AR advice

[2ski]

So, I saw a black Friday ad for Sportsman's warehouse for a DPMS for around $500. Thinking about it, I'm thinking about selling my Hi-Point 9mm carbine(yeah, Hi-Point) which I don't use a ton. It was a cool gun for me to spend $220 on a couple years ago, but I feel its a better straight-up self-defense gun as its a pistol cartridge, and I'd rather have something that can make an up to 400 yard or so shot.

So I braved the crowds and went in to look at this DPMS, not really knowing anything about the platform. I've learned a ton in the last 4 days. I'm not going to drop a few hundred on a whim, so I didn't buy it, but it has me thinking. In kind of an under $700 price range here in Bozeman, it looks like my options are DPMS Oracle, the S&W sport, and the Ruger AR-556. I'd like some opinions on those 3. The gun shop I checked out had the S&W and Ruger for $625. I really enjoyed my coversation with the owner and his gunsmith and learned a lot. Didn't even know what a Forward assist was before then. I'm kind of partial to Rugers because I have 2 Ruger pistols, but other than that, I've got no loyalty.

The guys at the gun shop did not have DPMS and likened it to Hi-Point and said not to go that route. They did tell me that the S&W and the Ruger had chrome-lined barrels, however, every review I see online says the Ruger does not. They also told me the the twist for both of them and the Colt they had for a grand were all 1 in 7, but when the gunsmith looked on the barrels, the Colt was the only one that had a 1 in 7, while the Ruger was 1 in 8 and the S&W was 1 in 9. That makes me a little "leary" about their knowlege of the weapons.

So what say the people I trust on Rokslide?

 

[Rucker61]

What are you going to use this rifle for?

 

[2ski]

Fun, coyotes, gophers. Nothing serious.

 

[HOT ROD]

If U could find the Remington Ar. For around that price. I would recommend it. It has been very accurate with factory ammo. I just started reloading for it. My first trip wasn't to successful. With the reloads. This group was shot bye my wife and I. At 100 yards with factory 69 smks

 

[blutooth]

I have friends with both the Oracle and the M&P and a Colt. None have had any issues with them, but we are just plinking steel and they can hit a 10" plate at 100 yards and 55gr cheapo ammo. I can't speak to anything more accurate than that (I don't know what Colt you looked at but my buddy with a Colt in my estimation paid a little extra for the name rather than quality). It you want to be able to reach out there the 1:7 twist should like heavier bullets more.

I don't want to open pandora's box, but you might want to check out Palmetto State Armory. They have a complete lower right now for $155, then you can put darn near any upper on it (I have a Delton Upper and PSA lower that shoots 1-1.5 MOA with open sights). Lots up options for uppers at Midway USA as well. Right now that setup is around $450 plus transfer fees and shipping. Lowers need the FFL, uppers can ship direct.

 

[husky390]

There isn't a better time to get an AR than now as they're the cheapest they've ever been.

The S&W used to have 5R rifling but they discontinued it. I'm sure it's still an excellent AR for the money though. The Ruger does not have a chrome lined bore which shouldn't matter and Ruger's CS is second to none. They took great care of me on a warranty issue I had with a revolver. I have no experience with the DPMS Oracle but I've owned a DPMS A-15 which never gave me a single problem and I wouldn't hesitate to get another one.

One nice thing about Colt is they are Mil-Spec where others may use Commercial spec items. I believe the only area of concern for this is if you decide to replace the buttstock. Mil and Commercial spec use different size buffer tubes. Just an FYI.

I almost picked up the Ruger AR556 when they were around $565 but bought a Palmetto State Armory kit instead. Mine is a premium kit and I'd recommend that option. I've read internet lore of the PTAC kits having some QC issues, can't verify if it's true, just the premium kit had all the options I wanted.

If you're handy with tools and working on guns, you can build your own AR. Just buy a PSA Kit and a stripped lower. About the only special tool you'll need is a buffer tube nut wrench. I built mine with a Channel locks, needle nose pliers, razor blade and two youtube videos.

Here are two pretty good options if you want a Colt. The 6920 has the heavier M4 barrel, the 6720 has a lighter weight profile. I have a 6920, sorry to say I paid $1,150 for it back in 2012 and that was before the gouging really began. It's a good rifle that's fun to shoot.

http://www.kygunco.com/colt-rifle-m4-223-rem-556mm-nato-161-barrel-20-round-black-30494

http://www.kygunco.com/colt-ar6720-223-556-30rd-161in-matte-black-rifle-69689

Just buy and assemble a stripped lower and you're done. If you don't see a kit you want, just wait. They have different kits available all the time.

http://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-16-mid-length-5-56-1-7-premium-rifle-kit.html

The two videos I used.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uZUm3UghtP8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p8sY5CQmlHI

Be careful, these things can be addicting and before you know it you'll have another $500 wrapped up into your $500 AR.

 

[2ski]

I'm at work so I'll watch the videos later. How hard is it to put together a gun? I can field strip my G20, Sig P228 very easily, and I can take down my brother and my Kimber and my Ruger Mark iii Hunter if I have to, but I don't take any of them down to parts ever. I'm a little leary of building an entire gun myself.

As far as the mil-spec vs. commercial spec, the only place this makes a difference is on the stock? Just wanted to make sure, because if I do change things out on whatever I buy I want to make sure I can make changes. One of the first I would make, not right away, would be to put a quad rail so I could mount a tripod on it. And I'm sure eventually I'll change out some other things.

