is stopping me!"

A better analogy would be if someone borrowed your car that didn't have a license because they were too lazy to get it.