 

[husky390]

When I finished mine, my first thought was "wow, that was easy, why didn't I do this years ago. I want to build another one". The reason I used two videos is one shows a great way of how to assemble one with the channel locks. The only thing I'd do different is wrap both jaws with tape. The second video does a great job of showing what each part looks like and where they go.

If you can disassemble and correctly reassemble a Ruger Mark, you should be good to go. LOL.

You are correct on the mil spec vs. commercial.

However, for the handguard there is three different lengths. Carbine, Mid-length and Rifle due to the length of the gas tube. There are also free floating handguards and the regular drop in style. I run mine with Magpul handguards unless it already came with a better than stock guard. The magpul guards can have a picatinny rail section added if you want to mount a bipod.

 

[Floorguy]

There is alot of misinformation out there partly because if the vast amounts of differing parts. Like contrary to popular belief not all colts are mil-spec look up big hole and small hole recievers. The butt stock is only a portion of what makes an AR milspec. For a long time Colt was the only company with the TDP which would be the spec book it dealt with all the finer details such as metallurgy of parts, exact sizes and how and what parts need to be stress tested and how that tested is to be completed. I believe that the majority of Ruger out are part of the SR line which are all piston operated vs the standard direct gas impingement system on milspec ARs and their clones. Remington are essentially rebarreled Bushmasters. DPMS and Olympic Arms have traditionally been bottom shelf ARs. 1-7 or 1-8 twist is what I would look for, they will allow you to stabilize the heavier bullets and still shoot the 55gr bullets. I prefer not having a chrome lined barrel as it is only there for corrosion resistance and field maintnance and from some things I had read years ago could lead to negative results in accuracy. I would also look into a midweight or fluted barrel over the lightweight,pencil or HBAR's. If going with a a 16 inch barrel I prefer midlength to the carbine length. I am not a fan of 18 inch barrels at least when I was looking there were issues with how they were gassed.

If not buying a factory complete gun I would get a complete lower and mate it to a complete upper. Bravo Co and Rainier Arms are two places that have been know to stock quality parts.

 

[2ski]

So, as far as the piston operated system of the Ruger, does that make it harder to swap out things in the future? If the buffer tube is not mil-spec is it easy to put in a new buffer tube that is mil-spec or are you just SOL?

I have to admit, the idea of building one is growing on me as I sit here thinking about it.

 

[2ski]

When I finished mine, my first thought was "wow, that was easy, why didn't I do this years ago. I want to build another one". The reason I used two videos is one shows a great way of how to assemble one with the channel locks. The only thing I'd do different is wrap both jaws with tape. The second video does a great job of showing what each part looks like and where they go.

If you can disassemble and correctly reassemble a Ruger Mark, you should be good to go. LOL.

You are correct on the mil spec vs. commercial.

However, for the handguard there is three different lengths. Carbine, Mid-length and Rifle due to the length of the gas tube. There are also free floating handguards and the regular drop in style. I run mine with Magpul handguards unless it already came with a better than stock guard. The magpul guards can have a picatinny rail section added if you want to mount a bipod.

I can take down that Mark iii, but I'm not saying a few cuss words don't come out of my mouth. lol

 

[5MilesBack]

So, as far as the piston operated system of the Ruger

The SR556's are piston guns, their AR556's are direct impingement.

 

[mtnwrunner]

All of those are decent AR's. Whatever one you choose, just do it. Before you know it, the prices will go up once again and they will be hard to find once again. Can't have too many
As the old saying goes when asked, "which is your favorite AR?" "The one I'm holding."

Randy

 

[Bagel_7]

I would build one, for the $700 price range you can put together a good AR without a scope. Buy a good trigger and barrel and it will be accurate, the rest of the parts are for looks. There are so many YouTube videos on the subject but look at NSZ85's channel. He gives step by step instructions on putting together the upper and lower, and does a good job of showing you as well as explaining. I was nervous to build my first now I've built 4 or 5.

 

[husky390]

So, as far as the piston operated system of the Ruger, does that make it harder to swap out things in the future? If the buffer tube is not mil-spec is it easy to put in a new buffer tube that is mil-spec or are you just SOL?

I have to admit, the idea of building one is growing on me as I sit here thinking about it.

No need to change the tube, you just need to remember what you have when ordering a new butt stock. Either commercial or mil spec tube.

 

[2ski]

Black Friday sale going on now.

 

[Travis Bertrand]

I'd go mp sport. It's all mil spec besides forward assist to my knowledge. Very important imo.

 

[Floorguy]

I'd go mp sport. It's all mil spec besides forward assist to my knowledge. Very important imo.

The barrel isn't either.

There used to be a chart with the various specs and how each mfg met or differed from the chart. Found one I believe there is a bigger chart with more models.

https://www.google.com/search?q=the...=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=UCuVx-Qv46XDZM:

 

[MattB]

I have an S&W Sport and have been really happy with it. The trigger could use some work, but the accuracy despite that has been really good (~1.5" at 100 yards using a 0x red dot sight - would almost certainly be less than 1" with some magnification). Reliability has been 100%.

 

[2ski]

How do you guys feel about Anderson?

It's amazing all the opinions out there. One gun shop that sells ruger is all about the hard sell and the ruger is mil-spec. Another one is all about info and no pressure and ruger is all proprietary. I have a customer that had built a few and I trust him. He buys from the shop that was all about info. They touted the Andersons.